What's the skinny on using sealed batteries?

[myredracer]

Am pondering going to a sealed type battery and don't know anything about using them in an RV. I know you need a deep cycle type but what's the story on using golf cart ones and what about the "AGM" type? Same thing or what?

We will never do dry camping as we have a campground membership and enjoy having full services. Would we need around 70AH or can we get away with less? I am going to install LED bulbs everywhere which will lower the draw on the battery. These batteries aren't cheap and if a lower AH rating will work, it would save $$.

I am also wondering if a sealed battery can be installed inside our TT in an out of the way spot as long as I can get the wiring to it? Is it perfectly okay to have one of these batteries on it's side?

Any suggestions on brands for either quality or lower price or where to get the best pricing?

Thanks!

[TURBS]

Originally Posted by myredracer

Am pondering going to a sealed type battery and don't know anything about using them in an RV. I know you need a deep cycle type but what's the story on using golf cart ones and what about the "AGM" type? Same thing or what?

We will never do dry camping as we have a campground membership and enjoy having full services. Would we need around 70AH or can we get away with less? I am going to install LED bulbs everywhere which will lower the draw on the battery. These batteries aren't cheap and if a lower AH rating will work, it would save $$.

I am also wondering if a sealed battery can be installed inside our TT in an out of the way spot as long as I can get the wiring to it? Is it perfectly okay to have one of these batteries on it's side?

Any suggestions on brands for either quality or lower price or where to get the best pricing?

Thanks!

If your always going to have full hook ups
There's no real big need for "special" batteries or multiples.
If you need a new battery just buy another of what you already have.

You definitely don't need golf cart batteries or agm's

You only need multiples or the batteries you speak of if camping without shore power

Turbs

[myredracer]

The only reason I thought of doing this is because I'd like to be able to install a tongue storage box and not have to worry about venting and corrosion or the loss of space inside the box. I'm looking at a nice little spot adjacent to the panel which allow an easy connection of the wires. If I were to go with a smaller AH sealed battery, it would take up less space inside the storage box or I could possibly mount it below and/or to the rear of the storage box.

I'm wondering if a small sealed battery in the 30 - 40 AH would suffice. It would save weight too I guess. The only time our batteries get used is when we are travelling and we are not plugged into AC at home or cg so our batteries get very little draw.

Also, is the standard charger okay for a sealed type battery?

[Herk7769]

Sealed batteries are not really "sealed"; they just have much smaller vents.

Due to the way the electrolyte is suspended in a "glass mat" (AGM) or Jelly (GEL type), hydrogen and oxygen generation due to the charging process is greatly reduced (but not eliminated).

Sealed batteries should still be in a vented compartment.

[myredracer]

I phoned a battery shop and they sell one that is called an SLA type. Seems to be short for sealed lead acid. Not sure if an SLA type is different than an AGM type? They told me that golf cart batteries are only 6 volt, so two would be required.

Yes, I now understand that a sealed type still needs to be vented. And although they *could* be mounted on the side, it is recommended that they are mounted in the normal upright position.

Checked on ebay and am confused by the number of listings and descriptions plus they seem expensive on ebay. Our local battery shop has 70AH SLA ones for $190.

If I were to install an SLA or AGM battery inside an aluminum tongue box, does anyone know if it would have to be vented and inside a plastic battery box like a normal lead acid battery or could it be open inside the box?

It's starting to sound like maybe a sealed battery is not really the advantage I thought it would be.

[VinceU]

Originally Posted by myredracer

I phoned a battery shop and they sell one that is called an SLA type. Seems to be short for sealed lead acid. Not sure if an SLA type is different than an AGM type? They told me that golf cart batteries are only 6 volt, so two would be required.

Yes, I now understand that a sealed type still needs to be vented. And although they *could* be mounted on the side, it is recommended that they are mounted in the normal upright position.

Checked on ebay and am confused by the number of listings and descriptions plus they seem expensive on ebay. Our local battery shop has 70AH SLA ones for $190.

If I were to install an SLA or AGM battery inside an aluminum tongue box, does anyone know if it would have to be vented and inside a plastic battery box like a normal lead acid battery or could it be open inside the box?

It's starting to sound like maybe a sealed battery is not really the advantage I thought it would be.

We used Gel Cel batteries for backup power supplies, onboard ships. I remember they need no maintenance, none, and last a good length of time. Mount in any position! I just checked, 200 for 50 AH, plenty for what you want. Primary use for your app. Would filter shore power from converter for flat 13.2 voltt for coach. Look up Gel Cel for multiple sites. No gas, no fuss.

[garbonz]

A gel cell or AGM are pretty equivalent for your use and they do not need to be vented or checked for fluid.

Many boatowners have these batteries belowdecks in compartments.

Any 12 v gel or AGM will do fine.

[Herk7769]

This is what I have found on this topic.

It is recommended reading before you spend your money.

AGM Batteries are not completely sealed as they would explode if taken to altitude. They are "valve regulated" and vent gases both into and out of the battery. They vent small amounts of Hydrogen and Oxygen as the electricity is used and replaced.

[VinceU]

Here's what I was refering to, same Church, different pew. Gel cells work as advertised, never dealt with AGM, more expensive. Becoming popular in RV construction (AGM). Gel been around a long time.




"AGM batteries differ from flooded lead acid batteries in that the electrolyte is held in the glass mats, as opposed to freely flooding the plates. Very thin glass fibers are woven into a mat to increase surface area enough to hold sufficient electrolyte on the cells for their lifetime. The fibers that compose the fine glass mat do not absorb nor are affected by the acidic electrolyte. These mats are wrung out 2–5% after being soaked in acids, prior to manufacture completion and sealing.
The plates in an AGM battery may be any shape. Some are flat, others are bent or rolled. AGM batteries, both deep cycle and starting, are built in a rectangular case to BCI battery code specifications.


