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Old 01-08-2016, 11:09 AM   #1
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Questions about ordering a new 233s

The wife and I finally decided to pull the trigger on it this year. Its been something in the works for a number of years now. But then she got pregnant, and we put it off. The next year we decided to get married, and so we again put it off. Last year she got pregnant again.....so we put it off. Barring no life altering events, this is the year we order our new htt. We choose the expandable because it seems like a good compromise and something I can tow without upgrading my TV. Im planning to use my 07' 1500 ram. We've always used tents until now but Ive have pop-ups and a small tt growing up and are familiar with them. My wife has not had the experienced ive had with pop-ups but we did borrow an older Jayco Kiwi from a co-worker last year for a long weekend and she seemed to like it. Even made comments on buying it as he was thinking about selling it because he had since divorced, and his children are grown. Given the size of our family (1 older boy, and 2 girls close in age) we choose the 233s floor plan mainly because it will give everyone their own sleeping space without having to set up and take down the dinette or couch every day.
We haven't decided Roo or Shamrock yet, we're leaning toward the Roo because we like the interior colors more and all the shamrock prints are all butt-ugly. Other than that we really don't have a preferance. We're more or less ready to order, just trying to research the process a little bit so I know what to expect. Ive gotten a hand full of quotes. The best two came from RVWholesalers, and RVOne in Des Moines, IA. Everyone else was several thousand dollars higher. RVWholesalers quoted me a Roo at $20,020. This is a unit with every available option other than the heated tanks, maple cabinets, and thermal windows. RVOne came in at $20,031 for the same unit in a Shamrock, because for whatever reason they cannot get the Roo delivered to their Des Moines location, which is about 90 minutes away from me. The only local RV dealer here in town that carries the Roo/Shamrock is CampingWorld. I have not gotten a quote from them yet but I expect it will be high. There is also Cheyenne camping center not real far but I don't know for sure if they carry the line. I will get a quote from them also. When is all said and done, Im hoping to be under 20K. We'll see.
My questions are centered more around the process in buying. I gather that they take a deposit of usually 10% and you pay the rest or set up financing after the PDI. Will they charge tax, title and license or do I have to pay that on my own? Also I read that you have to sign off on a pre-build checklist before they build the unit. What all is listed on that checklist? My other questions are about the interior color choices. I know you get the choice of three basic color schemes which consist of 2 different colors and a print, but my wife and I have seen a number of variations with the colors and prints on other new campers that we have looked at online. Such as dinette cushions on one unit a solid color and on another they have a print border. Ive seen others with cushions that are solid print with no colors on them. Do you get to pick and choose where each color is used, or is it standardized and you get what you get? The only reason I ask is if we do go with RVOne we will be in a shamrock and we would like to minimize the use of the print as much as possible.
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Old 01-08-2016, 12:26 PM   #2
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Are you sure the pricing at RVW and RV One are straight up front prices and are not contingent on you financing with them or some other BS? My personal history attempting to deal with both RV Wholesalers, and RV one or any of the other Strollo businesses, have not been the greatest experiences and have never ended up with them making a sale. They have both had 3 chances in the last few years with us to make a sale ,and blew it. I'd suggest you look into Labadie RV in Toledo if you're willing to travel to Ohio. Talk with Greg. It won't hurt to get a quote and I bet you'll be surprised. And no I don't work there and did not even buy there. They quoted me almost a grand less than I am paying now but I decided the 6 hour drive for us was not worth the savings. The absolute best price I have seen lately nationwide on the the 233S has been 19999 and that was at Keystone RV Center in Greencastle PA. You have to ask yourself if the savings is worth the traveling. Only you can make that decision.

Anything under 21K on any of the 233 Roo's or Shamrocks with the options you mention is a really good price. If you get under 20K on a 2016 that's an exceptional price, almost an impossible price. I have heard a price increase is coming for the 2017 models in April/May and when that happens its usually $800 to $1000.

The amount of the deposit needed to order is up to the dealer, get everything in writing. Make sure you qualify the deposit so that its refundable should the unit arrive with legitimate issues, so you have a way out. Make the dealer sign the qualification and make sure whoever it is is authorized to sign it. Maybe not the salesman but the GM. I put down about 5%.

