8281WS Sewer Mod - Connecting Galley drain to Front Drain

[leefl]

I just recently finished my mod to connect the galley drain, which is under the main slide-out, and thus awkward to access, to the front bathroom black/gray tank drain.
The 8281WS has 3 drain connectors (4 tanks/4 valves) as standard, and the middle one is particular awkwardly placed, so I decided to do something about it.
Hopefully this write-up will help others.

This photo shows the original setup of the front and middle drains, but what you can't really tell from the photo is that the right-hand of those 2 drains is under the big slide-out:


I discussed some of my plans in a separate thread [url="http://www.forestriverforums.com/forums/f217/plumbing-kitchen-gray-tank-drain-into-front-black-gray-drain-105845.html"]here[\url]
I was originally considering just moving the dump valve from the original location to near the Tee-piece shown in the sketch in that thread, but was a little concerned about the weight of water always sitting in the new pipe, so I decided to go with a double-valve setup: A new cable-release valve in place of the original valve to let the water from the tank into the new pipe, and another valve near the Tee-piece to both let the water out the drain, and to also keep the other tanks from back-washing into the new pipe when dumping them.

Before continuing with my walk-through, here's my shopping list, including pricing: -

Amazon: -
Nibco 5811 ABS DWV 3" Tee - $6.53
Valterra T1005 3" Slip Hub Flange - $6.39
Valterra T1006 3" Spigot Flange - $7.04
Valterra T1029-1 3" Bayonet x 3" Spigot Termination Adapter - $6.90
[url="http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002N5LA04"]Valtera T1035-1 90degree elbow Slip Hub x 3" Rotating Flange[\url] - $13.69
Nibco 5801 3" Hub coupling - $1.83
Valterra T1003-9VP 3" Valve Seal with Hardware - $7.34
Oatey 30999 ABS Medium Cement, Black 4-ounce - $3.55


Jet.com: -
(The valve was also available on Amazon, but with discounts was cheaper here): -

Mueller Industries APCG30010 Pipe, 3" x 10 Ft ABS - $23.72
http://="https://jet.com/product/pro... with 3" Valve - $55.19

Lowes: -
3" Pipe Hanger Iron x 2 - $1.85 ea
2x 1/4"-20 x 2.5" hex bolts
2x 1/4" Flange washers
2x 1/4"-20 nylock stop nuts

Total cost was around $135



So, here we go: -

First thing I did was to remove the old dump valve from the kitchen drain.
This is a simple matter of removing 4 bolts/nuts


The Kitchen drain with the valve removed

Keep hold of the old drain valve, you'll need it, but throw away the old valve seals since you'll want to replace them anyway


The original kitchen drain valve, which will be re-used

This is the Valterra cable-release valve, which I used to replace the original valve:


Next I test-fitted the new valve and the 90 degree elbow with Flange fitting: -

Note that this was just a test fitting, and I removed this later before final assembly.

The next step was to cut off the old bayonet fitting from the front bathroom drain. This was the scariest point of the whole operation, since it's the point of no return. I just used a hacksaw and cut upwards.
You'll want to keep the cut as close to the back of the bayonet fitting as possible, to ensure that there is space behind for glueing a new fitting.
Note that there was a strap around the pipe which I'd removed first


Cutting off the old bayonet connector from the front bathroom black/gray tank drain


The removed bayonet connector


The Front bathroom black/gray tank drain pipe, after removing the old bayonet fitting (before cleaning/de-burring)

Next I test-fitted the entire assembly, and that's when I realized that, without twisting the whole assembly (and thus guaranteeing a bad fit) that I'd need a coupler to form an extension between the old pipe and the Tee.


Cleaned up front drain, showing the gap between the Tee piece (test fitted to pipe at other end) if I didn't use a 3" straight coupler

I thus needed to buy the 3" coupler, which was not part of my original parts list (since I'd obviously made a mistake in measurements), which put completion on hold for a couple of days (since no stores here stock ABS fittings)

To be continued ...
(since there's a 10 image per post limit apparently)

[leefl]

Once I had the coupler fitting everything could continue again: -


The front drain with the straight coupler fitted (and glued)

I then cut a short length of the pipe (about 4" iirc), just long enough to fit into the coupler, and into the end of the Tee connector, to connect the two together.
I glued the piece of pipe into the coupler first, and gave it time to (mostly) set.
I then test-fitted the rest of the assembly again to ensure that I would get the angle of the Tee fitting correct before glueing it. I used a piece of blue masking tape to cross the join between the coupler and tee piece when at the right angle, and then split the tape, leaving both halves in place, so I could easily re-align when glueing.
I then glued and fitted the Tee piece onto the short pipe, butting it up against the coupler. (remember to ensure that you have the Tee fitting the right way around, so that the internal curve from the side of the Tee flows towards the outlet, rather than back towards the front tanks).
Remember to hold the assembly together while it sets, to ensure that the tee and coupler don't move apart while setting.