A gel battery (also known as a "gel cell") is a VRLA battery with a gelified electrolyte; the sulfuric acid is mixed with silica fume, which makes the resulting mass gel-like and immobile. Unlike a flooded wet-cell lead-acid battery, these batteries do not need to be kept upright. Gel batteries reduce the electrolyte evaporation, spillage (and subsequent corrosion issues) common to the wet-cell battery, and boast greater resistance to extreme temperatures, shock, and vibration. Chemically they are almost the same as wet (non-sealed) batteries except that the antimony in the lead plates is replaced by calcium, and gas recombination can take place.
The modern gel formulation and large scale production was from Otto Jache's and Heinz Schroeder's <US Patent 4,414,302> assigned to the German Co. Accumulatorenfabrik Sonnenschein GmbH. With gel electrolyte the separator was no longer such a critical, hard-to-make component, and cycle life was increased, in some cases dramatically. With gel electrolyte, shedding of active material from the plates was reduced.
More importantly, real gas recombination was used to make batteries that were not "watered" and could be called maintenance-free. The one-way valves were set at 2 psi, and this was high enough to have full recombination take place. At the end of charge when oxygen was evolved from overcharge on the positive plate it traveled through the shrink cracks in the gel directly to the negative plate made from high surface area pure lead and "burned" up as fast as it was made. This oxygen gas and the hydrogen adsorbed on the surface of the sponge lead metal negative plate combined to make water that was retained in the cell." Feom Wik

[garbonz]

Like I said, the Gels can be used with minimum or no ventilation they do not produce gas unless overcharged, which is a bad situation for ANY battery, and the regular lead acid flooded cells will corrode everything in sight.

A box with a small gel or AGM will do fine.

I have used the Gel's on my sailboat for MANY years as do many others without incident.

They have SLA's in UPC, sitting in offices for heavens sake.

[10x]

The main reason to use gel is if you have a dirtbike or jetski, etc. In other words vehicles that bounce around alot. If you had a acid filled you would have a mess on your hands because the acid would spill out of the battery. Gels are not needed for RV purposes unless you intend to drive through craters.

[RPAspey]

something else to think about is the factory type converter-charger will likely overcharge a gel or agm type battery. There is a difference in charging voltages that may cause a simple converter-charger to overcharge those batteries.

A sealed lead-acid battery will work, as long as it isn't overcharged thereby venting the excess gases. BTW, the valves on most sealed lead-acid batteries vent around +/- 2-5 psi. We use all kinds at work, most under 35AHr, and a majority are on their sides. The major reasons they fail..overcharging and completely draining them.

[myredracer]

I am currently looking at an Optima Blue Top battery. Not sure of size, but they are available in 55, 66 & 75AH. They are supposed to be completely spill-proof and able to be mounted in any position. On the plus side, they can sit unused for up to a year, last twice as long as an ordinary battery and are 15 times more vibration resistant. On the downside, they are in the range of $200 - $300. And the only hold-downs I've found so far are like $100 or so!

Do these particular batteries have the potential for off-gassing if they can supposedly be mounted in any position?

One thing I learned is that many sellers, including Amazon, are not authorized dealers and typically only provide a 14 to 30 return policy while the factory warranty is 2 years.

I did find a couple of online authorized vendors that have the batteries for under $200 including shipping.

[VinceU]

Quick look at the site shows the Blue Top is primary a starting battery, not a good choice if you already are cutting capacity. There are plenty of deep cyclle "with no gas" out there.

[10x]

I have used walmart deepcycle batteries for years, what I like is they have a 3 year full replacement policy. Gel batteries for a rv are not really needed..JMHO

[myredracer]

It seems like there are 2 types of the Blue Top. The deep cycle ones have a "D" prefix such as the "D34M" versus the "34M." The 34M is for starting applications. From one online vendor:

"It's perfect for boats with electric trolling motors, on-board electronics or stereo systems and RV's with "creature comforts" that tend to drain batteries quickly. In addition to providing weight savings and outstanding vibration resistance, the BlueTop's efficient power delivery and faster recharge time mean you'll spend less time worrying about your battery. "

Does Walmart have the Optima or another brand?

[VinceU]

Originally Posted by myredracer

It seems like there are 2 types of the Blue Top. The deep cycle ones have a "D" prefix such as the "D34M" versus the "34M." The 34M is for starting applications. From one online vendor:

"It's perfect for boats with electric trolling motors, on-board electronics or stereo systems and RV's with "creature comforts" that tend to drain batteries quickly. In addition to providing weight savings and outstanding vibration resistance, the BlueTop's efficient power delivery and faster recharge time mean you'll spend less time worrying about your battery. "

Does Walmart have the Optima or another brand?

Search too quick. Sounds good, not sure if Sam carries them or not, have big brands for sure.

[garbonz]

The optima deep cycle will work fine. Most of the RV converters don't go above 13.7 volts and should be okey, but really cheap ones have a tendency to keep charging and boil out the electrolyte. If you don't keep the camper plugged in except when using it, and disconnect the battery when it is sitting you should be good to go

[BobandArlene]

an AGM battery might be overkill for your needs... they cost more, but the lack of corrosion is a nice benefit.

I am running DEKA AGM batteries, since that's the only thing I could find locally.

I once had a Prevailer Gel battery in another rig, that thing last about 12 years.

[garbonz]

The Prevailer gels were great. I had 2 4d's in my boat 350 ah's and they were really great.