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Old 10-19-2020, 11:52 PM   #61
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That’s hilarious!!! But accurate!
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Old 10-20-2020, 05:06 AM   #62
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Sounds like several issues. Wrong truck. Diesels are meant to be worked Hard. Under light loads the turbos carbon up and all sorts of other issues. Also, people tend to buy bio diesel or 10% bio. If left in tank too long it will dry out the engine internal gaskets and cause massive failure. At 10,500 lb go trade it for a gas truck.
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Old 10-20-2020, 08:43 AM   #63
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I bought my 2007 nearly 7 years ago with 113,000 miles on it. I negotiated a great price on it and researched the problem areas of the the big three before deciding on this truck.

I replaced the FICM to correct the cold start problem it had at the time. Three years in I replaced the EGR with the Bulletproof Diesel EGR and replaced the oil cooler with a Ford Motorcraft part at the same time. I was losing a bit of coolant and running a bit on the hot side prior to that. The FICM, EGR and Oil Cooler are all 100,000 mile maintenance items, just like a timing belt would be on a car.

I have logged 55,000 miles on mine pulling 5,000-14,000 pound trailers. I can run 70-80 mph pulling a loaded car hauler and 70ish pulling my 5th wheel.

My current setup is a Fleetwood 335fs Fifth wheel toy hauler. No complaints here. Maintain it and use it as it is meant to be used and you will be happy.
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Old 10-20-2020, 09:37 AM   #64
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IF you keep it and decide to Bulletproof it, make sure it IS bulletproofed, if not, then it will be even more expensive next go around since major components may need replacement. Also make sure all the head studs and nuts are replaced with ARP. Head studs are the weakest components in the 6.0, the cause of most gasket failures, so you want the best in it.

If you decide to replace it, a 6.7 used is ~$30K for the 2011 and up. So $6500 vs $30,000, seems like the $6500 is a better choice provided the rest of the truck is solid.

I made a HUGE mistake in getting rid of my 99 F350 Dually 7.3. It was a garage queen, sat getting rusty brakes, but ran great, needed a trans rebuild, which back in 2012 was ~$4500, needed a new steering gear box, shocks, and full brakes, and back then it would cost more to repair than worth, so traded it in. Today that truck would be worth far more than it was back then. Who would have known the value of the 7.3 would have gone up like it did. In some cases it is worth spending the money to repair than to replace.
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Old 10-20-2020, 09:38 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by stepheneadams View Post
That is where all the $ signs come from. I have watched every 6.0L video on youtube since buying the truck. Don't really wish to spend all those $ but I do know there will never be another big issue with there truck once it is bulletproofed.
Forgive me for not knowing but what do you mean when you refer to bulletproofing?
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Old 10-20-2020, 10:32 AM   #66
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Forgive me for not knowing but what do you mean when you refer to bulletproofing?
Bullet Proofing is a manufacturer's term for addressing the weak points by upgrading the following items:

1. Upgraded head studs
2. Aftermarket, rebuilt EGR Cooler
3. Replace or add on an external Oil Cooler
4. Upgraded aftermarket FICM
5. Some choose to add on an aftermarket tuner/programmer

All in all, the 2003-2004 model years were a time of trial and error for the 6.0 engine. By the time the 2005-2007's were rolling out there had been well over 400 changes to address the deficiencies of the earlier years.

I am picky with my mechanics and maintain my truck like a high maintenance girlfriend. Both the mechanics I have had have told me to not put on a tuner or programmer unless the head studs are replaced with the aftermarket ones. Both have stated Bulletproofing is a want for those who have the money to spend, vs a need. They tell me just maintain it and use it as it is intended and it will treat me well. The mechanic I have now does the "Bulletproofing" service for those that want to turn their Diesel trucks into the high performance types of machines.
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Old 10-20-2020, 10:50 AM   #67
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Whats sad is the 6.0 and 6.4 were Internationals (Navistar), same as the 7.3. The 7.3, especially the early ones with forged rods, were beasts. Very strong internals and block and could take up to stage 3 injectors without breaking. 01-03 switched to powdered rods and could shatter with stage 3 injectors.

Then they made the 6.0 which could barely contain oem injectors without blowing a gasket. The 6.4 was the final nail in the coffin between Ford and Navistar, and Ford designed their own Powerstroke, the 6.7. too bad they didn't stick with the 7.3 and just work to make it more efficient and cleaner, but they had to have the EGR system, which the 7.3 had no provisions for.

