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Old 05-15-2013, 07:22 PM   #1
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installing satellite receiver

I'm sure I'll get some help on this one. We just purchased a new Rockwood Ultralite TT and the boss is hot to get a satellite system setup. We both have concerns about having a portable dish, mainly about bringing it in at night, etc because of concerns about theft. Anybody have a problem such as this? She's pushing for a permanent installation on the roof but i have concerns about putting new holes in the membrane. Is this something that i should be really concerned with due to roof warranty issues? I've seen a bracket that attaches portable units to a ladder and wondering if anyone has used this?

Any help is appreciated.
Kirk
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Old 05-15-2013, 07:34 PM   #2
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You can probably buy two Dish Tailgater's (portable) for what you'll pay for a roof mount. With a roof mount, what do you do when you're parked under trees?

The Tailgater has a place to attach a locking cable. Most people in a campground are pretty honest (but don't tempt them unnecessarily).

The Tailgater is extremely light so carrying it in (if you want to do that) is trivial. You just have to go thru setup again the next day, but that's easy and takes about 10 minutes.

Personally, I use a tripod and my own Dish that I got off of Craig's List. No one wants to steal that!
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Old 05-15-2013, 07:37 PM   #3
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Kirk
I use a Tailgater type and just put it on my roof
It works well for us as I don't always need or use it on every setup.
Iggy
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Old 05-15-2013, 09:36 PM   #4
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installing satellite receiver

Barry, you make a good point about trees causing a problem with permanent mounts. I also hear you about most people being honest. I've never had a problem in 20 years except for one time someone stole my beer. So, did you find a tailgater on craigslist or something else?

Iggy, that sounds like a good solution. Do you do anything to prevent it from blowing off the roof or do you bring it down under windy conditions?

Kirk
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Old 05-15-2013, 09:40 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kirkp View Post
Barry, you make a good point about trees causing a problem with permanent mounts. I also hear you about most people being honest. I've never had a problem in 20 years except for one time someone stole my beer. So, did you find a tailgater on craigslist or something else?

Iggy, that sounds like a good solution. Do you do anything to prevent it from blowing off the roof or do you bring it down under windy conditions?

Kirk
I do have a rope I wrap around the AC unit and dish handle but it hasn't moved even in high winds. Most never even know it is up there.
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Old 05-16-2013, 08:53 AM   #6
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...
So, did you find a tailgater on craigslist or something else?
I bought the tripod and the round metal satellite "dish" (and the LNB that goes on it) off of Craig's List. (The previous owner used it for football tailgate parties.)

It's a matter of price vs. convenience (and the fact that I like to do things myself). With the Tailgater, it's all automatic but will set you back about $350. I spent $40 on the dish & tripod, and another $30 on a meter (to help with pointing the dish). It takes me about 10 minutes to put it all together at the campground and about another 10 minutes to get it pointing at the satellites correctly. (I hear that you can go to the shop of many Dish installers and they'll just give you a "dish"; still have to have a way to mount it.)
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Old 05-16-2013, 09:11 AM   #7
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Mine.
All free.

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Old 05-16-2013, 09:15 AM   #8
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This is what I used to use when I travelled.
It is a homemade low profile ground mount.
The dish sits this way and if you are interested in this method here is a link to the website on the design and modifications on alignment.

LINK TO DESIGN PAGE
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Old 05-16-2013, 09:39 AM   #9
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Thanks Iggy! That's really cool! Only downside I see is that it looks like the dish will hold water if it's raining.
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Old 05-17-2013, 06:30 AM   #10
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First off, you have all been great help and I might be getting the hand of this. This of course brings up more questions.

I've been looking on craigslist and have found some dish satellites. If I understand correctly, the LNB is the receiver piece sitting in the front of the dish. Is there a way to test these on a used dish to make sure there's no problem or don't they go bad?

