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Old 04-07-2011, 11:16 AM   #1
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Gvwr???

In the process of researching fifth wheel's I am getting more confused about these weights. I know some of you will say you have to weigh everything to get the accurate weights. But if you do not have everything you cannot weigh them. This means you cannot weigh everything untilt you buy and you cannot buy until you check the weights. It is like the adage "which came first the chicken or the egg".

In comparing several models there are some with lower dry hitch weights, but higher GVWR. For example the Wildwood 24RLS has a hitch weight of 1,150 lbs., a dry weight of 6,660 lbs and a GVWR of 8,150 with a cargo capacity of 1,455. To compare there is a Extralite 24RLX with a hitch weight of 930 (-220 difference), a dry weight of 6,949 (+289), GVWR of 11,090 (+ 2,940) and a cargo capacity of 4,141 (+2,686).

So wouldn't the GVWR come down on the Extralite if I was only had only the weight of 1,455 added (same as Wildwood 24RLS) to 8,404. This comparision would also have the same amounts of water in the tanks and the propane.
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Old 04-07-2011, 11:27 AM   #2
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GVWR is Gross Vehicle Weight Rating. The max is can be loaded with all your stuff in it.

Think of it like a bucket. You can put 5 gallons of water in a 5 gallon bucket, but you don't have to. If you only put in 3 gallons you've not changed what it can hold, only what it's holding now.

GVWR is something to consider regarding your tow vehicle. Can it tow a fully loaded trailer?
The cargo capacity weight is what it can carry - including water, sewage, batteries and propane. IMO 1400 lbs is very little cargo capacity when those things can eat up 500lbs. So how much stuff do you carry when camping? If you're new to camping then yes, that's gonna be a hard guess.

We're moving from a very small pop to a 28' TT and I know we never carried much, wt wise, and I know that's gonna change big time. We never had the room and now we will, we'll be camping longer so need more clothing/towels/sheets/food/water, etc.
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Old 04-07-2011, 12:39 PM   #3
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I'm not sure of what your question is but are you assuming that the two trailers have the same axles? In looking at the specs I notice that the pin weight on the 241RLX seems to be awfully light. Hope this helps.
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Old 04-07-2011, 01:47 PM   #4
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I'm not sure of what your question is but are you assuming that the two trailers have the same axles? In looking at the specs I notice that the pin weight on the 241RLX seems to be awfully light. Hope this helps.
That is what I thought at first, but is it right or wrong?
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Old 04-07-2011, 01:49 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by prof_fate View Post
GVWR is Gross Vehicle Weight Rating. The max is can be loaded with all your stuff in it.

Think of it like a bucket. You can put 5 gallons of water in a 5 gallon bucket, but you don't have to. If you only put in 3 gallons you've not changed what it can hold, only what it's holding now.

GVWR is something to consider regarding your tow vehicle. Can it tow a fully loaded trailer?
The cargo capacity weight is what it can carry - including water, sewage, batteries and propane. IMO 1400 lbs is very little cargo capacity when those things can eat up 500lbs. So how much stuff do you carry when camping? If you're new to camping then yes, that's gonna be a hard guess.

We're moving from a very small pop to a 28' TT and I know we never carried much, wt wise, and I know that's gonna change big time. We never had the room and now we will, we'll be camping longer so need more clothing/towels/sheets/food/water, etc.
Being it is only two of us I could not see we would pack that much. I need to figure out some way to get an estimate of everything. This would include towels, dishes, cookware, clothes, folding chairs, etc.

Is there a calculator or chart somewhere on these forums that may have this info?
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Old 04-07-2011, 01:52 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by dimurrrw View Post
I'm not sure of what your question is but are you assuming that the two trailers have the same axles? In looking at the specs I notice that the pin weight on the 241RLX seems to be awfully light. Hope this helps.


Could you explain a little about the pin weigh and how it could make a difference? This is something new to me and I would love to have some understanding of it.

Thanks,
T.
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Old 04-07-2011, 02:03 PM   #7
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Pin Weight is like tounge weight - this weight is carried on the truck and added to it's cargo carrying capacity to figure to make sure you've not exceeded the truck's GVWR.

You also need to consider the rear axle rating of your truck too as all this pin weight is right over the axle.

If there is a calculator that would be great! I hope there is...

With my truck/trailer I'll be close to GCWR - gross combined weight rating, teh total weight of everything rolling down the road. 5500 lb truck (gonna weight it as options such as tires/wheels can add 200lbs!), gas (250#), 700# of people/pets, 60# of hitch, 5400 lb of empty trailer, 120# of propane/battery...11750. My truck is rated at 12,500. Now we've got wheel chocks and leveling wood to throw in there, and others 'needs' just to set up - 75#? Towels, sheets, cleaning supplies, 10#? Food? Beer? Coffee pot? Water can add 400# but we'll rarely if ever haul that. And I'm betting my truck is closer to 5800lbs as it's loaded (power everything, running boards, etc).

I think we'll be fine but all the research I did ahead of time didn't show my how the specific truck and options affected what it can tow. GCWR can swing, 1000, 1500 lbs and that info is buried in the owners manual, not anywhere online.
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Old 04-07-2011, 02:08 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by dimurrrw View Post
I'm not sure of what your question is but are you assuming that the two trailers have the same axles? In looking at the specs I notice that the pin weight on the 241RLX seems to be awfully light. Hope this helps.
Not being a 5th wheeler I don't know the specifics of such trailers, but I'd imagine the diff is from where the cargo can go - if the water tanks are in front the axles then that would/could increase pin weight a lot in one trailer, and if behind the axles lower it on another (from leverage).

A TT is somewhat easier, I would think, to 'balance' and easier to weight (drop it so the tounge jack in a scale). If you have a pin jack/stand then I guess you could do that with a 5r...and I'm guessing the pin weight is more important to know/manage as you don't want to exceed your rear GAWR.
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Old 04-07-2011, 03:10 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terier View Post

Could you explain a little about the pin weigh and how it could make a difference? This is something new to me and I would love to have some understanding of it.

Thanks,
T.
I'm not a fiver person so my understanding is somewhat limited. Having said that, I believe that most fivers have a pin weight between 15 and 20 percent. This percentage can be affected by how the trailer is loaded. Pin weight also affects stability when towing. Wander through this post on rv.net. I think find will find answers to a lot of your questions.
RV.Net Open Roads Forum: What is the optimal pin weight PERCENTAGE of trailer weight?
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Old 04-07-2011, 03:54 PM   #10
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From what I understand, the GVWR of the camper is the hitch weight plus the weight rating of the axles. The same trailer, with heavier axles would have a higher GVWR.
Ours has a pin weight of about 1400 lbs, and 2x4000 lb axles, for a GVWR of 9400 lbs, more or less.
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