generators -- the more I read, the more I ?

[f5moab]

Originally Posted by SKnight

An EU1000 is about $750, the EU2000 is around $1050, YMMV. Spend the extra and get the 2000.

Charging time depends on the size of the battery, how discharged it is and how much battery charger it has. If you use 10 amp hours of battery capacity, it will take one hour at a 10 amp charging rate or 10 hours at a one amp rate.

Me? I'd top it up every day to reduce run time, in other words, don't wait until it's dead then charge it for six hours. Depending on use, an hour of generator time should be more than enough.

The charging output is 8.3 amps but isn't regulated if I recall correctly, I'd use a good dedicated smart charger.

THIS^^^^

I have a 2000 and it does a terrible job of charging the battery via the dedicated charging clips. A dedicated charger is the way to go.

[Herk7769]

Originally Posted by rycej

I agree. Could you not just hook up a solar panel and leave it connected during your camping?

How big a panel? The size needed depends on your amp usage and battery capacity. How much to pay for that wattage?

What happens on a cloudy/rainy day? Family won't be happy if you wind up with a dead battery and no way to charge it.

A good solar panel system is a great secondary method of battery charge control, IMO; just not a very effective primary method since weather plays such a critical roll in the process.

Even a 100 watt panel only generates 7.5 amps per hour of power.
A single 921 wedge base light bulb in a 12 volt fixture uses 1.1 amps per hour; and most use two per fixture.

[pgandw]

Originally Posted by troutstalker

We mostly boondock camp and use very little power -- furnace fan a few times a night, water pump, few other vampire draws. Don't use the lights, the refridgerator or any appliances. Still, I suspect that one 12 volt battery isn't going to last a full five days. So I want to get a generator. Researched, researched and researched and I"m more confused than before.

All I simply want to know know is how small of a generator can I get to hook up to my battery every couple of days to charge? And do I need some kind of charger between generator and battery?

Anyone?

I'm a big believer in keeping things very simple. We typically camped (no hookups) at Lake Tahoe for 9 days at a time with our Coleman Westlake (12ft box). I minimized use of lights, so furnace fan was the big issue. One year was a little cooler (more heater use), and the single size 27 battery didn't make it the whole 9 days. Other years, it could be weak but made it.

Same as you, I investigated generators and solar.

Solar I saw as impractical because we like to camp in the shade. And storms and associated winds created havoc enough with awnings, tents, and dining flies.

A nice quiet generator was more than I wanted spend, was not light, and then I had the hassle of locking it down (stop from being stolen), having gas to refuel, and the weight and space of the thing.

So I ended up mounting and paralleling 2 Die-Hard deep cycle batteries. If I keep loads reasonable, they will last. Even more battery capacity in the same space can be attained through putting 2 6 volt golf cart batteries in series.

The camper converter - if reasonably modern - has a pretty good 3 stage battery charger built in. So if you do get a generator, plug your camper into the generator and let the converter charge the batteries. If just doing battery charging and running the camper on DC, a 1000 watt generator is plenty. If you want the air conditioner or a microwave (not both at the same time), a 2000 watt generator may or may not work. Generator output drops with altitude, and 2000 watts becomes 1500 watts at 6,000 ft at Lake Tahoe or in Colorado. And the size of your air conditioner matters - my A122 has a 9K BTU instead of the more common 13.5K.

just my thoughts and experiences
Fred W
2014 Rockwood A122 - 2 size 24 RV/Marine batteries to carry us through long weekend with fair amount of heater use, no generator, no solar

[bleurt]

I always camp where there are no services so i have dual battries since i already had a 27d for hunting and my camper had 24d i have diffirent sizes 12volt. I have sleep apnea so i need power at night. i bought and inverter charger by yantrek it is a moditifield sinewave inverter it charges at 20amps. I Have a kipor 2000w invertor\generator it is relatively quiet. I camp mostly in New-York State campgrounds so you can only use generators 5 hours a day 09:00 to 11:00 and 16:00 to 19:00 it is usually ennough to bring it full charge. My father has a Generec it was cheaper than mine but a little bit noisier. Though my years of camping i have seen what the neighboors have, the Honda has very quiet inverter/generator but the quietest inverter/generator is the Yamaha but it is all about budget.