If keeping the 6.0, just make sure it is done right with quality parts.
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Old 10-20-2020, 11:03 AM   #68
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Originally Posted by RockyMtnFamily View Post
Bullet Proofing is a manufacturer's term for addressing the weak points by upgrading the following items:

1. Upgraded head studs
2. Aftermarket, rebuilt EGR Cooler
3. Replace or add on an external Oil Cooler
4. Upgraded aftermarket FICM
5. Some choose to add on an aftermarket tuner/programmer

All in all, the 2003-2004 model years were a time of trial and error for the 6.0 engine. By the time the 2005-2007's were rolling out there had been well over 400 changes to address the deficiencies of the earlier years.

I am picky with my mechanics and maintain my truck like a high maintenance girlfriend. Both the mechanics I have had have told me to not put on a tuner or programmer unless the head studs are replaced with the aftermarket ones. Both have stated Bulletproofing is a want for those who have the money to spend, vs a need. They tell me just maintain it and use it as it is intended and it will treat me well. The mechanic I have now does the "Bulletproofing" service for those that want to turn their Diesel trucks into the high performance types of machines.

I've found that different shops have different interpretations of what engine components should be replaced in their "bullet-proofing" services. Most include the above-listed components, but others also include new glow plugs and fuel injectors, which was included in my bullet-proofing job. However, my shop did not recommend any after market performance tuner as part of that service.

One other note is the quality of the parts listed above are much higher than those the engine originally came with from the factory (which translates into much longer part longevity and dependability). My shop only uses re-engineered FoMoCo parts that come with a two year warranty for all their bullet-proofing work.
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Old 10-20-2020, 11:24 AM   #69
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Trade it!

So I was a 6.0 guy. Loved it. Took METICULUS care of it. Upgraded FICM, water pumps, etc, etc. Not bullet proof but darn close. Kept eating injectors like it was candy despite PERFECT fuel pressures. The tips would crack or break and when they broke, hydrolock occurred as the fuel would dump into the chamber. Found myself being heavy haul towed twice (once on Christmas Eve) and also had to replace 2 injectors at Fort Wilderness (thank goodness my mechanical farm skills allowed me to do so).

But we traded her because it took away from the fun of being able to travel and relax. As my signature on the Powerstroke.org forum states "Pity the fool who bought it".
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Old 10-20-2020, 12:55 PM   #70
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2006 Ford F250 Super Duty

Yep. I had one too. I made the mistake of trading in a 2002 Ford 7.3 on this truck because of the better transmission that gears down much better pulling a trailer downhill. I have a 36 ft. 5th wheel (empty weight of 10,700 #). My truck made it 106K miles before it cratered on me. First time was in Oklahoma on my way back home to DFW area. It was the EGR cooler that failed. Had it towed to Ford dealer in Durant, OK. The repair was over $4K. However, what really upset me was that six weeks later it failed me again in New Mexico on my way to Colorado. Had to leave it at Ford dealer in Raton for a week. This time it was another related part that failed and the cost was over $1300. When I asked the Raton dealership why the Durant dealership would not have suggested this second repair while they had it torn down, I got a simple "I dunno". At least doing that would have saved me a little labor cost during the first repair. I tried complaining to the Durant Ford dealer to no avail.



Anyway, after spending close to $6K on this truck, my guess is it would have been fine. However, my wife said to get rid of it because we couldn't trust it on another trip. I traded it on a one-year old 2013 Chevy Silverado (Duramax) and have never looked back. I'm done with Fords!
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Old 10-20-2020, 01:18 PM   #71
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Yep. I had one too. I made the mistake of trading in a 2002 Ford 7.3 on this truck because of the better transmission that gears down much better pulling a trailer downhill. I have a 36 ft. 5th wheel (empty weight of 10,700 #). My truck made it 106K miles before it cratered on me. First time was in Oklahoma on my way back home to DFW area. It was the EGR cooler that failed. Had it towed to Ford dealer in Durant, OK. The repair was over $4K. However, what really upset me was that six weeks later it failed me again in New Mexico on my way to Colorado. Had to leave it at Ford dealer in Raton for a week. This time it was another related part that failed and the cost was over $1300. When I asked the Raton dealership why the Durant dealership would not have suggested this second repair while they had it torn down, I got a simple "I dunno". At least doing that would have saved me a little labor cost during the first repair. I tried complaining to the Durant Ford dealer to no avail.



