Reported lost aircraft.

[B47]

Fox News is reporting that Malaysia Airlines reports it has lost contact with one of its Boeing 777's that was flying from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing.

Losing contact with a modern aircraft today is highly unusual given all the modern communication equipment plus on board Emergency Locator Transmitters (ELT) carried on board.

[Narboza]

An en route problem with a modern jet is very rare. The last one I can recall was AF447. From ASN.

Malaysia Airlines Flight MH-370 from Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia to Beijing, China was reported missing. There were 227 passengers and 12 crew members on board. The Boeing 777-2H6ER took off from Kuala Lumpur International Airport's runway 32R at 00:41 and climbed to a cruising altitude of FL350. Subang Air Traffic Control reported that it lost contact at 02.40 (local Malaysia time). Flight tracking website Flightradar24 showed a last contact at 02:20 at a position of 175 km NNE off the Malaysian coast and 223 km SW off the Vietnamese coast. A search is in progress.

This is very painful for relatives awaiting news of the search.

[Wiscampsin]

Saw it on the local news last night. Prayers for the passengers and their families.

[camaraderie]

Ditto that.
CNN reporting that two passengers were not aboard the plane. No distress call means something catastrophic. Hope we have some survivors.

"
Bits and pieces of information have begun to form, but it remains unclear how they fit into the bigger picture, if at all.
For instance, after the airline released a manifest, Austria denied that one of its citizens was onboard the flight as the list stated. The Austrian citizen was safe and sound, and his passport had been stolen two years ago, Austrian Foreign Ministry spokesman Martin Weiss told CNN.
Similarly, Italy's foreign ministry confirmed that no Italians were onboard MH370, even though an Italian was listed on the manifest. Malaysian officials said they were aware of reports that the Italian's passport was also stolen, but had not confirmed it."

[Weezer]

Not looking good;

Oil slick spotted in search for jetliner

Prayers up.

[B47]

This is indeed unusual - modern aircraft like this have all sorts of alarms,etc that go off if something like this occurs. I mentioned in my first post here that aircraft carry Electronic Locator Trransmitters that send a signal if the aircraft they're mounted in crashes.

What I failed to mention is if the Malaysian aviation rules are like the U.S.aviation rules,large aircraft don't carry ELT's as they usually operate under Instructment Flight Rules and are in constant commutation with reporting points.

[Ford Idaho]

Originally Posted by camaraderie

Ditto that.
CNN reporting that two passengers were not aboard the plane. No distress call means something catastrophic. Hope we have some survivors.

"
Bits and pieces of information have begun to form, but it remains unclear how they fit into the bigger picture, if at all.
For instance, after the airline released a manifest, Austria denied that one of its citizens was onboard the flight as the list stated. The Austrian citizen was safe and sound, and his passport had been stolen two years ago, Austrian Foreign Ministry spokesman Martin Weiss told CNN.
Similarly, Italy's foreign ministry confirmed that no Italians were onboard MH370, even though an Italian was listed on the manifest. Malaysian officials said they were aware of reports that the Italian's passport was also stolen, but had not confirmed it."

This bodes ill for those aboard the plane.

[B47]

Originally Posted by Ford Idaho

This bodes ill for those aboard the plane.

Yes it does. What puzzles me is there's no reports of an emergency signal (s) transmission. These aircraft contain signaling devices in their Flight Data Recorders that send out signals in the event of a crash. Also if the plane went into water AND the passengers had time to put on their life preservers, those life preservers have emergency transmitters that are activated if/when they are submerged in water.

I'm not going to speculate,but like the rest of you,I feel great pain for the survivors families.

[Herk7769]

As an Air Force crash investigator I can shed some light here.

Most (if not all) flight data recorders do not transmit data.
They just record it. The wire loop (not tape) is decoded after the box is recovered.

Some commercial aircraft have a radio link to the airlines maintenance shop that records data real time that can be used to troubleshoot problems the crew reports. The air data computer also can transmit data to ATC (like speed altitude and heading) but you need to be in radio contact to make that system work. It is what you see on Flightaware.Com and other flight following sites.
I believe none of that works over water out of radio contact.

You are correct about the box pinging but they have VERY limited range especially underwater.

Pilots are trained to "fly the aircraft first and foremost"
When you have control of the aircraft; then navigate
When you know you have the plane under control and are not going to hit anything THEN troubleshoot the problem and decide what to do.

After all that; then "communicate" with ATC.

In a catastrophic event, it is most likely they will never get "1" finished.

Oh, and locating that orange box is a real pain when the debris field is small and also when it is large.

This is a photo of a crash I investigated for the Air Force.

Too early to tell if it was a bomb (though it is likely), if it was an inflight breakup from severe turbulence or lightening strike, or if it was crew error.

[B47]

Originally Posted by Herk7769

As an Air Force crash investigator I can shed some light here.

Most (if not all) flight data recorders do not transmit data.
They just record it. The wire loop (not tape) is decoded after the box is recovered.

You are correct about the box pinging but they have VERY limited range especially underwater.

Pilots are trained to "fly the aircraft first and foremost"
When you have control of the aircraft; then navigate
When you know you have the plane under control and are not going to hit anything THEN troubleshoot the problem and decide what to do.

