Camco Recurve R3 hitch issue

[TheMarkles]

For fellow R3 users, just want to tell/show you what happened to me on my last trip. As I was heading up I95 (cruise on - 65 mph) heard a large bang and felt a slight thump but then nothing.. pulled over did a quick walkaround didn't see anything. At the campground while setting up I noticed my hitch bolts had slipped.. leaving my hitch at a very sharp angle - the pressure on the bars was so great I had to get a separate jack to get my trailer tongue up enough to get them off. Scratched my head a while then decided to just take it apart and set it up. (I used an impact wrench and torqued per the install manual). Bringing it home today it happened again.. went through the whole process again of taking it apart and putting it back together, moved it 80 feet, slipped .. Hitch is off now, only thing I can think of is the conical washers that squeeze the hitch to the chank wear out/deform, they chewed up some metal. Went online, I can buy a new bolt kit but I emailed CAMCO to see what they say first. I like(d?) this hitch and know my alternatives, just wanted to make other users of this hitch aware.

[lizARdman15]

From the time I bought my camper, I used the R3 when I towed with the F150.

I never had the same problem, but I did have an issue with it that required an email. A guy from their customer service called me with the solution.

As far as your problem, the only guess is that you have not torqued the bolts well enough. Normally I just tighten to a good level of grunt tight, but I actually put the torque wrench on this and it never budged. Now that it has already slipped multiple times, it may slip now regardless of torque unless some new parts come into play.

When you get it working right, it really is a pretty good WDH

[TheMarkles]

Originally Posted by lizARdman15

From the time I bought my camper, I used the R3 when I towed with the F150.

I never had the same problem, but I did have an issue with it that required an email. A guy from their customer service called me with the solution.

As far as your problem, the only guess is that you have not torqued the bolts well enough. Normally I just tighten to a good level of grunt tight, but I actually put the torque wrench on this and it never budged. Now that it has already slipped multiple times, it may slip now regardless of torque unless some new parts come into play.

When you get it working right, it really is a pretty good WDH

I never checked the dealers torque when they initially set it up, could have been finger tight but who knows at this point. It has served me well, not sure if it salvageablle. $80 for new bolts vs $800 or so for a new hitch is more palatable, we'll see what Camco says. One thing for sure I should have paid a more attention to it. Thanx

[wlfclf2000]

Look at post #25 by jlankford here:

https://www.forestriverforums.com/fo...-278332-2.html

You may be able to add the washer as in this post. On mine the top closed well but the bottom did not. I intend to add a washer to both top and bottom, so it is tight against the shank.

[TheMarkles]

Update - first thanks to everyone for the posts and emails on this, I also contacted CAMCO and their response was similar. to sum it all up "TORQUE"

So I took the hitch apart "again", and reassembled it "again" using all the original parts, done as per the installation manual. Wife came out to offer support (and to keep me from chucking the whole thing into the woods - not literally). After using an impact wrench to set the bolts, I grabbed a torque wrench from the truck (I have two, a 10-150ftlb preset to 130 earlier to check the lug nuts on the truck and another 50-300 which I had preset to 260). When I finished asked the wife to put the torque wrench back behind the seat, she asked me what the larger one was for? I keep the larger wrench behind the smaller = 130ftlbs vs 260ftlbs, self induced failure.

For those that might ask - I reset the wrenches to 0.

[jlankford]

I just came here to point you to my earlier post that wlfclf2000 already mentioned. I will repeat than information here...

There is one design flaw on the R3 that's simple to correct. I don't know if the TR3 has the same issue.
The ball-mount yoke that the shank sits in is too wide and there is too much slop between the two parts. When you torque the bolts to hold the adjusted angle you are actually bending the yoke quite a bit. If you look at the assembly from above, you can see the sides of the yoke bending in and see that there is still an air gap between the two parts - they never meet even when the bolts are tight. Holding the adjustment position depends on friction between the bolt heads and the outside of the yoke - the parts are never held tightly together. I don't like that the position depends on the bolt friction, and I don't like how much the yoke is flexed under torque load. Holding the correct bolt torque actually depends on spring tension in the flexing yoke and not on the parts pressing together.

The fix is to simply insert a washer onto each bolt inside the yoke. When the bolts are tightened the yoke will still flex, but the washers will fill the air gap and the sides of the yoke only need to flex a small amount before all the parts become tight. The adjusted angle is now much more secure, and the yoke is under much less bending stress. You can see the added washers in my pics. The gap is almost large enough to place a washer on either side of the shank, but not quite. A single washer on each bolt was enough.

