General Question is this too much for an F250 Diesel?

[tomkatb]

I assume none of you took statics in college. The ups equal the downs. The arounds equal the arounds. Statics one.

I would guess that about 50% or more of the weight in the front toy area would end up as hitch weight.

It is calculated based on the distance from the front pin and the axle. If centered it would be 50/50. Half weigh on the axle, half on the pin. The closer to the hitch the more weight.

On toy haulers the hitches are normally heavy. Until you put stuff in the back then they go down. Thats the around thing.

[KFX450RXC]

Originally Posted by tomkatb

I assume none of you took statics in college. The ups equal the downs. The arounds equal the arounds. Statics one.

I would guess that about 50% or more of the weight in the front toy area would end up as hitch weight.

It is calculated based on the distance from the front pin and the axle. If centered it would be 50/50. Half weigh on the axle, half on the pin. The closer to the hitch the more weight.

On toy haulers the hitches are normally heavy. Until you put stuff in the back then they go down. Thats the around thing.

Since I never took statistics, please help me with my ignorance here. Are you saying approximately 50% of the camper's weight will be on the hitch if no toys are in the garage?

[DouglasReid]

Originally Posted by TTBadDog

Sorry if duplicate, I had searched but failed to find my answers. Considering a 324 CG
New 2018 Keystone RV Outback 324CG Toy Hauler Travel Trailer at Big Daddy RVs | London, KY | #JB452428-IN
Tow vehicle 2003 F250 7.3 Diesel with 180K on it. Plan on replacing the transmission on my schedule so as not to break down in BFE.
Trailer weight 8,000 lbs
Garage weight 1,200 lbs bikes, tools spares etc. (FJR 1300, KTM 200)
Water and propane 600 lbs (won’t always carry water)
Everything else clothes food kitchen stuff ??? maybe 600 lbs?
Total trailer weight maybe 10,400
Truck bed, Generator, assorted spares, hitch 350
Truck weight 8,800
Me, Mama and dog 400
All in rig could weight 19,200

I have no experience towing trailers but have been towing boats for some time, 25 ft at 6500lbs total and truck behaves very well with that load. In general, I have several questions on moving up to a 36ft toy hauler.
Is 36ft total at 10,400 too much using a good WD with sway control for single axle F250?

Should I look at a smaller Toy hauler? I don’t want to start too small and resale to move up but also do not want to go too big and be strapped to mega sites or have a vehicle that is too difficult to handle. I prefer to rely on the experiences of those who have been there done that instead of what the salesman tells me.


What am really asking is the number seem to fit but is getting to 10,400 lb trailer on a 03 F250 Diesel going to be uncomfortable to drive using a good WD and Sway control hitch? Is 37ft trailer too big, will it fit into many sites? Just, in general, am I biting off too much or should I look at some smaller Toy haulers? I do not want to rely on what the salesman tells me but on opinions of those who have towed various rigs and weights.

Thoughts or comments on what I have not thought of.

Rather than guessing I thought you might like to know the actual numbers for your vehicle. They are available from Ford itself on the following link:

https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas...mper_03abb.pdf

Page 20 and 21 list the numbers. Your GCWR is 20,000. You will be under that. Your max tow weight is 13,400. You will be under that.

I do suggest that when you get it loaded up and are leaving for your first trip, visit a CAT scale and verify the numbers. Keep the scale receipt to prove to anyone you are in fact legal.

Have FUN and enjoy your new toy and your trusty old friend. We certainly enjoy OURS!

[doc73]

Originally Posted by DouglasReid

Rather than guessing I thought you might like to know the actual numbers for your vehicle. They are available from Ford itself on the following link:

https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas...mper_03abb.pdf

Page 20 and 21 list the numbers. Your GCWR is 20,000. You will be under that. Your max tow weight is 13,400. You will be under that.

I do suggest that when you get it loaded up and are leaving for your first trip, visit a CAT scale and verify the numbers. Keep the scale receipt to prove to anyone you are in fact legal.