Anyway, after spending close to $6K on this truck, my guess is it would have been fine. However, my wife said to get rid of it because we couldn't trust it on another trip. I traded it on a one-year old 2013 Chevy Silverado (Duramax) and have never looked back. I'm done with Fords!
Hate to tell you this, but Dmax's have issues too.

http://www.duramaxhub.com/duramax-problems.html
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Old 10-20-2020, 01:25 PM   #72
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Yep...@007matman is right. All manufacturers have their Achilles heel. Emissions on these rigs are becoming more and more complex robbing power and creating more failure points. But I do love my new 6.7 and it's been incredibly reliable (knock on wood).
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Old 10-20-2020, 02:25 PM   #73
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It's a vicious cycle. Done with Fords, got a GM, GM breaks a few times, Done with GM, got a RAM, Ram breaks a few times, Done with Ram, back to Ford. C'mon, say there isn't some truth to this.

I have a fully deleted 2012 6.7, no EGR, no DPF, no DEF use(I didn't do it, came that way, didn't know it until already bought and home), and a real power house, BUT it still has one item that can be extremely expensive to repair when it goes bad, the fuel pump. Duramax has the same pump as well. ANY moisture gets into the fuel system, and kiss the entire system along with $10,000 goodbye. Fingers crossed it never happens to this truck, but sure makes me wish for a good old 7.3 even if it has half the power. At the very least the fuel system is not that expensive to repair, if the pump goes bad, just replace it, not the entire system like the 6.7. The 6.7 has one shot use fuel lines and injectors, and they are NOT cheap!

Needless to say, doesn't matter who makes it, any diesel today is a crap shoot for break downs, and if you can build a strong reliable one out of the 6.0, go for it.
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Old 10-20-2020, 03:44 PM   #74
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We had an 05 and had issues also. Most were fixed by using ARP head hardware set, a "Bullit proof" (trade name), oil cooler and upgraded head gaskets. The Ford dealer here says that this had been done on all ambulances in town with no issues, but not pulling.
We did have several injectors fail, some under warranty and several our pocket book.
Three turbos and an intercooler.
Bought a new 17 and love it pulls great and much easier to drive. We have 26K miles on it with 21K pulling our 27" trailer. So far no issues but with the addition of our Honda SXS in the bed it wants to overheat a little going up the mountains here in Colorado but were told that is noware near the worry mode, just pull my foot out of it a little and off we go.
Last trip we averaged 12.3 MPG. Not great but not bad for an easy pull.
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Old 10-20-2020, 05:51 PM   #75
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Bit by everything!

I also have a couple Ford 6.0 work trucks. My dually never needs antifreeze. Pulls hard, starts and runs good, but it decided to only run diesel for coolant. I bought it cheap and it works. My daily farm truck is a really clean rust free, 4x4 that is a stock pooch, but always starts and goes. $2,500 each. Can’t beat it.
My son and I both tow the fivers with 6.7 Rams. His long distance daily driver is an ‘11 6.6 GMC and our little parts runner is my new 2.7 F150 or his 3.0 diesel Ram.
My Studebakers are offended by abusing their name in association with bad diesels. My Avanti, GT Hawk, or ‘27 Standard 6 have never had major repairs.
As for the learning and brand conscious curve; I owned an amazingly bad 5.7 diesel with TH 200 trans in a ‘79 Seville. At 40k I built up a 425 Olds and TH 400 and drove it 8 years.
If you like your vehicle, work around the company’s mistakes. They’ve all made some. Tear into it. You’ll find some gear heads that want to help. You might have fun.
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Old 10-20-2020, 07:00 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by efi460 View Post
I also have a couple Ford 6.0 work trucks. My dually never needs antifreeze. Pulls hard, starts and runs good, but it decided to only run diesel for coolant. I bought it cheap and it works. My daily farm truck is a really clean rust free, 4x4 that is a stock pooch, but always starts and goes. $2,500 each. Can’t beat it.
My son and I both tow the fivers with 6.7 Rams. His long distance daily driver is an ‘11 6.6 GMC and our little parts runner is my new 2.7 F150 or his 3.0 diesel Ram.
My Studebakers are offended by abusing their name in association with bad diesels. My Avanti, GT Hawk, or ‘27 Standard 6 have never had major repairs.
As for the learning and brand conscious curve; I owned an amazingly bad 5.7 diesel with TH 200 trans in a ‘79 Seville. At 40k I built up a 425 Olds and TH 400 and drove it 8 years.
If you like your vehicle, work around the company’s mistakes. They’ve all made some. Tear into it. You’ll find some gear heads that want to help. You might have fun.
Man, I worked on a zillion of those 5.7s back in the 80's when I was an automotive machinist. I was the cylinder head specialist in my shop and those things blew head gaskets constantly. The block was basically a gusseted Olds 350, but the heads were unique to the diesels. We had tons of them come in, just for a light resurface - we wouldn't even take them apart.