I would not go any smaller than 2000 watts so you can use it in an emergency at home.
The one thing i like about inverter/generator is they will produce 120v in energie saving mode so for small loads you can use the low idle so it cuts down quite a bit on the noise

[dcheatwood]

If you only want to charge the battery and not use a/c. And if you boondock away from others, Harbor Freight sells a little 800/900 w 2-stroke for under $100. I got one on sale with a email coupon for $79. Use it to charge batteries on 2 campers when hunt camping. Mix oil with fuel like a weedeater. Not a Honda but how much do you need?

[lswartz]

Originally Posted by Herk7769

I think you will find that this is not true. 1/2 hour will only give your battery a "flash charge" and it may appear to have 12 volts, but as soon as you put any load on it the surface charge on the plates will deplete and your battery will be dead again.

Typical time to replace "most" of the the charge on a 50% depleted battery (depending on whether you use the 12 volt charger on some generators, a dedicated charger connected to the 120 volt duplex, or plug the camper into the generator) will take between 4 and 10 hours depending on method chosen.

I agree totally. However, he is going for 5 days & only running the furnace, some. A 1/2 hour would get him through for 5 days unless that furnace runs all night for any of those nights. If he arrives with less than a fully charged battery then he is going to need that generator to run a lot more. I expect that he will be headed home with a battery needing a charge.

[lswartz]

Originally Posted by dcheatwood

If you only want to charge the battery and not use a/c. And if you boondock away from others, Harbor Freight sells a little 800/900 w 2-stroke for under $100. I got one on sale with a email coupon for $79. Use it to charge batteries on 2 campers when hunt camping. Mix oil with fuel like a weedeater. Not a Honda but how much do you need?

My thought exactly, 900 Peak/800 Running Watts, 2 HP (63cc) Gas Generator & they will have that sale on again if you can wait for it. $79 is hard to beat.

[Cypressloser]

Here is a different idea, even though I am a big fan of solar and haven't seen my power cord in 3 weeks and we have a res. fridge and elec. oven.
Get a cheap generator if noise is no obstacle, buy a 2nd matching battery (age, type, capacity the same) and bring a charger from home, if you have one. This way you can choose between a quick surface boost or a bulk charge. I don't think a single battery will even last two days esp. when the furnace kicks in.
If you have do keep it quiet, why not consider a portable solar setup and buy a second battery later.

[troutstalker]

So lets say I get a 1000 honda genny, what kind of charger should I get? Mail order isn't an option as I'm leaving soon. Or as somone has suggested, I should just plug it into the camper every day for a while and let the converter do the work?

Secondly -- If I don't have a genny and don't have time to hard wire two batteries into a bank, what about bringing a fulling charged second battery with me? I hate to run a battery all the way down, but for this one trip, I could simply run one battery down and then replace it with a fresh battery.

Finally, can I simply replace a 24 group battery with a larger capacity battery, like a 27 group? Or does that require new wiring or different kind of converter?


mbm

[Herk7769]

Originally Posted by troutstalker

We mostly boondock camp and use very little power -- furnace fan a few times a night, water pump, few other vampire draws. Don't use the lights, the refrigerator or any appliances. Still, I suspect that one 12 volt battery isn't going to last a full five days. So I want to get a generator. Researched, researched and researched and I"m more confused than before.

All I simply want to know know is how small of a generator can I get to hook up to my battery every couple of days to charge? And do I need some kind of charger between generator and battery?

Anyone?

So, lots of options presented here. Obviously it is your vacation so in the final measure you will need to decide what you want to do.
Herk

[Kuba]

If you run your battery down you will loose 20% of its full capacity

[sdelam]

24-27 is a easy swap but may need a bigger battery box. A 2nd battery is another option thats very doable. An inexpensive battery tender and a small inverter to plug in to the tow vehicle would work if money is tight.

How do you charge your battery at home if there is no converter/ charger in camper?

[troutstalker]

I do have a converter in the camper. I was just wondering if I was to replace the group 24 with a group 27, would I also need a different kind of converter?


Sent from my iPhone using Forest River Forums

[sdelam]

Nope 12v is 12v

[steamboatscott]

Personally, I can't stand the sound of a generator. Most that I talk to using them are improperly informed about their need (or lack thereof).

I got by just fine on 4 nights with fairly liberal use of the furnace fan (although I'm insulated in the bunk ends with reflectix), water pump, and very occasional light use on one Group 27 battery rated at around 72 amp hours.

Why not do as I did and measure your use nightly and figure out what you need, then match supply to demand? I know exactly what I need for a given trip.

