RV Quality?

[Boso]

In 2009 Forest River did not have a fifth wheel to compare to a Thor grand junction both loaded just not comparable I don't know about now but I think my new Sunseeker is more comparable to old Coachman if you have been around rv's for awhile you understand what I'm saying


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[ejknight]

Originally Posted by DDC

Isn't it an oxymoron putting RV and Quality in the same sentence.

x2

[dave-g]

Its the same with all manufactures. And the problem is us the consumer. If we buy the crap they will build it. Its the Wall-mart mentality. I see people travel 1000 miles to save 5% on and rv.

I sell/service a/c units in the Jersey shore area- York (an a/c manufacture ) made a unit called the survivor, all plastic outer skin so it would not rust- all copper coils and fins so the salt air would not hurt it. The consumer wanted something that would last! They got it- it was 25%-35% more we sold non! York made them for 2 years then stopped.

I have a Keystone product looking a Berkshire class A- why $$. But my friend has a $350K + class a with tons of problems- so spending more does not always help.

One thing I do agree on is this industry needs to be pushed harder on standing behind its products.

[Up North]

I have read through this entire thread and it does damper my enthusiasim for purchasing a new rig. I own a 2005 Leprechaun and it's been a solid unit for the most part.
In the class c world you always have the Lazy Daze option. A quality rv that you will pay for. Their factory direct prices are every bit the msrp of the mass produced units with much fewer of the bells and whistles that you are seeing on the dealers lots.
Which is the key to their quality I believe. No slide outs or automatic leveling jacks are offered. No fire places and no tv's that pop up out of the counter top. Nothing elaborate going on here just a rock solid unit hand built with quality materials.
They got rid of all the problem areas or more specifically items that they can't really quality control.

A 31 footer will run you just over a $100K. So then it comes down to will you pay for the quality for basically a stripped down version of what the mass producers are offering?
I can't say I have seen one in any of the places we stayed this year or even on the road for that matter so maybe that answers the question.
I think people want their slide outs, automatic leveling jacks and the rest of the candy to choose from and will work through the sub par quality issues to have it.

[Oaklevel]

I dunno we do not have all the bells & whistles but our $15K Puma and our $29K 36' Puma 5th wheels have have been basically trouble free.......... You always hear the bad & rarely the good...........

[BamaBob]

And...before you toss a stone at Forest River quality - take a look at the so-called premium brands QC...

NHTSA Report: List of Recent RV-Related Recalls | RV Business

[schrederman]

BamaBob and all... I've said all along that it's an industry-wide problem, and not just Forest River. Yes, we hear about the problems, and there are trouble-free units out there... a lot of them. They will not be trouble-free for very long, because the quality of the materials and workmanship just isn't there. I have a 49-year-old guitar that's in pristine condition, despite having been played a lot. It'll be in great condition when my grandson is my age... but it's made of only the best stuff, not hurriedly, by real craftsmen. My RV is trouble free right now... oh, no... it's got some problems that have to be fixed before I use it, but they're minor. So, it's nearly trouble-free. But FR didn't make it that way... I had to. That's the part that isn't right. It's not made with the same level of quality materials and craftsmanship as my old guitar... and that's good. It would cost more than an Airstream if it was.

However, there is a level of acceptability that most RV manufacturers never reach. Why should they? We're going out and buying them with a plethora of problems. Then we let the dealer's techs supposedly fix them and keep them for months while we argue with the dealer and manufacturer as to who pays for the repair that never should have been necessary. Then they break 3 things trying to fix 1, and the repair process/argument begins yet again, in earnest... Or... we just bite the bullet and fix stuff ourselves.

So... no... you don't hear much about the good ones. But believe me, the folks having problems after plunking down serious bucks are going to sound off... and rightly so.

[Up North]

I mentioned Lazy Daze in my earlier post. I spent a good deal of time looking at their web site and model offerings after which I sent them a email inquiring about lead time and asked them to explain their reasoning for not offering slide outs or automatic levelers.
The lead time is 18 months wait for a new 31' Lazy Daze. They answered the slide out and automatic leveler question with one word. Reliability.

So what Lazy Daze is really saying is we don't manufacture slide outs ourselves and whats out there from vendors is not up to standards. To Lazy Daze standards anyhow.
So quality really has to start with all the suppliers. They need to produce a better product to supply the manufacturers before you will see a overall shift in quality off the assembly line.
As they say, junk in, junk out.