I then test-assembled the old re-used valve assembly, with the spigot-flange and slip-hub-flange to ensure that I could get the flange at a suitable angle to ensure that the valve would not interfere with the slideout.


The original galley drain valve, test fitted with the 3" slip-hub and spigot flange fittings (the spigot fitting will fit into the tee piece, the slip hub will accept the end of the straight pipe)

I test-fitted the spigot-flange side of the valve assembly into the side of the Tee, and marked the angle of the flange to ensure good clearance.

I then removed the spigot-flange connector from the valve, and glued and fitted into the side of the Tee fitting, and then glued and fitted the spigot-to-bayonet fitting into the outlet of the Tee


The Tee connected mounted and glued (to a short length of pipe fitting into the straight coupler), with the bayonet fitting glued into the end, and the 3" spigot-flange connector.
Note the deliberate angle of the flange fitting, to ensure that the re-used valve does not interfere with the slide-out.

I used this opportunity, while the glue set harder, to install the cable-release assembly.
I made my own bracket out of some scrap drilled steel strap that I had left over (rather than using the one they supplied with is designed to bolt to an RV side-wall), and I bolted it to the side of my sewer storage mod (using one of the existing bolts). You can see it to the left of the picture below, with the existing front-tank drain valve handles in the foreground.


The cable release for the new Valterra valve.
I do still need to paint the bracket to stop it rusting.

I did have to trim a few inches of the cable, which is VERY tough to cut through.
I would've used my Dremel, but I'd accidentally left the cut-off disc mandrel at home in the garage, but I eventually managed to cut through it with some tough wire cutters (which took a beating from it). Read the instructions supplied with the kit carefully ! (you need to slide the inner cable out of the outer sheeth when cutting the outer sheeth).
I secured the cable to the underbelly, using a couple of existing screws and some of those Mounting cable ties (Lowe's item # 292686)


The cable attached to the new valve

Once the existing assembly had set sufficiently I re-fitting the re-used valve to the now glued flange, and re-measured and cut the pipe to length (from the inside of the hub-flange fitting to the inside of the elbow fitting.

I test-fitted those parts, and made sure that I had alignment marks so that I could have the flange at the correct angle to match the angle of the other flange and valve, and also put the Pipe Hangers over the pipe, though this could've been done later. (I had first straightened the pipe hanger straps, since they normally have a 90deg twist in the strap)

I removed the elbow from the cable-release valve assembly (which is a little tricky to disassemble and re-assemble, due to the way that the cable assembly clips over the flange fittings), and glued the hub-flange fitting to one end of the pipe, and the elbow to the other end (being extra careful to ensure the angles were correct as previously noted).

Once those two fittings were adequately set (I allowed 30 mins before handling), I re-assembled the entire thing, getting the elbow flange into the cable-release valve first, while supporting the other end, before then bolting the flange/valve assemblies together.


The final completed installation. The silver bands are the 3" pipe hangers

I worked out where to bolt the hanger straps to the chassis, being sure to avoid interfering with the slide-out mechanism, and cut the straps to length with the dremel (which I now had with me).
I then drilled new 1/4" holes in the straps, and up through the chassis frame, and secured them with 1/4"-20 x 2.5" bolts, going in from the bottom, with flange washers, and then nylock nuts on the top side.

I fill-tested it 2 days later (having driven to the dealership and back, about 50 miles round trip, over rough road-works, for unrelated work).

I filled the kitchen/galley tank by using a garden hose into the kitchen sink.
I then opened the new cable-release valve letting the water fill the new pipe, but with the other valve closed. Thus putting the pressure of a full gray tank onto the new pipe, and the fittings as far as the re-used valve. No Leaks !

I then opened the other valve, but left the cap on the bayonet connector. Again, no leaks !

I then drained the kitchen tank slowly, and periodically checked for leaks. All was good.