I've noticed that some satellites support two receivers and some only one (I think the tailgater is only one). Is this referring to simultaneous viewing of different channels? We will be getting a TV for the bedroom in our new Rockwood 2604WS TT. So I'm guessing that we'll need a receiver for both TVs OR since my wife usually goes to bed before I do she'd be forced to watch what I'm watching. I'm not even sure if we had one receiver in the living room if the bedroom would get satellite or if it would only get broadcast TV.

Finally, I've seen Dish offers a Vip211K receiver and i'm wondering if it's any good?

thanks for all your help.
Kirk
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Old 05-17-2013, 07:13 AM   #11
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I just bought a vip211k receiver and found out something that might save you some time. When you get a brand new 211k it has to download software from the satellite before you can point the dish. The only way to do this is to take the receiver to a Dish dealer or if you have Dish in your home you can hook it to your home satellite and plug it in and it will download the software. It won't work without this step. After spending the better part of two days and numerous phone calls to Dish, I finally found a tech that knew this and told me about it. Once I had the software installed it was no problem aiming the dish.
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Old 05-17-2013, 07:15 AM   #12
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By the way, I like the receiver, it is small and fits well in the camper.
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Old 05-17-2013, 08:05 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kirkp View Post
First off, you have all been great help and I might be getting the hand of this. This of course brings up more questions.

I've been looking on craigslist and have found some dish satellites. If I understand correctly, the LNB is the receiver piece sitting in the front of the dish. Is there a way to test these on a used dish to make sure there's no problem or don't they go bad?
I don't believe there is any way to test them other than using them. You could ask the seller to demonstrate it perhaps. I must say however that they seem to be pretty rugged.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kirkp View Post
I've noticed that some satellites support two receivers and some only one (I think the tailgater is only one). Is this referring to simultaneous viewing of different channels? We will be getting a TV for the bedroom in our new Rockwood 2604WS TT. So I'm guessing that we'll need a receiver for both TVs OR since my wife usually goes to bed before I do she'd be forced to watch what I'm watching. I'm not even sure if we had one receiver in the living room if the bedroom would get satellite or if it would only get broadcast TV.
Yes, the Tailgater supports only one receiver. I doubt you'll find a LNB that doesn't support at least two receivers. Buy at least a Dish-500. That one supports two satellites (has two "horns" on the front). You'll see that there are three coax connectors on the LNB: Two outputs and one input (for chaining other dishes into that one). That then supports two different receivers. Turbs' picture above is the three-horn 1000. It supports three satellites (and three receivers). (Those numbers are not tied together even though it looks that way.) I personally use the 500 because it is smaller and I've found (at least for my 120 channels with HD) that I only really need two Sats (119 & 129).

You can get a receiver that will support two TVs (eg, two different channels), or you can get a receiver for each TV. You're right: One receiver = One channel normally (except for the duals). (We can teach you later how to send one-channel of satellite to multiple TV's if you wanted to do that.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by kirkp View Post
Finally, I've seen Dish offers a Vip211K receiver and i'm wondering if it's any good?

thanks for all your help.
Kirk
That is the only receiver that can be used with the Tailgater.

I have had two of them in my home for about 5 years now, one of which I take to my RV for traveling. I don't have anything to compare against (other than the DVR on the other TV) but I'd say it's fine. Note that you can buy your own external hard-drive (like from Best Buy) and for a one-time fee (~$40) Dish will zap your 211 to become a single-channel DVR).
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Old 05-17-2013, 08:09 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by comfun1 View Post
I just bought a vip211k receiver and found out something that might save you some time. When you get a brand new 211k it has to download software from the satellite before you can point the dish. The only way to do this is to take the receiver to a Dish dealer or if you have Dish in your home you can hook it to your home satellite and plug it in and it will download the software. It won't work without this step. After spending the better part of two days and numerous phone calls to Dish, I finally found a tech that knew this and told me about it. Once I had the software installed it was no problem aiming the dish.
Interesting. I recently helped a friend set up his new Tailgater. It did have to download software as you said, but it had no problem doing that thru the Tailgater. I can see that it would be tough to do with a standalone Dish however, so excellent advice.
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Old 05-18-2013, 08:37 AM   #15
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Once again, thanks to all for your help and patience.