[5er_tom]

My parents had three Lazy Daze motor homes in a 15 year period. Each one of them was a fine unit with almost no issues. If I were in the market for a class C, I would go through the hassles involved and get a Lazy Daze.



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[Up North]

Originally Posted by 5er_tom

My parents had three Lazy Daze motor homes in a 15 year period. Each one of them was a fine unit with almost no issues. If I were in the market for a class C, I would go through the hassles involved and get a Lazy Daze

If I could find a slightly used one in a 31' island bed floor plan I would certainly consider it. Might be a hard sell to the wife with no slide outs though. Curious, why did your parents have 3 in 15 years? It's not like you have a lot of different floor plans to choose from?

[5er_tom]

They kept wanting a larger unit. They started with a short one, perhaps 17' (remember, this was around 1975) and gradually moved up. They also put about 100,000 miles on each one.


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[Eqdawg87]

Got back from vacation from 4 corners region, and contacted dealer where I purchased my Berkshire. I had so many issues with the unit on the road, I am here to say that my unit had too many issues to list here, but they referred me to Mitch Wirt at the factory to get an appointment to get repaired as some is major problems the dealer is unable to fix. Received email from Mitch today saying they are booked into February at this time. So I have a unit that I cannot use and making payments on that I have had for a month total. It was back to Elkhart dealer for bit over 2 months getting other repairs done. Sad to say, Quality is a thing of the past. Dinette slide when retracting went into the ceiling in the front and major damage happened. Just a sad buyers remorse now.

[Up North]

Dinette slide when retracting went into the ceiling in the front and major damage happened.

Huh?? How the heck does that happen? Can you post a pic of the damage?

[Eqdawg87]

I will in a day or so. The slide went up when retracting and instead of dropping down after the initial upswing it just kept on going up. The clearance isn't much to begin with so I am assuming the hydraulic timing got out of whack. Half way back above the dinette there is a shelf, the twisting motion of that slide separated that from the wall.
The trim for the front half is broken. The slide now doesn't seal at the bottom, literally can put my fat fingers up behind closed slide. Bummer deal. That is just one issue I had of many.

[Up North]

Originally Posted by Eqdawg87

I will in a day or so. The slide went up when retracting and instead of dropping down after the initial upswing it just kept on going up. The clearance isn't much to begin with so I am assuming the hydraulic timing got out of whack. Half way back above the dinette there is a shelf, the twisting motion of that slide separated that from the wall.
The trim for the front half is broken. The slide now doesn't seal at the bottom, literally can put my fat fingers up behind closed slide. Bummer deal. That is just one issue I had of many.

Wow. Sorry to hear about all your problems. Hopefully you can work through them and have some smooth sailing after that. Best of luck to you!

[SimoRandy]

As a first time RV owner I too was shocked at the quality that gets shipped out the door. Coming from the industrial manufacturing sector and having been trained in numerous quality, six sigma and production programs, I'm shocked that this industry can't produce quality products. I'm sure they have good people who really want to deliver a quality product " the first time", but as I've seen, investors want to see margin growth. I'm sure top management here is incentivized to cut costs, increase cash flow and move inventory as fast as possible. Unfortunately pushing product through as fast as possible and at a low cost causes a lack in quality. I'm betting good old Mr. Buffet and his fellow1%'rs are laughing all the way to the bank. Maybe we should all invest along with them and use the profits to fix our RV's ourselves!

I've had my Georgetown for a few months now and can't believe all of the simple things that weren't built correctly. I'm even more shocked that when the dealer did their PDI they didn't notice either! I have a whole list of items as well but here is just one example; how can you build, ship and test an RV when the furnace wires aren't even connected?

Being new to RV'ing, I thought maybe it was just my particular Georgetown. After joining this forum I see that it appears to be not only FR, but other manufactures as well. I got to the point that while having my unit in for warranty repairs I'd check out a Berkshire, for almost double the cost, to get a higher quality and better RV. I discussed my displeasure with my current RV with the salesperson who told me the Berkshire is built in a different plant and has a better reputation for quality. I suggested that it's the same company and perhaps they have the same manufacturing mentality. He proceeded to get the Berkshire ready for me to take a test drive. He was unable to close the video door he had opened and then started closing the slides. Unfortunately, as mentioned in an earlier thread, the slide tilted up and rammed into the ceiling! He suggested I come back another day to drive it.

At this point I'm certainly not going to be considering a new FR product and am quite frankly afraid to purchase any other brand if this is truly an industry wide problem. I don't want to spend $500K (if that's even enough) or more to live in a trustworthy RV. Can anyone recommend a reputable brand and model I'd certainly appreciate it.