[jlankford]

Use the largest washer you can find, to maximize the contact area. The sides of the shank are not flat, so the washer needs to bridge the "dimples" molded into the side of the shank. The ones I used are 2" dia and 1/8" thick.

[Alta 2810KIK]

Originally Posted by jlankford

Use the largest washer you can find, to maximize the contact area. The sides of the shank are not flat, so the washer needs to bridge the "dimples" molded into the side of the shank. The ones I used are 2" dia and 1/8" thick.

Thanks for posting this. My Fastway E2 has the same side to side slop when torqued to spec and I just ordered some washers.

[TheMarkles]

I have the washers, but the new shank I have for 2-1/2", receiver didn't leave a gap, difference in manufacturing? I have my original 2" shank I'll keep the washer for that one. Thanks much.

[wlfclf2000]

TheMarkles,
Quick question, did you lose the set bolt at the bottom of the ball-mount yoke that gets tightened against the shank after the thumb screw is adjusted, the set bolt should prevent the hitch from shifting as yours appears to have done in the pictures. This is a square head bolt at the bottom of the yoke.
You still need to torque to spec but I think the set bolt holds the ball-mount from shifting.
I got the washers that jlankford posted at tractor supply today, very in-expensive.

[TheMarkles]

I thought I left it in it's original position to keep the tilt the same, it could not have loosened itself, nor were the threads stripped. I definently missed something.

[RobbieH]

I've taken mine apart and put it back together 3 times. Last time I had to take it apart because not the conical washer but the other washer on the same bolt broke and fell out. That alone would tell you that I have it torqued down, but just so you know I put them on with a 1/2" Ingersoll Rand impact powered by my 2 stage compressor set at 160 lbs, then a very large torque wrench to get it all correct.

What I found is that if I use the hitch without the bars for a short trip, I'll get home and see that the ball mount yoke (the gold thing inside with the spherical head that you tighten down with a chisel) would not be touching. To fix it, I have to take the thing all apart again and set it the way it's supposed to be. On the last time, I also applied some penetrating thread locker onto that part, no idea if that's helping any at all, but I have not had it come loose again since I never use it without the bars anymore.

I'm also having a problem where the mounts on the trailer frame will not stay in place, they are continually moving to an angle, even though I also torqued these way down as instructed - it wasn't easy finding an allen socket that would withstand that kind of torque.

Overall when it's right, I really like it. But it is frustrating when I get home from a trip and see I have work to do on it yet again.

[wlfclf2000]

Originally Posted by TheMarkles

I thought I left it in it's original position to keep the tilt the same, it could not have loosened itself, nor were the threads stripped. I definently missed something.

It's worth checking, it should be tight against the shank before torquing. The ball mount should not rock at all even before tightening and torquing the bolts.

[jlankford]

Originally Posted by RobbieH

I've taken mine apart and put it back together 3 times. Last time I had to take it apart because not the conical washer but the other washer on the same bolt broke and fell out. That alone would tell you that I have it torqued down, but just so you know I put them on with a 1/2" Ingersoll Rand impact powered by my 2 stage compressor set at 160 lbs, then a very large torque wrench to get it all correct.

What I found is that if I use the hitch without the bars for a short trip, I'll get home and see that the ball mount yoke (the gold thing inside with the spherical head that you tighten down with a chisel) would not be touching. To fix it, I have to take the thing all apart again and set it the way it's supposed to be. On the last time, I also applied some penetrating thread locker onto that part, no idea if that's helping any at all, but I have not had it come loose again since I never use it without the bars anymore.

I'm also having a problem where the mounts on the trailer frame will not stay in place, they are continually moving to an angle, even though I also torqued these way down as instructed - it wasn't easy finding an allen socket that would withstand that kind of torque.

Overall when it's right, I really like it. But it is frustrating when I get home from a trip and see I have work to do on it yet again.

If the adjusting wheel loosened to have a gap where it should be tight, that sounds like the set screw wlfclf2000 just mentioned was not tightened as a last step. The adjusting wheel and set screw should oppose each other to prevent any loosening.