The pre build checklist is usually the "Sales MSRP order form". It will list all the options you selected and colors. You will initial it and so will the dealers representative. My dealer used a standard form from Rockwood which shows the actual MSRP numbers and MSRP numbers of the options.

As far as the financing, sometimes great pricing is not so great if you have to use the dealers financing. Its real easy for them to fudge the rates around. Its a numbers game and you need to be prepared to play it. You're 20K you mention could easily be 21K or 22K if the interest is fudged in the dealers favor. You have no way of knowing what their deal is with the banks they use and how much of that interest is coming back to them. They usually have to charge tax, and other fees etc. Sometimes depending on the dealer that could be included in you're overall quote, or it could not. Doesn't matter, you're still the one paying for it. No different than buying a car although interest rates tend to be higher on 20K range campers when you're only financing for 60 or 72. On ours our credit union will go no lower than 8% on any RV. They consider them high risk. The dealer we're working with offered 5.74 @ 60. I am still considering but i haven't found anything better.

GET EVERYTHING IN WRITING IN ADVANCE BEFORE PAYING A DEPOSIT. That's important.

You're not going to get to pick where the colors are used. Look here
2016 Interior Color Options

Now, you can take this for what it is worth. I ordered a 23WS Roo in October, it arrived at the dealer @ Dec 11th. They let me inspect it prior to them doing any of their dealer prep, literally right after they accepted delivery. I found about 20 things I did not like with the build quality and provided them a 25 page emailed list with pictures. (about 4 items are what I consider major issues, one might require them returning it to the factory) They are still working on getting that list rectified and its been about a month, granted they and Rockwood were shutdown over the holidays. I refused to finalize the sale. I have yet to do a formal PDI with systems wet and on real power, so I could still be another month or longer from actually owning the unit. Its not a fast process. I'd advise against buying and taking a unit with any kind of issue where any dealer tells you "take it and then you can return it under warranty". Make them fix it before you buy it. There are going to be things wrong with it....expect it. If you don't think there are any issues you do not know what to look for or you do not want to find them. I sort of anticipated all of it which is why I started this process after our camping season was over in the fall. I had a trade in which I ended up selling privately while this has been evolving. I'd also suggest you order ASAP, the orders from the RV shows will be starting and the plants will be getting busy. Ours took exactly 7 weeks almost to the day to arrive at the dealer. I know people whose orders took 12 to 14 weeks in the busy time of the year which is starting now.

Here is an example of the order form the dealers use.

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Old 01-08-2016, 02:50 PM   #3
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As far as I know, both quotes are not contingent on financing. They are both in writing and neither make any mention of financing. The quote from RV One does list a transportation fee of $995 that was included in the quote. Then they listed that there were no dealer prep fee's. RVWholesalers didn't make mention of any fee's on their quote. Ive bought enough cars to know how the finance game works. I make no mention of it and try to avoid the conversation all together until after the sale. If Im asked straight forward if Im planning to finance through them, I usually reply with a "we'll see how it compares" or something along those lines and I change the subject. As far as Im concerned, financing should have nothing to do with the price you get and any dealer that pushes the issue loses a sale. I personally use my credit union for all my financing. Im at John Deere Employee's credit union and their rates are far and away better than any other ive seen. I was approved for up to 20k, 72 months at 4.99%. My loan officer said she could probably go higher if I needed it with my credit but I have about 5K set aside so I don't have to finance 100%. I will entertain the dealers offers, but I doubt they'll be able to beat it. And even if they do, a few dollars wouldn't be worth the convenience id be losing by not using my own credit union. My checks are already direct deposited there, I pay my loans weekly and payment comes out on payday. I never have to deal with making payments. I used dealer financing once, when I bought my wifes 2012 Rouge at 3.75% I ended up refinancing it with Deere at 1.75%, after I became a member.


