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Old 04-12-2015, 06:42 PM   #1
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Just returned from first outting.... A few issues

So, we bought a ntu 2011 flagstaff hw27sc a few months ago. Chomping at the bit to get out with the new pup, I scheduled 6 trips the day after I brought her home. First trip was a "shake down cruise" to see how things went and what needed done, bought, fixed or upgraded.

So we left out Friday for a trip to Elk Neck SP, a drive south of just under two hours. I definelty felt the weight during the Rt 10 hill climbs, but she towed nicely.

Set up went well and we tested out the potty for the first time. The only issue we had was some forgotten items, doormats, grilling utensils, etc.... All fixed with a quick Walmart trip.

Now the little issue I had...... I was led to believe that I bought it from the dealer with a new battery and full propane tanks. I set up the camper once in the driveway for a few hours, 3 weeks ago, to check everything out. All went well then, and I had it plugged into shore power to keep up with the battery.
So this weekend, we had the furnace running at night on the lowest setting, the fridge running on LP, and we'd kick on the water pump as needed for potty flushes. There was limited light and bunk fan use. Friday night went well. Saturday night/Sunday morning, I woke up freezing at 4am. The furnace stopped running at sometime overnight. I went outside to see if there was an issue with the propane transfer thingy, and couldn't tell much of anything in the dark. It's supposed to transfer to the second tank automatically, but I flipped the dial to the other side anyway.
Went back in and nothing, no furnace. Fell back asleep after putting on my sweatshirt and when we woke up, realized the battery was about dead. Overhead light was dim and the fridge was completely off.
So, I know the fridge will auto flip to DC if LP runs out and vice versa. I don't know if the fridge went to DC after the propane ran out and that's what killed the battery, or if the battery died first and everything shut down.
At this point, I was thinking that the dealer stuck me with partially filled LP tanks. So we packed up to come home. The power winch was dead, but I backed the truck up and plugged in the trailer which provided enough power to lower the pup roof. Then found out the sewage hose is only 5' long, so that took some maneuvering. (10' now ordered)
Made it home and pulled the LP tanks off....... Was expecting two empties, but one feels empty, and one feels almost full.... So I'm thinking the transfer regulator is shot.
And then I plugged into shore power to charge the battery and heard something humming... Opened her back up and found the water heater was switched on (DW must've hit the wrong switch at some point).

So, a few questions for you guys with more experience...

1. Will plugging in to shore power at home be enough to fully recharge the battery, or must I hook up to a trickle charger?
2. Did the water heater being switched on kill my battery extra quick? (We were only set up for less than 48hrs)
3. Is it common for LP transfer regulators to fail?

Suggestions appreciated to get me thru 3-4 day dry camping trips with 12v and propane.
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Old 04-12-2015, 07:00 PM   #2
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Welcome to the Forum and congrats on your pop up. That is a nice unit.

I believe your pop up converter will charge your battery when you plug it into shore power. Personally, I like to take my battery off the pop up and charge the battery on a good old fashion battery charger.

I am not sure how much power a water heater draws. I know the heating element is LP gas and that is the biggest energy part of it. Just not sure of the effect on the battery. My guess is that the WH would not drain the battery as the only draw should be a thermostat type device.

I do not believe you pop up has a automatic switch. I believe it is a manual switch. The switch makes it simple to do and you do not have to physically disconnect one tank and connect another tank. You just flick the switch. I suspect the dealer either mis-spoke or you mis- heard concerning an automatic feature.

I think you are right on about the fridge doing the damage. Once the LP runs out, it searches for AC. If that is not found, it will go to DC. I suspect that is what happened.

I am glad everything worked out otherwise for you. It sounds to me like everything worked fine and as it was supposed to. The problem is that the tank ran out of gas. With more experience you will have a better feel for how long the tanks last.

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Old 04-12-2015, 07:14 PM   #3
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I always make sure that my fridge is not turned to "Auto".. I select either Gas or AC and never let it run on the battery as that will kill your battery super fast..

What I'm guessing happened was that you ran out of propane and your fridge switched to battery and that was what killed your battery.. Do you have one or two batteries? What type? Are they maintenance free or flooded?

What size are your propane tanks? I've had propane systems almost "vapor lock" but mainly on the bbq. To fix, I had to shut off the tank and let the lines empty.. Then close the burner valves and open the tank bottle, then relight.. Again, that was only on a bbq and not sure if that might have contributed to your situation..

To save power I'd recommend switching to LED lamps throughout.. You'd be amazed of the savings with doing that alone! Not sure about leaving a fan on.. I'm guessing that would be a big power user too..
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Old 04-12-2015, 07:19 PM   #4
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Thanks for the response..
That makes sense, if the stock propane regulator isn't an auto-switch over (as the dealer told me).... And the first LP tank expired an hour after we went to bed...it makes sense that the fridge went to DC and killed the battery quickly.