Have FUN and enjoy your new toy and your trusty old friend. We certainly enjoy OURS!

That's not how it works... Payload is the killer.

[DouglasReid]

Originally Posted by doc73

That's not how it works... Payload is the killer.

Then he can get some overload springs or air bags, but if he is under max weight of vehicle and max towing he is golden

[doc73]

Originally Posted by DouglasReid

Then he can get some overload springs or air bags, but if he is under max weight of vehicle and max towing he is golden

Ok...
Still not how it works.

The answer to the question op's question is above on what the truck can do according to its number's (yellow sticker).


Now he may not care in the end then he can follow your theory on tow rating, but it is not correct.

[bikendan]

Originally Posted by DouglasReid

Then he can get some overload springs or air bags, but if he is under max weight of vehicle and max towing he is golden

Those don't increase payload, they only help level the tow vehicle.
And I have seen many with the Max Tow and still not have enough payload. I know cause I spent months looking for a replacement truck.

[LairdT]

We had a bumper pull Outback toyhauler that was a side load. If yours also loads from the side....... I had to build an extension for the ramp to get my road bike over the threshold. The ramp was short and steep so the bike would high center entering and leaving the garage. If the terrain where I loaded was angled away (steeper ramp angle) i would have to find volunteers to help me free it from the doorframe. When it rained it was worse!
My advice would be to try it before you buy it if it’s a side load door. The dirt bike wouldn’t be a problem... I have a rear garage now - safer & easier & hauls more.

[TTBadDog]

Hit the scales today.
03 F250 Super Cab DSL 7.4L 7450lbs.
1 driver 1 dog 1/2 tank.
With another passenger and a few personal items and usual items in emergency box I have maybe 1000lbs left for tongue weight. Rules out many ToyHaulers and all travel trailers if I put the FJR 1300 in the bed as it is 700lbs itself.

8800 GVWR will be violated or leave something home. Somehow I think there are a lot of F250 diesel owners in same boat. Need to rethink my choices.

[TTBadDog]

At this point my only option would seem to be a rear loading ToyHauler in hopes that as I load it my hitch weight may drop a bit or at least not climb much with the other items added to trailer forward of the axles. Things like clothes, water, propane, food etc. With any luck, a lot of weight behind axle (FJR1 300, KTM 200, tools) will offset the weight forward the axle. Anyone have a take on that or is it wishful thinking? I suppose if I had to I could run a tad over the 8800 GVWR but would prefer not to.

I had another random thought, I will likely post up on a new thread after researching to see what is known. ToyHaulers give up a lot of living space, there are some smaller lighter TT in the 5k weight range with equal living quarters as a large toyhauler. It occured to me perhaps I could relocate propane tanks and might could put my KTM 200 on the front of the trailer tongue, it weighs maybe 220 gassed or perhaps a good frame reinforced platform out back could hold it. FJR 1300 goes in bed.
Paying close attention to loading fore and aft things could balance out and I would still be able to have both bikes although no real garage space. I would just have to do a good job containerizing and storing things normally put in the garage. Riding gear, spare parts, tools etc. Could be a PITA but I suppose I got all day....

[tomkatb]

Kfx

Weight added in front of axles increases hitch weight. The closer to the hitch the more additional weight. #1000 added between the hitch and axle half way between increases the hitch weight #500. Farther forward increases more. Nearer the axle less.

I took statistics(math) as well as engineering statics. Not the same.

Owners need to know how to load a trailer.

[Oaklevel]

Sorry need to lighten up.........pun intended..................

This is too much.............

[Wobbles]

Originally Posted by Oaklevel

Sorry need to lighten up.........pun intended..................

This is too much.............

[mwdilday]

Originally Posted by doc73

Ok...
Still not how it works.

The answer to the question op's question is above on what the truck can do according to its number's (yellow sticker).


Now he may not care in the end then he can follow your theory on tow rating, but it is not correct.

