Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-04-2014, 06:01 PM   #11
Boss Ox & Drovergirl
 
oxcamper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: N.E. Ohio Snow Belt
Posts: 671
Quote:
Originally Posted by Weezer View Post
Everyone of us when we have an issue with a unit should also contact FR's quality assurance to register a customer complaint, not just have it handled as a warranty issue.

Is there such a department to contact? If there is, every owner of a FR product should be made aware of it, and given information on how and where to contact said department.

We had a small leak coming from the forward vent in the "political sign plastic" belly liner of our 5er. Had that on the list we presented when we carried it in for warranty work in June. Thankfully for us, it was a small leak under the shower.

We only spotted the drip during one trip....very occasional drip from that vent. Sneak figured since we'd towed through rain it was road splash that got up into the underliner via that vent. Decided to get it checked, just in case. Fixed up now.
If you go to Forest River's main web site you won't find any contact #s. BUT if you google search Forest River Industries Elkhart, IN you get a Google map with -- guess what a phone #:

574-296-7700
I also yellow page and there are a number of contact numbers, I don't know which ones go to which divisions, but here's the link:
Forest River Rv in Elkhart, Indiana with Reviews & Ratings - YP.com


In my regular day job, I am the North America Quality Assurance Director for a major chemical company and a six sigma black belt (as well as a Salem Hemishpere owner). There is no excuse for this quality. And there is no excuse for the customer not to have a voice to the manufacturer. Some companies will only respond when they feel the "pain" i.e. extensive and overwhelming customer complaints. Warranty claims do not get the same degree of attention as that is a post delivery process which is already costed into your unit.

Forums like this are great for us, but I doubt whether the problems listed here (and other manufactured brand forums) are read by the manufacturer's representatives. The dealers are stuck in the middle, their livlihood is dependant on making our lives happier when we have a problem, they can fix things, but they are powerless to prevent things. Their primary job is to sell units.

So the best way is to find the avenue to the corporate people who can make things change and continue having the expectation that you will receive your unit 100% right, 100% of the time. I would not be as concerned if 100% of the delivered units were "stinkers" as the company would not be in business very long. My concern is that sometimes they do it right and well, and a lot of the times not. There doesn't seem to be good process control over their manufacturing processes. Eventually it will catch up with them but for now, it's my and your hard earned $$$ that at risk.
__________________

__________________
Mark, Vicki, & Scout THE dog
2015 Hemisphere 282RK
2010 F250 Super Duty
1992 Goldwing Aspencade
oxcamper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-04-2014, 06:19 PM   #12
Phat Phrogs Incognito...
 
DutchF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: North Central Texas
Posts: 200
Weezer, I definitely agree with you assessment. So far, I have call two RV repair facilities in El Paso (where we are now) and both said they would have someone call me back. Only the Camping World service advisor called me back. He said that given my travel schedule, if parts had to be ordered it would be 7 -10 days before they arrived and I would probably need to leave before the repair could be done. I agree and because of this, I will just fix it myself.

I also called my selling dealer and they said they would have someone call me back. That's been an hour and a half.

I was simply interested in the "warranty service process". I'm happy with the manufacturer, Columbus. I love the product and in no way regret the purchase. But I don't feel that a 2 month backlog (selling dealer) to fix something like this, is very good.

I am concerned (and I think others should be too) that this unit left the factory with the black and gray tanks just laying in the frame, able to slide (freely) forward nearly 2 feet, under moderate to heavy braking! Hope no one else's is like this. Simply dropping the belly and having a look could save you a LOT of grief. Just saying.
__________________

__________________

Tina + Dutch and Bell, Bobo, Harley, Buddy (the dogs)
2011 F350 Lariat 4x4 DRW SuperCrew 6.7L (B&W setup w/Air Lift 5000 Ultimate)
2014 Columbus 365RL (Airflex and Voyager package)
Nights Camped 2014 - 154, 2015 - 32, 2016 - 4
DutchF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-04-2014, 06:24 PM   #13
Phat Phrogs Incognito...
 
DutchF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: North Central Texas
Posts: 200
I'm going to do the repair, and send a write up on the symptom, cause, damage, repair and receipts, with photos ("just the facts Ma'am", LOL) to Cel Lopez and Sonja Smith at Columbus and see if I can get reimbursed. (I'm not counting on this) One thing is certain, it will be done right and cost a LOT less than the dealer filing a claim.