After all that; then "communicate" with ATC.

In a catastrophic event, it is most likely they will never get "1" finished.

Oh, and locating that orange box is a real pain when the debris field is small and also when it is large.

This is a photo of a crash I investigated for the Air Force.

Too early to tell if it was a bomb (though it is likely), if it was an inflight breakup from severe turbulence or lightening strike, or if it was crew error.

I believe that a bit more explanation of these two devices are necessary.

A Cockpit Voice Recorder (CVR) is a device usually located in the most rearward location of an airplane possible. The CVR does record the last 30 minutes of all cockpit discussions. They are very sensitive and will record almost any noise,talk,etc that occurs in the cockpit. They will even record the activation of a switch (on/off/neutral) which is very helpful when trying to determine when and if a system is activated,turned on/off.

A Flight Data Recorder (FDR) is another device located in the most rearward section of an airplane possible. The FDR records and retains movements of most all airplane movements such as rudder movement, flap movement , power lever (throttle) movement and position etc. the FDR data is preserved and is used in airplane incident/accident investigations plus any other event the NTSB wants to investigate.

Both of these devices are commonly called "Black Boxes" ,but are actually painted in International Orange to make their location easier.

Some of the data from these two boxes are available to the FAA,but most of it only available to the NTSB.

Lou - it looks to me like the tail of that C-130 is located in a populated area. Where was that?

[Herk7769]

Originally Posted by B47

Lou - it looks to me like the tail of that C-130 is located in a populated area. Where was that?

Tegucigalpa Honduras

Honduras Crash-1 Apr 1997 [Archive] - C-130 Hercules.net

https://www.google.com/search?q=tegu...w=1497&bih=885

Lots of bad info out there on causes and such, so Caveat Lector. Anyone who knows; can't say due to "privilege."

http://i0.wp.com/listverse.com/wp-co...size=632%2C379

[B47]

Originally Posted by Herk7769

Tegucigalpa Honduras

Honduras Crash-1 Apr 1997 [Archive] - C-130 Hercules.net

https://www.google.com/search?q=tegu...w=1497&bih=885

Lots of bad info out there on causes and such, so Caveat Lector. Anyone who knows; can't say due to "privilege."

http://i0.wp.com/listverse.com/wp-co...size=632%2C379

One of the people called the pilot a "hotshot". The pilot of that B52 who deliberately crashed at Fairchild AFB was also known as a "hotshot" or similar.

[Herk7769]

Originally Posted by B47

One of the people called the pilot a "hotshot". The pilot of that B52 who deliberately crashed at Fairchild AFB was also known as a "hotshot" or similar.

While the B-52 pilot in the Fairchild mishap "fit the mold" of "hot shot"; the pilot of the Honduras aircraft did not. Like I said, there is a lot of misinformation floating around.

Here is an "open source" look at the Fairchild crash.
I am not sure there is similar treatment for the Honduras one.
(Though there should be)

http://www.uscg.mil/safety/docs/CRM/...es_of_Blue.pdf

[jevanb]

sounds like the underwater acoustic beacon attached to the FDR is inop, it does have a limited life but our underwater network should of picked up it signature ping

[B47]

Originally Posted by jevanb

sounds like the underwater acoustic beacon attached to the FDR is inop, it does have a limited life but our underwater network should of picked up it signature ping

As you know,those beacon batteries are part of an air carriers maintenance program and should be replaced or tested ( whatever method is approved for them) as called out by the program. I believe (but not sure ) that their operating life is longer than the amount of time the aircraft crashed has been.

I have read that in some cases, the Ping has been blocked if the fuselage wreckage is laying over it.

Don't know much more. I'm a little surprised that the media is saying two oil slicks have been spotted that could have come from the aircrafts fuel tanks.

Oil slicks from fuel tanks?

[Herk7769]

Jet-A is wide cut Kerosene (#1 Fuel Oil) with anti-gel additives.
It floats on water and looks a lot like "oil"...

[B47]

Originally Posted by Herk7769

Jet-A is wide cut Kerosene (#1 Fuel Oil) with anti-gel additives.
It floats on water and looks a lot like "oil"...

Yes and it also evaporates after some time exposed to air, so it could be.

In addition, I haven't heard any definite repots that the aircraft crashed into water,unless I missed it.

[B47]

Originally Posted by Herk7769

While the B-52 pilot in the Fairchild mishap "fit the mold" of "hot shot"; the pilot of the Honduras aircraft did not. Like I said, there is a lot of misinformation floating around.

Here is an "open source" look at the Fairchild crash.
I am not sure there is similar treatment for the Honduras one.
(Though there should be)

http://www.uscg.mil/safety/docs/CRM/...es_of_Blue.pdf

Just too bad that Col.Holland elected to destroy a valuable aircraft and take the crew members with him.

[OldCoot]

If it were flying over N. Korea, something sinister could have happened. Hope that's not the case as the repercussions could be bad.

[Herk7769]

They were 1 hour after takeoff from Kuala Lumpur, Maylasia, over the South China Sea near Vietnam.

UPDATE: Vietnamese Authorities Report Oil Slick, Which Could Be Sign Of Missing Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370; 239 Passengers, Crew Missing

There are now reports of a distress signal (unconfirmed).