The other issue of yours is unavoidable. It is caused by the bolt at the end of the bar when you go over a sudden grade change up or down. The bars need to slide in that support when the angle between the TV and TT changes, but the bolts that are caught in the support slot have nowhere to go without pushing on the supports. I realized this while reading a recent post about frames bending on sudden pitch transitions like at the end of a driveway when the WDH bars aren't removed. Square trunions can slide freely on these pitch changes, but the R3 design can't handle that as well.

[wlfclf2000]

Originally Posted by wlfclf2000

TheMarkles,
Quick question, did you lose the set bolt at the bottom of the ball-mount yoke that gets tightened against the shank after the thumb screw is adjusted, the set bolt should prevent the hitch from shifting as yours appears to have done in the pictures. This is a square head bolt at the bottom of the yoke.
You still need to torque to spec but I think the set bolt holds the ball-mount from shifting.
I got the washers that jlankford posted at tractor supply today, very in-expensive.

TheMarkles,
I think when you check you will find that bolt is your problem. It may be bent or backed out but fix that and you will fix your problem.

[jlankford]

Originally Posted by wlfclf2000

TheMarkles,
I think when you check you will find that bolt is your problem. It may be bent or backed out but fix that and you will fix your problem.

I agree with this. Looking at your photos again, there is a huge gap between the adjusting wheel and the shank. The only way that gap exists is if the set screw is missing or backed all the way out.

My procedure for adjusting the WDF:
1. Loosen both main torque bolts.
2. Back the set bolt out of the way.
3. Adjust angle with the adjusting wheel.
4. Tighten the set bolt until both it and the adjusting wheel are tight and secure. No movement possible in the entire assembly after this point.
5. Re-torque the main bolts.

You mentioned using thread lock on the set bolt, which shouldn't be necessary. The adjusting wheel and set bolt should be tightly opposing each other to the point where they serve as a locknut for each other.

I think that because of the fitment problem I described that needs spacer washers to correct, the adjustment angle depends much more than it should on that set bolt to hold everything in position. The torque of the bolts can't be trusted due to spring flexion of the yoke, which means that the whole thing can and will slip if the set bolt and adjusting wheel aren't holding the angle position tightly.

[RobbieH]

Originally Posted by jlankford

If the adjusting wheel loosened to have a gap where it should be tight, that sounds like the set screw wlfclf2000 just mentioned was not tightened as a last step. The adjusting wheel and set screw should oppose each other to prevent any loosening.

That square set screw is tight.

[jlankford]

Originally Posted by RobbieH

That square set screw is tight.

The question is, is the set screw tight when the main bolts are completely loose? If that set screw is tight, then it forces the adjusting wheel to also be tight. If the main bolts are torqued when you check this, then there can't be any movement and the set screw might seem tight, but under load things could still slip and shift if there's a gap at the adjusting wheel.

[RobbieH]

Originally Posted by jlankford

The question is, is the set screw tight when the main bolts are completely loose? If that set screw is tight, then it forces the adjusting wheel to also be tight. If the main bolts are torqued when you check this, then there can't be any movement and the set screw might seem tight, but under load things could still slip and shift if there's a gap at the adjusting wheel.

Sorry, yes. I watched Camco's video probably a dozen times and referred to it as I went along. The instructions it came with were almost useless, but the video they made was very good.

[jlankford]

Originally Posted by RobbieH

Sorry, yes. I watched Camco's video probably a dozen times and referred to it as I went along. The instructions it came with were almost useless, but the video they made was very good.

Ahh, OK. I haven't watched the video, and I agree the written instructions are crap. It took me a long time to figure out how to get this hitch to hold its preload adjustment angle. For months I would return from a trip and find the gold adjusting wheel to be loose and backed out. I'd re-tighten it, assuming everything below was still in position. I finally figured out to completely loosen the main bolts and then really tighten the square set bolt for it to do its job. I marked the adjust wheel with a Sharpie and it hasn't moved since.

The fact that you're using a chisel (and hammer?) to turn the adjusting wheel tells me you might be doing something out of order. The wheel should only be adjusted when everything is loose - main bolts rattle-loose and set bolt backed out. For me, the wheel turns easily with a blade screwdriver and a little hand pressure. After the wheel is where I want it then I tighten the hell out of the set bolt and the wheel can't move any more, except maybe to snug it another 1/8 of a turn.

I'm wondering if you guys that have used an impact wrench on the main bolts may have permanently deformed the yoke and made things harder to hold adjustment. I've only ever hand tightened the main bolts with an 18" socket wrench, and even then I was bending the hell out of the sides of the yoke before I added the spacers.