Happy RV'ing y'all, stay safe a Goshen!
__________________

Tina + Dutch and Bell, Bobo, Harley, Buddy (the dogs)
2011 F350 Lariat 4x4 DRW SuperCrew 6.7L (B&W setup w/Air Lift 5000 Ultimate)
2014 Columbus 365RL (Airflex and Voyager package)
Nights Camped 2014 - 154, 2015 - 32, 2016 - 4
DutchF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-04-2014, 07:43 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 288
In the assembly videos I saw, the tanks appeared to have no flange to secure them with vertical screws to the frame. It looked more like a ledge. Generally, I saw plywood floor placed over top and that is screwed down, relying on friction between the wood floor and the tank to hold it in position. The installation also depended on the drains into/out of the tank to hold it.
__________________
2014 Blue Ridge 3715BH <- Read the saga
2013 Sierra 3500HD Denali CCLB DRW 4x4 Duramax w/ Reese 20K
Camped: 2016=6, 2015=9, 2014=27

USN Retired (26 years), but not Retired retired
Home Port Orlando
Narboza is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2014, 09:59 AM   #15
Phat Phrogs Incognito...
 
DutchF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: North Central Texas
Posts: 200
Narboza, Would you mind either posting a link to that video or PM me with it? Thanks!

Regarding your comments, my physical observation is that there is just over 1" of clearance between the top of the gray and black tanks and the bottom of the flooring. That is, I can lift the tank up and shake them around or (as is the issue) slide them forward. The only thing preventing that is a single 3.75" hose clamp on a slip joint for the dump lines (outlet) and the drain (inlet) and vent line (inlet) on top, which push down through a rubber grommet. From and engineering standpoint, I would suggest that this is insufficient for proper tank retention. A bolted on cross brace at the front of each tank should have been (designed and) installed, during manufacturing.

In any case, I confirmed how the warranty repair go. And really I should have no complaint and there is no surprise. Most consumers would:
  • Experience and or observe the symptom of underbelly sag / leak.
  • Call and schedule taking it to the dealer for repair.
  • The dealer would confirm and diagnose the cause of the leak (with pictures).
  • The dealer would contact the factory warranty department and get authorization to repair and if needed order any parts.
  • The dealer would repair the unit and file a claim. (NOTE - depending on circumstances, the customer MIGHT have to pay for the repair, up front then file for reimbursement, if covered under warranty).
  • The customer could pick up the RV and resume using it.

The length of time the customer would be without the RV, could be anywhere from a day (if the dealer had time to repair it right away and did not need to order parts) to 2 or more months (as would be my case, since my dealer said they are at least 2 months behind).

In the case of this particular manufacturing oversight / design flaw, I found this to be unacceptable as we are set up in camp with children and pets and I'm working (remotely) 8 - 10 hours a day.

Instead, I ended up doing what I figured I would. Repairing it myself. The cost was about $50 for parts (bracing, sealer, clamp, fender washers and insulation) and it took about 3 hours (overall). I didn't need to break camp and haul everyone to a dealer, interrupting our trip or my work and I am confident that it is repaired correctly and the repair will not fail.

Separated the tank from the drain and cleaned the fitting joint:


NOTE - Imagine what fun it would be if you didn't have the retaining brace, had waste water in your tanks (especially the black one!), had to hit the brakes and the tank slid forward, separating. EEEK!!! I was able to easily push the tank forward this far, by hand. The lines going in the top started to provided limited resistance. If the tank were to slide forward with sufficient force, it *could* crack, break or pull the top lines out. Then you would have to remove the tank and have additional repairs. Not good.

Applied plumbers putty and be SURE it is for plastic! (it got dark by the time I took this):


Slide the tank fitting back onto the drain. Note that I chose to add a second clamp. (it got dark by the time I took this):


Tighten clamps and clean joint of excess putty. Clamps should NOT overlap. (it got dark by the time I took this):


I will post picture of the bracing to prevent the tanks from sliding forward, once I have them installed. Might be a day or two, as I have a "day job".

As a bonus (?) I had the opportunity to get up close and personal with the workings of the waste water draining system, cabling, wiring, plumbing, sealing, frame, braces, belly heating of the underside of the RV. This is valuable as it also allowed me to identify several areas that could easily, and inexpensively be improved upon both in function and reliability.

I found:
  • Electrical wiring hanging randomly, all over the place, some of which could get chaffed.
  • Wiring connections that were either loose or had the potential to pull loose.
  • Plumbing lines that could get chaffed and fitting that were not fully tightened (but not leaking)..
  • Waste water tanks that were not secured and pulled loose, resulting in a leak and damaged insulation.