I just ordered this......https://www.etrailer.com/Propane/Cam...05.html.....to prevent future late night surprises.
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Old 04-12-2015, 07:23 PM   #5
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Even with the refrigerator on propane, there is still DC power required to run the refrigerator. I discovered this when I turned my battery disconnect off, and the refrigerator quit working. There is power needed to ignite the propane when the refrigerator cycles on and off.
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Old 04-12-2015, 07:30 PM   #6
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I always make sure that my fridge is not turned to "Auto".. I select either Gas or AC and never let it run on the battery as that will kill your battery super fast..

What I'm guessing happened was that you ran out of propane and your fridge switched to battery and that was what killed your battery.. Do you have one or two batteries? What type? Are they maintenance free or flooded?

What size are your propane tanks? I've had propane systems almost "vapor lock" but mainly on the bbq. To fix, I had to shut off the tank and let the lines empty.. Then close the burner valves and open the tank bottle, then relight.. Again, that was only on a bbq and not sure if that might have contributed to your situation..

To save power I'd recommend switching to LED lamps throughout.. You'd be amazed of the savings with doing that alone! Not sure about leaving a fan on.. I'm guessing that would be a big power user too..
Tanks are twin 20's.
And to be honest, I didn't take a close look at the battery, I'm not certain what type it is....it's only one.
When finances avail, I plan to upgrade to a dual battery set-up

But for the next trip in 2 weeks, I'll take the generator along.

Btw, do you have a recommended source for LED bulbs?
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Old 04-13-2015, 01:02 AM   #7
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Just returned from first outting.... A few issues

Our 2014 has an automatic regulator on the propane. I don't know what year they started using them, but ours has one and yes they do fail. Being a high wall, I'm guessing that you would have had an auto on yours from the factory as well. Some people got sick of the autos failing and replaced them with manuals. You would have to have someone look at it or run part numbers to be sure.

The fridge and the water heater will draw some 12v power while they are running, but not much. Mostly to run the thermostats and igniters and such. To keep the fridge from switching to 12v when the gas runs out, turn the 12v switch off on the fridge. It will still run on gas, but will not switch over if the gas supply runs out, saving the battery.

The furnace is the big energy hog on 12 volt power. If it was a cold weekend, where the furnace was running a lot, and you only have one battery, you might not make it through. We turn ours off as soon as we get up, and don't start it until we are ready to go to bed.

The other big energy draw is if you are running an inverter. If you are trying to run any 120 volt equipment, it will kill your battery really fast, especially if you are trying to run high draw items like a coffee maker or microwave.

The converter will fully charge the battery when you are plugged into shore power. The converter will not charge as fast as a conventional battery charger, but it will do the job, and will charge to the same level a conventional will.

We added a second battery to ours. I have a CPAP mask, and run that at night. Water heater, fridge, furnace, lights, pump and mask, with 2 batteries, we can make it about 3 or 4 nights depending on how much the furnace runs. I made up a charging cable that I can hook up to the truck to charge the battery. I plug it in and idle the truck for a while, helps extend the range a bit.
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Old 04-13-2015, 07:18 AM   #8
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Interesting. I did not know some of the HW pop up's were shipping with automatic ones. I am pretty sure mine is a manual flip switch.

In any event, I think we have discovered the problem.

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Old 04-13-2015, 07:21 AM   #9
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Mine isn't even a high wall and it has one on. Not sure if all of the units with twin tanks are coming with them from the factory, or just the Premier class. I know if you have dual tanks put on anything from our dealership, it will come with an auto switching regulator on it.
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Old 04-13-2015, 07:57 AM   #10
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It is an option, not standard. Sounds like your dealer gets them in with the options. My dealer does that as well, but not all dealers do.
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Old 04-13-2015, 08:08 AM   #11
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Slightly off your topic but I wanted to get your thoughts on elk neck. We are heading there in July. Like you it's not too far for us.


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Old 04-13-2015, 08:14 AM   #12
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My auto valve on my 228 works; so long as you remember to open both valves after you park. But, it is advisable to purge both lines. I guess the short line from the tank to the valve needs to be purged. So the dealer told me that after disconnecting and filling; make sure to open each valve separately and make sure the lines are purged.


From experience, when my fridge is on propane; no batteries required. I believe requiring 12V is model specific. It is also non-auto. If you run out of propane, your fridge cuts off.

Need to know the type of battery. If it is a small starter battery it won't last long.
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Old 04-13-2015, 11:46 AM   #13
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Slightly off your topic but I wanted to get your thoughts on elk neck. We are heading there in July. Like you it's not too far for us.