I'll step down from my soapbox now. Thanks for letting me vent. When I recently retired and decided to live a dream of traveling the country in an RV and relieve some stress, I certainly wasn't planning on an RV creating even more.


Randy & Sharon
RV'rs as of 2015
G-town XL 369 w/ wrangler hanging on the back!

[lgray]

Forest River coaches are at a lower price point and for that price point; many would argue a pretty good value.If you are willing to pay a little more, you will get more and better quality, just not with FR.

[barrie1]

Originally Posted by SimoRandy

As a first time RV owner I too was shocked at the quality that gets shipped out the door. Coming from the industrial manufacturing sector and having been trained in numerous quality, six sigma and production programs, I'm shocked that this industry can't produce quality products. I'm sure they have good people who really want to deliver a quality product " the first time", but as I've seen, investors want to see margin growth. I'm sure top management here is incentivized to cut costs, increase cash flow and move inventory as fast as possible. Unfortunately pushing product through as fast as possible and at a low cost causes a lack in quality. I'm betting good old Mr. Buffet and his fellow1%'rs are laughing all the way to the bank. Maybe we should all invest along with them and use the profits to fix our RV's ourselves!

I've had my Georgetown for a few months now and can't believe all of the simple things that weren't built correctly. I'm even more shocked that when the dealer did their PDI they didn't notice either! I have a whole list of items as well but here is just one example; how can you build, ship and test an RV when the furnace wires aren't even connected?

Being new to RV'ing, I thought maybe it was just my particular Georgetown. After joining this forum I see that it appears to be not only FR, but other manufactures as well. I got to the point that while having my unit in for warranty repairs I'd check out a Berkshire, for almost double the cost, to get a higher quality and better RV. I discussed my displeasure with my current RV with the salesperson who told me the Berkshire is built in a different plant and has a better reputation for quality. I suggested that it's the same company and perhaps they have the same manufacturing mentality. He proceeded to get the Berkshire ready for me to take a test drive. He was unable to close the video door he had opened and then started closing the slides. Unfortunately, as mentioned in an earlier thread, the slide tilted up and rammed into the ceiling! He suggested I come back another day to drive it.

At this point I'm certainly not going to be considering a new FR product and am quite frankly afraid to purchase any other brand if this is truly an industry wide problem. I don't want to spend $500K (if that's even enough) or more to live in a trustworthy RV. Can anyone recommend a reputable brand and model I'd certainly appreciate it.

I'll step down from my soapbox now. Thanks for letting me vent. When I recently retired and decided to live a dream of traveling the country in an RV and relieve some stress, I certainly wasn't planning on an RV creating even more.


Randy & Sharon
RV'rs as of 2015
G-town XL 369 w/ wrangler hanging on the back!

Thanks for sharing you experience with all of us. Believe you, I feel your pain and frustration with FR. But I will say this. My wife and I have finally got our 5th Wheel problems sorted, through our dealership and are now enjoying our Shockwave.

Barrie

[Up North]

After much research and reading many different forums and talking to people directly we have actually decided to delay our new purchase for at least one if not 2 seasons. Hopefully the industry will stabalize a bit and improve upon the quality of the final product.
My research led me to another conclusion and that is when we do purchase it will be factory direct. Either Born Free or Nexus. We considered Lazy Daze but they are over priced and you get a basic coach. No slides, no leveling jacks and limited floor plans. This cuts out the dealer problems at least and I think you end up with a better quality coach as they are built to order.

As far as service after the fact I am fortunate to have a very good friend who owns a rv repair shop and the factory direct people will gladly set him up to do warranty work.

[CAT-RN]

Originally Posted by Up North

After much research and reading many different forums and talking to people directly we have actually decided to delay our new purchase for at least one if not 2 seasons. Hopefully the industry will stabalize a bit and improve upon the quality of the final product.
My research led me to another conclusion and that is when we do purchase it will be factory direct. Either Born Free or Nexus. We considered Lazy Daze but they are over priced and you get a basic coach. No slides, no leveling jacks and limited floor plans. This cuts out the dealer problems at least and I think you end up with a better quality coach as they are built to order.

As far as service after the fact I am fortunate to have a very good friend who owns a rv repair shop and the factory direct people will gladly set him up to do warranty work.

I'm probably not reading this right but your planning on buying a no slide no leveling jack RV ?

Russell