Ive read a lot of good things and bad things about both dealerships. I haven't dealt with either of them enough to form an opinion of my own. I can certainly ask for another quote from Labadie RV. Im already planning to get at least 2 more before I commit to buy. But Im not worried about any dealer I go through. I know the games they play and Ive never been afraid to walk away from a bad deal, and I think ordering new, and not having the RV sitting right in front of you will make it that much easier to do. All I need the dealer for beside the actual sale is any warrantee work that may come up. And if it's not covered under warrantee, I'll fix it myself.


I hadn't realized the prices have come up so much the last couple of years. Like I said, we've been looking at these off and on for a number of years but something always seemed to come up. The last I looked into them before recently, they seemed to be going from 17.5k-19k. So I figured under 20k was totally doable. But as far as buying new, a lot of it comes down to what dealership you go through. The more volume they do, the more wiggle room there is on that price. But I can live with 20's. That's not going to break the bank.


We've looked at the color choices before and have seen how they were labeled as far as what went where, but like I said, we've also seen a lot of variations of those same colors in otherwise identical units as far as the placement of the prints and which colors were used for the couch and dinette. I didn't know if you had any options as far as placement when you went through the pre-build sheet.


If I buy locally, I know Iowa does not charge a sales tax, but rather a 1 time registration fee of 5% on auto's and RV's. Then the annual registration on RV's is $.30 per square foot of livable space or something like that. I just didn't know how that worked if I bought out of state, like Ohio. Will I pay sales tax just to take it home and have to pay a 1 time 5% registration fee on top of it?


Im in no hurry to get it. We don't have our first outing planned until June when the kids are out of school, but other than that its up in the air. It would be nice to have it by April for spring turkey hunting. My boy and I hunt land that used to contain a number of cabins but were flooded out in 2008. There is still electric and running water available but most of the cabins are inhabitable. We usually make the drive back and forth every day we hunt but taking the camper and making a weekend of it would be nice.
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Old 01-08-2016, 03:20 PM   #4
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I won't go into particulars but every time I would get the quote sent to me from those guys and once we tried to take the process further, something would suddenly need to be changed. It was we forgot to mention, or that's contingent on, or we failed to mention........ I have no patience for any of that crap. There was just a post here a few weeks back, where the gentleman was picking up his new MH and lo and behold the quoted (in writing) rate could not be provided all of a sudden. The prime rate had went up that 1/4 point since the unit was ordered. I would have argued the dealer can take that out of his kickback on the financing. I would of walked out. That crap is not for me.

Sometimes its easier if its an "in stock" unit. You can take your time and go over it at your leisure. You know what you're getting. Believe me, you're gambling by ordering and may get a surprise when it shows up. I did. They have been known to change things on a whim. Say they run out of brown sofas, you might get a gray one. Those kinds of things have happened, hence the disclaimers they all have regarding specifications changing. That's why you need to qualify any deposits.


Your right, just a couple of years back you could get about any 23' hybrid made for 18/19K, certainly less than 20K. Just sold a 2013 Keystone Passport 235 which was similar to a Roo 23SS, that I paid 17K for new in 2012. You won't find those prices now.
20K is doable I think. I could of done the 19995 with the Shamrock and the only reason I didn't because I know the unit was at the Hershey show and it took all that traffic. I'm below 21K and ordered it about the same way you mentioned, even with the 15K air. No SS appliances or gas grill.

If you want it for June, I would think you need to be ordering by the end of January to be safe.

Good luck
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Old 01-08-2016, 04:05 PM   #5
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We discussed looking for an in stock unit and unfortunately, no dealers in our area has any on hand with the exception of RV One in Des Moines. They have a 2015 Shamrock, old stock on sale for 18,000. The salesman I spoke to getting the quote was trying to push it on me and I responded by saying the unit is plain, lacking most of the options we were wanting and only priced 2k cheaper than brand new, fully loaded. She agreed with me that it would take far more than 2k to add the missing options and we would still be left with a 1 model yr old unit. I told her it would be worth my while for more around 15k and she quickly changed the subject.