X2

[KFX450RXC]

Originally Posted by tomkatb

Kfx

Weight added in front of axles increases hitch weight. The closer to the hitch the more additional weight. #1000 added between the hitch and axle half way between increases the hitch weight #500. Farther forward increases more. Nearer the axle less.

I took statistics(math) as well as engineering statics. Not the same.

Owners need to know how to load a trailer.

Totally understand now. I misunderstood. I was thinking you were stating half the weight of the camper itself is on the tongue and the other half is on the axles.

No worries.

[moose074]

I know this doesn’t necessarily answer your question but I say you ask to take trl to the scales then you decide if you like way it feels. I believe in following the numbers on truck but I towed for 3 1/2 4 years over payload in my 1/2 ton Tundra and F-150 that was supposed to have the higher payload but bottomed out until I put on WD bars that included trip over through the Rockies, Cascades, Siskous and Sierras never over heated brakes motor and other than crossing pat Tillman bridge never felt out of control . If I had paid attention to payload or had I had money to swap I would have. In the end it’s how you feel about how safe it is

[BigH]

Originally Posted by moose074

I know this doesn’t necessarily answer your question but I say you ask to take trl to the scales then you decide if you like way it feels. I believe in following the numbers on truck but I towed for 3 1/2 4 years over payload in my 1/2 ton Tundra and F-150 that was supposed to have the higher payload but bottomed out until I put on WD bars that included trip over through the Rockies, Cascades, Siskous and Sierras never over heated brakes motor and other than crossing pat Tillman bridge never felt out of control . If I had paid attention to payload or had I had money to swap I would have. In the end it’s how you feel about how safe it is

We have rules/laws because we need to hold people accountable who 'feel' they can do whatever they want.

Trucks have axle/cargo/towing ratings because its a piece of machinery with limits that don't have anything to do with how one 'feels' about safety.

[moose074]

Correct we have laws so every time you see 5 big guys in a truck or 4 in car let’s arrest them for being overweight I mean seriously 4 large guys can can equal the payload on a many half ton trucks my Tundra had an 1150 payload so guess I am outlaw. We have to realize tow capacity was even standard till a few years ago and payload numbers are to protect manufacturers from lawsuits.

[BigH]

Originally Posted by moose074

We have to realize tow capacity was even standard till a few years ago and payload numbers are to protect manufacturers from lawsuits.

Those limiting numbers are there to protect the manufacturer from having to pay to repair a vehicle because someone like you thinks it 'felt safe'...Those numbers also help to protect the public from people who don't have an understanding of these things and are smart enough to do a little research before loading...

They (the limiting numbers) do one more thing; involve me in a accident with your overloaded mess and see how far the statement:"payload numbers are to protect manufacturers from lawsuits" -protects you.

What folks did years ago with pickup trucks, (lack of standards for loading) is fine knowledge but using that in defense while knowing better -and worse yet potentially influencing the ignorant by stating: ''In the end it’s how you feel about how safe it is'' is wrong.

[mxdad]

I have a 26RR, and my tongue weight varied around 200# between loaded and unloaded. I always loaded everything towards the back to get the TW lighter. I used to tow this trailer with an 08 Escalade ESV with a payload of 1300 pounds. I can tell you that after going to the scales, the only capacity I was over was payload. Front Axle, Rear Axle, and GCWR were all within spec.

How did I travel thousands of miles over numerous weekends without incident? How was I overloaded and the whole vehicle not snap in half?
Simple. I did the research, applied what I learned, and most importantly - drove responsibly.

To the OP - I would have no issue towing that trailer with your rig. Even if you were overloaded by a little, one would have to prove that weight was a contributing factor in the accident. In all the "discussions" I have read, I think there was 1 time where a private individual (not commercial) was sued on the basis of weight (and cited a reliable source). And then they would have to prove that you were overweight.

I would rather share the road with someone a little overloaded (not F250 hauling a 20k 5ver, but reasonable) then someone in a brodozer driving like a jacka.... but within his weight limits.