I hope this post is helpful to someone, and inspires others to do some mods that help with getting rid of those annoyances/inconveniences.

[leefl]

One extra small note, is to make sure to use the specific ABS glue/solvent (not available in stores down here), and to follow the instructions on it carefully, being sure to be quick in applying/assembling.
Trying to be quick can be messy tho'.

1 tin only just sufficed, and I was worried that I was going to run out. There was a little left in the end, but it was starting to dry up a little, and the last bit can be tricky to get out with the applicator.

[jheacox1]

Well done. Thanks for the info!

2015 Rockwood Signature Ultra Lite 8281WS
2015 F250 Crew Cab

[wicked1]

Leefl, I give you a lot of credit that is some task, just wish the MFG's would do some real world testing on their setups to see their ideas are not always the best


2016 F350 SCREW SB 6.7 PS Diesel
2015 FR Rockwood Roo 23IKSS

[leefl]

Originally Posted by wicked1

Leefl, I give you a lot of credit that is some task, just wish the MFG's would do some real world testing on their setups to see their ideas are not always the best

Yeah, seriously, it would've been pretty easy for them to connect the tanks together to have at most 2 drain connectors.
They already connected the front black and gray tanks dumps together, and could've done the same either connecting like I did (likely above the underside cover though) or could've connected the kitchen tank to the rear black tank.
I chose to connect to the front dump connector since I can then have that normally hooked up, and only switch over to dump the rear tank when packing up, since that doesn't get anywhere near as full and will rarely need dumping mid-stay

[NavigatorC130A]

First off - I love the mod. We are new owners of a 2013 unit identical to yours. I have a hard time understanding why FR didn't do this in the first place.
Anyways - what an I missing? What is the reason for having 2 valves in the line from the kitchen gray water tank?? cable valve and reused valve?? Why not just have the cable valve?

[DSMURPHY]

I had to do a similar mode to the 3008w Windjammer we had. The galley tank was under slide about 9-10' from main dump valves. I was either using a "wye" with extra hose or backing the trailer to dump the tank.
I was able to extend the valve over the axle and re-install the valve next to the main dump valve. One of the best modes I ever did.

[wicked1]

I think sometimes they cut corners to push units out faster with the least amount of cost. I believe they also know a lot of ppl will fix or modify their trailers so the cost of us fixing them or their re-engineering costs, makes it easy for them robot correct issues minor or major? I worked for GM and tried to understand why they did what they did at the factory plant as well?


2016 F350 SCREW SB 6.7 PS Diesel
2015 FR Rockwood Roo 23IKSS

[DreiHunde]

Awesome upgrade and post!!!

[leefl]

Originally Posted by NavigatorC130A

First off - I love the mod. We are new owners of a 2013 unit identical to yours. I have a hard time understanding why FR didn't do this in the first place.
Anyways - what an I missing? What is the reason for having 2 valves in the line from the kitchen gray water tank?? cable valve and reused valve?? Why not just have the cable valve?

Originally I was just going to reuse the existing valve where I now have it, near the tee, but I was concerned about having the weight/pressure of water in the new pipe while traveling.
I then considered just adding the new cable release valve to avoid that weight, but was concerned that if there wasn't a valve near the tee that the black tank water might backwash into the new pipe and sit there (if not ready to flush the kitchen tank immediately after the black tank).
Since I had the old valve ready to use, and only needed to add a couple of flange connectors, I decided to do both and prevent both the weight of water in the pipe while traveling, and prevent any backwash.
Pulling two handles to dump really isn't any inconvenience.
You could certainly do without the reused valve, but having two sets of flange fittings made it easier to do final assembly too.

[Iwannacamp]

I think the instructions are a little "weak".

Hello. Just kidding. Did you write instruction manuals for NASA or something?

Great job!

[leefl]

Originally Posted by Iwannacamp

I think the instructions are a little "weak".

Hello. Just kidding. Did you write instruction manuals for NASA or something?

Great job!

Haha, not exactly, but I did work for Rockwell many many years ago, including some govt work, with very strict process documentation requirements
(creating prototypes of new equipment and then having to write-up documentation on how to make a production ready version)

Thanks

[mstell2]

I did similar thing to mine, makes it a whole lot better to dump.


Sent from my iPhone using Forest River Forums

[leefl]

Originally Posted by mstell2

I did similar thing to mine, makes it a whole lot better to dump.

Excellent! Nice work