Ive seen a hand full of 233s I wouldn't mind looking at in person. Saw a really nice one at House of Camping near Chicago, but its been my experience that If you have to travel real far to look and the dealer knows it then they are far less likely to work with you on price. They know you've come a distance and would rather not leave empty handed. Car dealers anyway, I don't imagine Rv dealers are much different. If I have to travel more than 2 hrs. to look at a unit on a lot then I usually wont bother with it. Im willing to drive to RVOne in Des moines as its only about an hour and a half away. The quote from RV wholesalers is more of a baseline price that I can show a local dealer to get a better price. Driving to Ohio probably wouldn't be worth it unless I was saving several thousand dollars. We're pretty much waiting for the RV show at the Uni-Dome to look around before we decide to buy. So it will be close to the end of January, maybe early feb.
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Old 01-08-2016, 05:34 PM   #6
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Finster:

I've bought all 3 of my RV's from Roskopfs RV in Richfield WI. 4-1/2 hrs, 265 mi from you (closer than Ohio), per Mapquest.

I believe I got good deals (paid cash each time). Traded in the Roo 19 for the Mini Lite.

They have a Roo 233S in stock, $22,750. Don't know if they'll come down at all:

Roskopf's RV Center ltd. - 1 2016 Rockwood Roo 233S - Richfield, Wisconsin | RVT.com

I'm sure they'd order one for you, too. I ordered my Mini Lite in Feb 2015, put $1000 down, as I recall; might have been only $500.

For what it's worth.
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Old 01-08-2016, 05:56 PM   #7
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Our last hybrid came from Haylett RV in Michigan......our BEST experience so far !
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Old 01-08-2016, 08:59 PM   #8
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We bought our 23SS from House of Camping. Drove 4000 miles RT to get it because they had the exact model we wanted, for the cheapest price.
We checked with FR first, for local dealers willing to do the warranty work.
HOC were great to work with. Highly recommend them.
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Old 01-09-2016, 08:25 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rockfordroo View Post
Finster:

I've bought all 3 of my RV's from Roskopfs RV in Richfield WI. 4-1/2 hrs, 265 mi from you (closer than Ohio), per Mapquest.

I believe I got good deals (paid cash each time). Traded in the Roo 19 for the Mini Lite.

They have a Roo 233S in stock, $22,750. Don't know if they'll come down at all:

Roskopf's RV Center ltd. - 1 2016 Rockwood Roo 233S - Richfield, Wisconsin | RVT.com

I'm sure they'd order one for you, too. I ordered my Mini Lite in Feb 2015, put $1000 down, as I recall; might have been only $500.

For what it's worth.
I see a lot of dealers ordering units this way though, they tend to leave out little things. They ask for almost 23K yet it does not have a slide topper, nightshades, upgraded wood look floor, probably not the 15 AC

They should be able to come off that number. I'd call them and tell them I have other quotes for 20K and see what they say. If they bite I would then make the 265 mile trip there. Then I would point out the fact your quote had the options this unit does not, and try and squeeze another $800 or so out of them. That may be your unit! You could get them to add the nightshades, topper and AC but you would be stuck with the standard floor.

What it comes down to is if they, or any other dealer for that matter, will come off a number. I have a different philosophy about pricing and do not buy into any of the west coast is higher, other side of the river BS. If dealer A in New York can sell trailer X for 20K and turn a profit, dealer B in Arizona can also sell trailer X for 20K and turn a profit. The only difference is the transport cost is more to dealer B and I would expect that to come into play but its hundreds and not thousands.

The only thing I have to go by that's current is my pricing for the 23WS with almost all the options, and I have 9 quotes from MI to VA and up to NY to back it up. If you look at the MSRP on the form I posted, the 23WS is actually a little higher than the 233S by around $500. The quotes I received went from a low of $19999 to a high of $24999 comparing apples to apples. The 20K 233S is out there and the lower than 20K one might be out there too. You just need to find it.
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Old 01-09-2016, 08:45 AM   #10
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My last two came from CW in Myrtle Beach, they are the largest RV dealer in the state selling more than 1200 units annually. Prices were great. I know they handle FR products. I don't deal with sales but with the internet manager, Sean. Yes, they have a delivery fee and PDI charge but bottom line has been great. Any or no finance makes no difference and I financed there in Dec for much less than 4.99 through BoA. Some perks are tossed in like a 3 year GS Elite membership a a couple others.
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