I ended up buying two new, matched batteries so that when I go a week in Yellowstone for example I have plenty of power. But, you could buy one extra battery and only use it when needed. Since it would be newer than your other battery - I wouldn't hook them up in parallel but would simply swap out.

I would never drop money on a generator until I verified my use exceeded the supply I could reasonable deliver with just batteries.

[pgandw]

Originally Posted by troutstalker

So lets say I get a 1000 honda genny, what kind of charger should I get? Mail order isn't an option as I'm leaving soon. Or as somone has suggested, I should just plug it into the camper every day for a while and let the converter do the work?

Secondly -- If I don't have a genny and don't have time to hard wire two batteries into a bank, what about bringing a fulling charged second battery with me? I hate to run a battery all the way down, but for this one trip, I could simply run one battery down and then replace it with a fresh battery.

Finally, can I simply replace a 24 group battery with a larger capacity battery, like a 27 group? Or does that require new wiring or different kind of converter?

mbm

The camper converter can easily handle a second battery if you don't demand the very fastest charge rate.

A Group 24 is typically 80 amp hours, which means a bulk charge rate of around 16-20 amps. Group 27 is 105 amp hours so bulk charge rate of 21-26 amps. Your converter puts out 30 amps (typical for PUPs and A-frames), so your bulk charge rate for a 2 battery setup will be slightly below maximum. With a dual Group 27 and a 30 amp converter, the difference in time in bulk charge mode (going from 50% charge to 80% charge) and using a 50 amp 3 stage charger is about 30 minutes. Not worth the cost difference to me, but it may be to you. Once you shift to absorption, you charge at a much lower current for the last 20% of battery capacity and the charger capacity doesn't matter.

The advantage of paralleling 2 matched batteries is that you discharge the pair much less than you would a single battery - which makes the batteries last longer. But using one at a time also works.

Usually the stock wiring is matched for the converter. I've yet to see an RV come stock with significantly heavier wiring than the minimum required for each circuit.

Hope this helps, and have a great time.

Fred W

[dcheatwood]

For the price of a new deep cycle battery you can have a generator and charger. Run it about 2 hrs each afternoon to charge up. 15 amp charger can be bought for less than $30.

[Herk7769]

Originally Posted by pgandw

The advantage of paralleling 2 matched batteries is that you discharge the pair much less than you would a single battery - which makes the batteries last longer. Fred W

This is exactly right and why a dual battery setup should be paralleled and not wired as A and B to be used individually. The lower amperage draw per battery will result in increased available capacity and using that same tolal draw off a single battery can decrease available capacity severely. This reduction in available power is known as the Peukert Effect.

Using the attached graph, if you have a 100 Amp Hour battery and demand 10 amps from it the available capacity will drop to 80 AH. However if that 10 amp load is shared across two identical batteries (wired as pictured), each will deliver only 1/2 the load or 5 amps each. This will allow each battery to deliver its full 100 AH load.

[vinmaker]

PE effect? Interesting. Thanks for sharing.

[KyDan]

Originally Posted by troutstalker

So lets say I get a 1000 honda genny, what kind of charger should I get? Mail order isn't an option as I'm leaving soon. Or as somone has suggested, I should just plug it into the camper every day for a while and let the converter do the work?
mbm

Yes you can just plug it in for a few hours but remember--
I donno your setup IF you have dual heat water heater you must shut
off the electric side. Also your fridge needs to be set on LP only not
auto. IF you fail to switch these appliances when you plug in the genny
you will overload it.

Once upon a time I camped with only 1 single 12v battery. We used the
furnace only a couple times to take the chill off in the morning.
Since I was driving some distance every day to hiking destinations-
I left my trailer plugged into my truck at nite so I had dual batteries
more or less. The truck was re-charged while driving each day.
Do this with caution you don't want to leave yourself with out a start but
it worked for me numerous times.

Incandescent lights are energy hogs so I advise LED replacements
or lanterns or even a candle if treated with care.
IF it's gonna be chilly at nite- use flannel sheets or flannel lined down
sleeping bags and leave the furnace off. Heat up the place in the morning
by baking some biscuits in the oven. If you don't have an oven, just
lighting a burner and brewing up a pot of stove top percolated coffee
will add a surprising amount of heat to the trailer.

You can camp a few days on a single battery IF you are careful!

I know that fully discharging a battery is bad for it but I disagree that
a single discharge will drop capacity 20% from then on.

Have Fun- go camping and see what works for YOU!