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A nice peaceful drive for us coming from Reading PA. Very little highway other than 12 miles on I 176, and 6 miles on Rt 1. Other than that, Rt 10 & Rt 272 are peaceful 40-50mph rides through the countryside and farmland.
272 will take you thru the quaint town of NorthEast MD. About 10-12 miles north of the park. Make sure you visit the town for the small shops on Main St. And don't miss out on Woody's Crab House on Main St, Steak & Main on Main St, and The Nauti Goose next to the marina. Excellent food at all three places.
The park itself is a bit uneventful. There's only one loop with full hookups (Northeast Loop). And there are a few other loops with views overlooking the Chesapeake. Well, it's actually the Elk River right there, but you can see where it meets the Bay. If you find a campground map, I was in Elk loop site #138. The pad was about 30' from a cliff edge dropping down 40' to the water. And you'll see the occasional tugboat pushing barges up the river towards the Delaware Canal.
Would be a great spot if you're a fisherman. But I don't fish, so....
No alcohol allowed in the state park.....but what happens in the pup, stays in the pup.
Also make sure to visit the lighthouse at the southern tip of the peninsula. Beautiful view of the bay. And on the west side of the peninsula, the SP has a beach, although it and the camp store don't open til Memorial Day.
The site pads are a firmly packed gravel type surface and are fairly level.

I know some people go to private campgrounds with activities for the kids and to socialize with the other campers. That's not me, I'd rather be in a quiet nature setting to recalibrate my stress-laden brain, with an occasional jaunt out for local seafood. Elk Neck served that purpose for me.

Due to the time of the year, there were only about a dozen sites occupied when I was there. All on the end of the loop overlooking the water. One other pup, a TT, a 5er, and a handful of tent campers. They didn't bother me too much, but the wife gets annoyed at the sound of a gnat farting. So the pet-friendly loop had a few barking dogs, a few screaming kids, and a drunk cackling hag next door. All were easily drown out with the hum of a bunk fan.
Quiet hours are 11p-7a. I was usually asleep by 9p and up at dawn. The park is generally clean and the bathhouse in Elk loop was average in cleanliness. And I make those comparisons to others I've stayed at. The cleanest I've ever seen was the Northeast loop at Elk Neck in 2013, followed by Assategaue SP. The sloppiest I've seen was Cape Henlopen Sp in DE.
And don't expect any cell phone service, I have Sprint and was picking up one bar on good days.

I've got one more weekend excursion planned to Elk Neck in July, in the Northeast loop with full hookup, for the a/c.
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Old 04-13-2015, 01:19 PM   #14
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Thank you! I think I wish I booked that site. What a view. We also will be in NE loop in July. It's a straight shot down 272 for us from lancaster. We definitely prefer the state parks over others. Last Labor Day we spent at Point Lookout which was also nice if buggy. Thanks again.


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Old 04-13-2015, 05:36 PM   #15
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Don't forget if u run out of propane and then switch tanks u need to get the air out of the system fist by lighting up a burner on the stove for a minute then try light the heater back up but make sure your fridge is off of LP and turned on 110 volts so it don't burn the propane
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Old 04-13-2015, 07:43 PM   #16
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I just upgraded the Battery on my HW276 to two 100ah AGM batteries and built a battery box. I haven't had a chance to try it out yet but hope to be able to get 6 nights on battery.
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Old 04-13-2015, 07:53 PM   #17
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Don't forget if u run out of propane and then switch tanks u need to get the air out of the system fist by lighting up a burner on the stove for a minute then try light the heater back up but make sure your fridge is off of LP and turned on 110 volts so it don't burn the propane
You need to purge air out of both lines when first connecting or the auto feature will not work. To do that you connect both tanks, open one up, turn on stove, turn off stove. Close valve, then open second tank and turn on stove.
If you don't purge the lines the auto switch over will not work. I've done this every time I remove and install the tanks and never had it not switch over when needed.

Also, can't run 110AC when on battery power.
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Old 04-13-2015, 08:01 PM   #18
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I just upgraded the Battery on my HW276 to two 100ah AGM batteries and built a battery box. I haven't had a chance to try it out yet but hope to be able to get 6 nights on battery.
They will keep you going for a while. Are those group 27 or 31? And where did you get them; chain store? I found a few places online and prices are over 300 bucks per battery...
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Old 04-13-2015, 08:27 PM   #19
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They will keep you going for a while. Are those group 27 or 31? And where did you get them; chain store? I found a few places online and prices are over 300 bucks per battery...
They are group 27's, I picked them up at Battery Plus and was able to get the manager to take $50 off each Battery.
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Old 04-13-2015, 08:32 PM   #20
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Never heard of them before (Battery Plus), but find out there is a store about 3 miles south of me that has them at a great price. I'll have to do some research. I was just getting ready to order some trojan, flooded deep cycles.
Thanks,
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