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Old 05-17-2017, 10:20 PM   #21
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If you have a P.I. EMS I don't think they play well together with the Yamaha. Check before you use them together.
Hope the 2400 works well for your application.
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Old 05-18-2017, 06:16 AM   #22
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Yes, you are correct. They will not play well together due to the detection of the open ground by the EMS. I do have a hardwired EMS so I will be making a ground-neutral plug to resolve that issue. I looked at the progressive Gen-Plug, but would rather save the $20 and make my own since they are so simple to fabricate.

But thanks for the heads up! I'll report back on how the setup works.
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Old 05-18-2017, 11:56 AM   #23
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Yes the neutral ground plug will solve that issue. I was mistakenly thinking of the problem with the Yamaha 2000 at startup with the PI EMS. Something about giving non pure sine waves which voids the EMS warranty. Your 2400 does not have that problem.
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Old 05-18-2017, 12:24 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffnick View Post
So Herk - are you saying that if a hard start capacitor doesn't get the job done, try a second one in parallel with the first?
Couple of things here...

Much better than a "hard start kit" is to add a start capacitor rated for the HP of your compressor and a potential relay. This is a "real" start assist kit/hard start kit.

Supco makes many versions of the Super started deals.. You can check it out for yourself.
Supco

You can overdo the start capacitor... wanna find out how much... you can twist the motor shaft. Seen many times, but usually on low HP compressors. I think the SPP6 is more than you will ever need. It is rated(loosely I am sure) to 10 HP...that is 120,000 BTUs...hello 13.5-15000 BTUs in an RV a/c. Basically if the 10HP unit isn't enough then you need something else.

interesting reading here...

https://highperformancehvac.com/star...c-compressors/
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Old 05-18-2017, 12:52 PM   #25
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Hard Start Capacitor Question

Just remember...

Whether using the MicroAir or cheap hard-start cap, running amps of your air conditioner will remain the same.

Sometimes the solution is both a starting device and more generator.

For me, a second Honda EU2000 allowed me to start-and-run two air conditioners... where one generator wouldn't start just one air conditioner. That second generator was a game changer.
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Old 05-18-2017, 02:20 PM   #26
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Yes, you are correct. They will not play well together due to the detection of the open ground by the EMS. I do have a hardwired EMS so I will be making a ground-neutral plug to resolve that issue. I looked at the progressive Gen-Plug, but would rather save the $20 and make my own since they are so simple to fabricate.

But thanks for the heads up! I'll report back on how the setup works.
Not sure about Yamaha, but my Honda 2000i has a floating ground...each leg produces 60vac. If I connect the neutral and ground it's a direct short. The reverse polarity light will be on because the 'ground' is hot half the time.
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Old 05-23-2017, 09:51 PM   #27
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It took me a bit before I got the Yammy 2400 up and running. I installed an analogue hour meter on it before trying it out. Tonight, I added the oil and a little gas, she fired right up on the first pull. sooooo quiet... definitely on par with a Honda as I expected.

I had looked into break-in procedures for it on the net. What I found called for repetitive cool down and running cycles for short periods of time (a few minutes or under a minute) under various loads for several hours!

Maybe that is the ultimate way to break it in... and thus the generator will live forever because of it ... but since the manual doesn't even recommend a break in period, I wasn't going that extreme. I ran it for a few minutes with no load, then ran it while powering the lights for 5 minutes... then turned on the fan for 10 minutes. I let it cool down for a while, then repeated the process or another 15 minutes. This time I started to run tests with the AC for a bit before shutting it down. Then it got too dark so I let it cool down fully before putting it away for the night.

I figure a few heat cycles are a good idea to help ease into things. I may do a few more tomorrow.... but not several hours of cycles... on the flip-side, I can't imagine running this thing for hours at a time immediately after unboxing is a great idea either.

Ok, so here are the findings of my trails so far:

Running the genny through the EMS threw a code as we would all expect from a non bonded generator, but it wasn't the code E2 or an open ground as I was expecting to see. I received the E9 code for Data Link Down. In searching the net, it seems the E9 code can be caused by the same open/floating ground issue.

Expecting this, I had already fabricated my ground-neutral plug.... after plugging it in to the genny, the EMS granted permission for the power to enter the coach as anticipated. However, the EMS display was registering a PE2 code as it cycled through the display values... That was new to me, so I had to look that one up... so for those that don't know.. the EMS stores the previous error (PE) that occurred before power is restored... so the PE2 code was for the previously detected open ground... even though I initially got E9, not E2.

So, with my plug installed and power to the coach through the EMS, I decided to try some trials with the AC. As recommended, I flipped the breaker for everything but the main and the AC. I ran the fan for a bit... register about 3-4 amps on the display, then switched on the AC. The Genny rev'd but the fan died and AC never kicked on... turns out the EMS didn't like this and shut'er down. Upon restoring power, I got a PE4 code... so I guess the EMS detected low voltage. I assume there was a voltage drop during the delay before the generator reacted to the power demand of the compressor starting. So, as is, I can not start the AC while powered through the EMS... maybe the addition of a delay relay or miro air might fix this.. maybe not.

So I put the EMS into by-pass for the final test.... With only the AC breaker on, I ran the fan for a bit, then flipped on the AC. The genny rev'd up, I saw the overload light flash twice, but ultimately it kept the juice flowing. It wasn't having the easiest time running it shortly after startup, but it didn't go into overload and quit. Given that I was still conducting my break in procedure, I didn't want to tax it for too long, so I shut it down after that.

So, yes... the Yamaha 2400 ran my Mach III on my 2017 Roo with no modifications to the AC system ((((yet)))).... but not through the EMS.... and it was only 65F out.... and even through it ran it, the Yammy didn't sound very happy.

So... a micro air is probably the ultimate way to go if you wanna spend the $$$... but I think a delay relay that starts the compressor first followed by the fan will do the trick. I purchased the SPP6 capacitor, but I'm not sure its totally needed. If the compressor draws too much juice on startup, even with the fan off from the delay relay, then I'll install it. but for now, my plan it to try the delay relay.

That's what I learned tonight. Probably not news to most of you, but hopefully it helps some folks who might be wondering about any of this.
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