Been doing some more research and thinking about my situation and came to the realization that the dual receive issue might be a moot point. The arrangement in my TT isn't really conducive to putting a receiver in the bedroom so I'll probably be in touch with Iggy sooner than later to find out how to feed two TVs off one satellite feed.

Something I read though (about the Winegard Carryout unit) is that it has two inputs for two receivers. My TT has one satellite hookup on the exterior. If I used it to bring the feed into the TT, can you even hook two receivers up inside and get different programming for individual TVs?

Regarding the post about the vp211k receiver and needing to download software from the satellite. Barry indicated the Tailgater had no problem and I'm assuming this is because it automatically locates the satellite? If that's the case, if you used the available satellite locator information and a signal meter, couldn't you locate the satellite and then have the receiver download the needed programming? Not that having Dish do this is an issue since it sounds like a onetime thing. Just curious.

Kirk
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:13 AM   #16
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Questions 1
I've been looking on craigslist and have found some dish satellites. If I understand correctly, the LNB is the receiver piece sitting in the front of the dish. Is there a way to test these on a used dish to make sure there's no problem or don't they go bad?
Answer
Yes but you must be able to hook up to a receiver to test and see the advance numbers. If I'm not mistaken you want Zero reading on the tests and if get like a -10 if bad.

Question 2
I've noticed that some satellites support two receivers and some only one (I think the tailgater is only one). Is this referring to simultaneous viewing of different channels? We will be getting a TV for the bedroom in our new Rockwood 2604WS TT. So I'm guessing that we'll need a receiver for both TVs OR since my wife usually goes to bed before I do she'd be forced to watch what I'm watching. I'm not even sure if we had one receiver in the living room if the bedroom would get satellite or if it would only get broadcast TV.
Answer
Most LNB have 2 output to two separate receiver boxes.
I usually hook my box up to my main TV and watch regular local antenna or RV park cable on bedroom and or main TV

Question 3
Finally, I've seen Dish offers a Vip211K receiver and I’m wondering if it's any good?
Answer
If is the smallest most compact Receiver Dish Network has and is the only one that will work on a tailgater dish antenna

I just use my tailgater when I go to places like the north end of Mexico or the Florida Keys where they have no local channels. Dish network is the only one that you can pay for one month and stop the next without penalty. It is designed for RVers


If you have a dual LNB and two recivers you can get two signals from the same satillites. This is my head and I think it has two outputs but never used it on two recievers.
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:29 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kirkp View Post
I've noticed that some satellites support two receivers and some only one (I think the tailgater is only one). Is this referring to simultaneous viewing of different channels? We will be getting a TV for the bedroom in our new Rockwood 2604WS TT. So I'm guessing that we'll need a receiver for both TVs OR since my wife usually goes to bed before I do she'd be forced to watch what I'm watching. I'm not even sure if we had one receiver in the living room if the bedroom would get satellite or if it would only get broadcast TV.

Finally, I've seen Dish offers a Vip211K receiver and i'm wondering if it's any good?

thanks for all your help.
Kirk
Kirk. The satellite dishes that support two receivers is just that. They have two outputs, but to view two different channels on two different TVs you will need two separate receivers.

We have the Winegard Carryout, which has two outputs as opposed to the tailgater which only has one. It can be used with either DirecTV or DishNetwork... the caveat is that it cannot receive DirecTV HD, but can receive Dish HD. Ours was installed through the roof by our dealer (figured this was best way to keep warranty intact). It is removable from a ladder mount and can then be used on an optional tripod if your site does not give you a look at the satellite. There are provisions on the Carryout to lock it to the ladder mount for additonal security. We've had no problems with reception in campgrounds - we always try to pick a site with clear views to Southwest for DirecTV.