So when we get home, I will drop the underbelly in the middle and rear and see what I can correct back there.

Happy Camping!
__________________

Tina + Dutch and Bell, Bobo, Harley, Buddy (the dogs)
2011 F350 Lariat 4x4 DRW SuperCrew 6.7L (B&W setup w/Air Lift 5000 Ultimate)
2014 Columbus 365RL (Airflex and Voyager package)
Nights Camped 2014 - 154, 2015 - 32, 2016 - 4
DutchF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2014, 06:27 PM   #16
Senior Member
 
gooiebob's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Kalamazoo
Posts: 129
Dutch,
We have a Rockwood 2703ws that I have removed the entire underbelly and reinstalled in four foot sections. Our fresh water tank was not secured from sliding sideways and bowed badly in the middle. I installed wood braces to the end of the tank to the frame and added a brace between the tank and braces holding it in to raise the middle. I actually get more water from the tank now.
Found the same wiring mess and potential problems from running down the road and wearing through things that shouldn't be worn through.
Did the same thing with the previous trailer and that's why I did this one.
Good luck
Bob
__________________
2013 Rockwood Ultra Lite 2703ws
2014 Toyota Tundra 5.7
gooiebob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2014, 08:36 PM   #17
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 288
I cannot locate the specific video, but search for "RV holding tanks" and you will find lots of dealers and pictures. Your tanks must have end ledges in order to slide. Mine have side ledges and are fitted to ride on the frame crossmembers.
__________________
2014 Blue Ridge 3715BH <- Read the saga
2013 Sierra 3500HD Denali CCLB DRW 4x4 Duramax w/ Reese 20K
Camped: 2016=6, 2015=9, 2014=27

USN Retired (26 years), but not Retired retired
Home Port Orlando
Narboza is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2014, 08:45 PM   #18
Phat Phrogs Incognito...
 
DutchF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: North Central Texas
Posts: 200
Thanks for checking. Our tanks have side ledges. The are mounted side by side, longitudinally, on rails bolted to a fore and aft cross member (parallel to the frame rails), with a center ledge support bar, welded to a fore and aft cross member. Hence the problem. They can slide forward under hard braking.
__________________

Tina + Dutch and Bell, Bobo, Harley, Buddy (the dogs)
2011 F350 Lariat 4x4 DRW SuperCrew 6.7L (B&W setup w/Air Lift 5000 Ultimate)
2014 Columbus 365RL (Airflex and Voyager package)
Nights Camped 2014 - 154, 2015 - 32, 2016 - 4
DutchF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2014, 10:00 PM   #19
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 235
Quote:
Originally Posted by DutchF View Post
Weezer, I definitely agree with you assessment. So far, I have call two RV repair facilities in El Paso (where we are now) and both said they would have someone call me back. Only the Camping World service advisor called me back. He said that given my travel schedule, if parts had to be ordered it would be 7 -10 days before they arrived and I would probably need to leave before the repair could be done. I agree and because of this, I will just fix it myself.

I also called my selling dealer and they said they would have someone call me back. That's been an hour and a half.

I was simply interested in the "warranty service process". I'm happy with the manufacturer, Columbus. I love the product and in no way regret the purchase. But I don't feel that a 2 month backlog (selling dealer) to fix something like this, is very good.

I am concerned (and I think others should be too) that this unit left the factory with the black and gray tanks just laying in the frame, able to slide (freely) forward nearly 2 feet, under moderate to heavy braking! Hope no one else's is like this. Simply dropping the belly and having a look could save you a LOT of grief. Just saying.
Dutch: I agree that two months bag log on repairs is ridiculous. BUT, my dealer, located very near yours, currently has a seven week wait period. It, in my opinion, is called selling high volumes of RV's and maintaining a small repair staff. Warranty repair centers are considered a profit loss by the dealers. I also had a leak from the shower plumbing. Water dripping from underbelly. It was repaired under warranty.

If you conduct the repair, visit the plumbing department of Home Depot and Lowes. They have a rubber coupler which splits on one side and you fasten with screws. Cannot think of the term for it, but readily available in various diameters. A battery operated drill with the proper style bit, in an extended length, would simplify the installation. Good luck on the issue.
__________________

__________________
l001952119 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
leak, underbelly, water, water leak

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




ForestRiverForums.com is not in any way associated with Forest River, Inc. or its associated RV manufacturing divisions.


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:45 AM.