The first set I worked on, I destroyed.

I didn't realize that the cast iron head had a little pressed-in stainless steel injection port - about the same diameter as a nickel, and that one of the reasons the head gaskets failed was because the gasket crossed over that insert. So, if you overheated one, the SS and the cast iron expanded at different rates and the head gasket would fail.

Anyway, part of my job was resurfacing cylinder heads on a grinding machine. I was in a hurry and let it get too warm, which caused the stainless inserts to expand (more than the cast iron surrounding them) - and then I ground the tops off of them. Once the heads cooled down, the inserts were recessed almost 0.010".

There's just no way for head gasket to seal with a 10 thousandths depression under it (on every cylinder) .... I thought about just grinding the heads more to even it out, but I would have had to take at least another 12-15 thousandths off of the surface of the head, for a total of 25-30 thousandths, and that would have put me in danger of hosing the valve train geometry or even bottoming out the hydraulic lifters.

Luckily, my boss was slightly unethical *and* a packrat, and he had a set of heads sitting in a corner of the shop. He called the customer and told him that both heads were cracked, but that he had a spare set and he would swap him straight across.

So I didn't get fired and I didn't have to pay out of pocket for my stupid mistake - A *huge* relief to 19-year-old me!
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Old 10-21-2020, 01:53 PM   #77
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Bullet proof good and costs less than new

For ailing 6.0, 2 good answers:

1--Bulletproof by good shop $6K or a bit more. You'll have your known truck with a better-than-new, rock-solid engine.

2--New truck. Ballpark $60K + tax + insurance + incidentals. You'll have whatever you get at that price with lots of bells, whistles and comfy new seats and a new (hopefully rock-solid) engine.

Both give you the last truck you'll ever "need."

Either is a great answer if you have the money.

Trading for used is too complicated to discuss.
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Old 10-22-2020, 05:40 PM   #78
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Well it is confirmed to be the egr cooler. So new oil cooler, new apr and a vanishing egr cooler is in the works. Should have it back tomorrow for just under $2k. This will keep me going for some time.
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Old 10-22-2020, 06:06 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RockyMtnFamily View Post
I bought my 2007 nearly 7 years ago with 113,000 miles on it. I negotiated a great price on it and researched the problem areas of the the big three before deciding on this truck.

I replaced the FICM to correct the cold start problem it had at the time. Three years in I replaced the EGR with the Bulletproof Diesel EGR and replaced the oil cooler with a Ford Motorcraft part at the same time. I was losing a bit of coolant and running a bit on the hot side prior to that. The FICM, EGR and Oil Cooler are all 100,000 mile maintenance items, just like a timing belt would be on a car.

I have logged 55,000 miles on mine pulling 5,000-14,000 pound trailers. I can run 70-80 mph pulling a loaded car hauler and 70ish pulling my 5th wheel.

My current setup is a Fleetwood 335fs Fifth wheel toy hauler. No complaints here. Maintain it and use it as it is meant to be used and you will be happy.
Once you correct the 6.0s design flaws it runs like a monster. Looking forward to have mine back tomorrow with its partial bulletproofing. I don't run HOT tunes so I should get a lot of miles with factory head bolts.
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Old 10-23-2020, 05:51 PM   #80
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Well....picked up the truck (oil cooler, e** delete, turbo cleaned, ipr valve) and by the time I was close to home (40min) it was running rough. At low speed and idle the truck was shaking. Almost like it was "missing". Maybe something simple like something not plugged in solidly?

Wish I knew how to add a video...

Clearly going back to shop on Monday if I can't figure it out.
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