I've heard good reports on the Dish VIP211. Nice thing with that is you can subscribe to Dish on a month by month basis, rather than having to sign up for a contract. There is one downside to DishNetwork... their satellite is at a lower angle to the horizon, and many times you'll have a hard time getting a fix on their satellite if there are trees in the area.

You may want to consider an upgrade to your rooftop antenna. There is an add-on for Winegard Sensar called Wingman, which does a great job, and a lot of people have replaced the Winegard with the Jack antenna. If you are traveling a great distance from your home, you won't be able to pick up your local channels, and the rooftop over-the-air antenna will usually pick these up in whatever area you are in (not your home channels).

Good luck with your decision.
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:46 AM   #18
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Once again, thanks to all for your help and patience.

Been doing some more research and thinking about my situation and came to the realization that the dual receive issue might be a moot point. The arrangement in my TT isn't really conducive to putting a receiver in the bedroom so I'll probably be in touch with Iggy sooner than later to find out how to feed two TVs off one satellite feed.

Something I read though (about the Winegard Carryout unit) is that it has two inputs for two receivers. My TT has one satellite hookup on the exterior. If I used it to bring the feed into the TT, can you even hook two receivers up inside and get different programming for individual TVs?
If you got something like the Dish ViP Duo 222 receiver, it sits in the living room and yet can deliver a different channel into the bedroom. (There is a separate remote control for the bedroom TV as well.) Note that the receiver can only deliver standard-definition reception to the bedroom TV. (If you want HD in both places, you have to have two receivers.)

This receiver has to have two Sat inputs, but you can connect them to one coax with a Dish "separator" (like a splitter) so could still use the single Sat-In cable your RV has. (I don't know if you can use that "separator" for two different receivers or if it has to be used with a receiver that has two inputs.)

If you're happy with just having the same channel on both TVs, all of this is unnecessary.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kirkp View Post
Regarding the post about the vp211k receiver and needing to download software from the satellite. Barry indicated the Tailgater had no problem and I'm assuming this is because it automatically locates the satellite? If that's the case, if you used the available satellite locator information and a signal meter, couldn't you locate the satellite and then have the receiver download the needed programming? Not that having Dish do this is an issue since it sounds like a onetime thing. Just curious.
Kirk
You can probably do that; I don't know if that download requires a certain one of the three satellites or if it can work with any of them. (I sometimes end up initially pointing at a different two than I thought I had and can't tell that until I can see what the receiver is telling me.)
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Old 05-18-2013, 02:00 PM   #19
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Important new information!

I have learned that the Winegard "Carryout" units are not compatible with the "Dish Separator" I mentioned earlier. If you want to use that with the Dual-TV receiver (like the Vip222k), you have to run two separate coax cables between the receiver and the WineGard "Carryout". (That's not necessarily a show-stopper in my opinion, but just wanted to make you aware of it.)

Secondly, if you're going to buy your own Dish/LNB, make sure it has a "Plus" on the label. (See Iggy's pictures above.) It has to be "Dish Pro Plus". If it is not, then again, you cannot use a Separator to utilize just the single coax your RV has installed.

Finally, it is not possible to drive two separate receivers with the Separator. It has to be a "dual receiver" in order for that to work.
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Old 06-04-2013, 06:37 AM   #20
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The Boss TEMPORARILY decided she didn't want to take the plunge on a satellite system. That is until our maiden trip in our new TT. Rainy one day and cold/damp the next and what can only be described as really, really bad TV didn't help matters any. Then when the neighboring trailer plopped their satellite down it sealed the deal.


The unit they had was the vucube manual dish and when I looked into it I found that this same company makes the tailgater. I was surprised that it cost almost twice as much as the tailgater which is automatic. wondering if anyone knows what justifies the price difference? I saw that the tailgater is a dish only product while the vucube can be used on different services. Both are set up for one receiver. Anything else?


thanks,
Kirk
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