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Old 10-01-2020, 12:18 PM   #1
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Can newer "half tons" really tow more & better?

I have an amazing 2007 Ram (5.7 hemi/3.55/reg. cab/long bed) that has towed my Puma TT 26RLSS (DWR 6170; GVW actual 6800-7500 ) over 25K miles for the last 10 years. My mechanic says truck still in great shape at 126K miles. I am, however, considering buying a newer tow vehicle for two reasons: (1) we added some new furniture to the trailer that has increased its weight, and I am running about 400lbs above my GCWR (2) I am getting older and would like some driver assist options like backup camera, lane assist, and adaptive cruise control if I can get it. And, yes, I'd like the driving to be a little less "tense". I notice that the towing capacity of newer 1500/150's have increased to the 12,500-13,000 range (and yes, I know we have to look at GCWR and other ratings). Still, that is a huge increase from my 2007 RAM advertised towing capacity of 7,900lbs. Does anyone on this forum have experience going from an older truck like mine to a newer one of roughly the same vintage (1500/150 with same/similar axle ratio), and can attest to a substantially better/easier/safer/different towing experience? Or should I just "chug along" with my loyal old RAM. I am the guy with the "Life is Good" spare tire cover cruising at a comfortable 55mph in the far right lane that you keep passing on the way to the next rest stop!
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Old 10-01-2020, 12:37 PM   #2
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Short answer is no, you wont see a giant leap in capability. Payload is still an issue. New Ram 1500s have a fairly low GVWR, they top out at 7,100 lbs for gas and 7,200 lbs for the diesel.
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Old 10-01-2020, 12:50 PM   #3
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if you are staying within the weight limits (payload being the big one). Then actually you will see a big difference in drivability. Your 07 is a lower HP, 5spd auto with 3.55. A new truck you would consider would be a higher HP, 8spd, 3.92 gear truck. Not to mention larger brakes, and better handling suspension.
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Old 10-01-2020, 12:58 PM   #4
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I am in the same boat. I am replacing my 2012 Silverado 1500 and as much as I'd like to stick with a 1500 for price and mileage considerations I have been looking at 2500s. I'm towing a TT running around 7K depending on how long I'm packed for so between the TT and whatever I've got in the bed of the truck I'm probably pushing my limits on payload and considering we want to start taking longer trips I want to be good on everything.
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Old 10-01-2020, 12:58 PM   #5
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You should order with 3.92 gears as it makes a much better towing experience. Are they better than a 2007 at towing and capability, yes. Much better, probably not. Though I did notice mine shifts more given more gears. Also make sure if you are getting all the "bells and whistles" that you aren't decreasing what you can tow. With ramboxes, split tailgate, etc., the payload decreases therefore the tongue weight capability decreases.
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Old 10-01-2020, 01:32 PM   #6
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I owned a 2007 Chevy 5.3 and I can definitely tell you my 2014 F150 SCREW 4x4 3.5 Ecoboost with the Max Tow package is infinitely better at towing.
Ford and GM have raised the max payload and towing capacity numbers into 3/4 ton territory. Ram has done a lot of upgrading but they still are lagging behind Ford and GM in the payload department. Probably due to their coil springs vs leaf springs.
My F150 has a great ride and is extremely stable pulling my 26ft TT. And the Ecoboost is a towing beast.
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Old 10-01-2020, 02:29 PM   #7
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Not sure I consider current 1/2 tons into 3/4 ton territory. Yes, Ram is the lowest but the others are also well short of a 3/4’s 10,000 lb GVWR. GM around 7,500 lbs and F-150 can get up to 7,850 lbs

1/2 ton rear GAWR (~ 3,800-4,800 lbs) is also significantly lower than a 3/4 ton (6,000+ lbs)
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Old 10-01-2020, 03:04 PM   #8
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The comfort and features on the new trucks are the biggest improvement. There is also an increase in payload numbers, if you keep options in check. I have the interactive cruise, blind side alert, and lane assist on my car, big improvement. Especially the interactive cruise. , and blind side alarm. Some of the features turn off when towing. I would have still bought on my new truck, if I could have found those features w/o all the additional packages. They normally package them w/ higher trim levels making them an additional $5-7K. I would not buy a newer truck w/o the blind side alert, I was able to find a truck w/ that option w/o all the premium options.
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Old 10-01-2020, 03:40 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by IvoryHemi View Post
Not sure I consider current 1/2 tons into 3/4 ton territory. Yes, Ram is the lowest but the others are also well short of a 3/4s 10,000 lb GVWR. GM around 7,500 lbs and F-150 can get up to 7,850 lbs

1/2 ton rear GAWR (~ 3,800-4,800 lbs) is also significantly lower than a 3/4 ton (6,000+ lbs)
But an empty 3/4 ton, especially diesel, has a much higher curb weight so in the end you're essentially in 3/4 ton territory in regards to payload. If I follow the weight police, I can't get anywhere near my 6500lb RAWR.
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Old 10-01-2020, 06:08 PM   #10
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Yes you’ll loose payload with diesel vs gas

I will say the F-150 with 3.5 or 5.0 getting up to 4,800 lb GAWR is impressive compared to the others
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Old 10-01-2020, 10:37 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Tundra 2014 View Post
The comfort and features on the new trucks are the biggest improvement. There is also an increase in payload numbers, if you keep options in check. I have the interactive cruise, blind side alert, and lane assist on my car, big improvement. Especially the interactive cruise. , and blind side alarm. Some of the features turn off when towing. I would have still bought on my new truck, if I could have found those features w/o all the additional packages. They normally package them w/ higher trim levels making them an additional $5-7K. I would not buy a newer truck w/o the blind side alert, I was able to find a truck w/ that option w/o all the premium options.
I appreciate your sharing your experience with the driver assist options. I would like to know if you would share your research regarding which trucks offer the driver assist options, especially the blind spot alarm and adaptive cruise control.
1500/150 and 2500/250?
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Old 10-02-2020, 12:05 PM   #12
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I've got a Tesla Model Y and my 2012 Tundra for towing my 5er. I'm going to wait until the Cybertruck gets a 5th wheel hitch and them I'm going electric. My Tesla is 2 huge computers with a car wrapped around it that gets 125"MPG".
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Old 10-02-2020, 12:22 PM   #13
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I've got a Tesla Model Y and my 2012 Tundra for towing my 5er. I'm going to wait until the Cybertruck gets a 5th wheel hitch and them I'm going electric. My Tesla is 2 huge computers with a car wrapped around it that gets 125"MPG".
Tesla cars are very cool. But sorry that truck is butt ugly :-) Your mileage may vary hehe.


I wish a Tesla owner would do this experiment. Figure out how much it costs in electricity to charge your Tesla at home. Then come up with a $/Mile number. So that we can easily compare to gasoline. That number might make me a believer and buyer.



Then research how your local electricity is generated.



And give us a full report. Just curious.


Have fun.
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Old 10-02-2020, 12:47 PM   #14
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Yes, it is butt ugly! The math is pretty simple:
Tesla Model Y usable KWh battery capacity 72.5
Duke Power KWh rate $0.11
Cost of a "fill-up" $7.98
Miles on a "fill-up" 316
Cost/mile $0.025

Tundra usable tankage 20
Cost per "Fill-up" @ $2.15/gal $43.00
Miles per gallon 15
Miles/tank 300
Cost/mile $0.143
TESLA
EPA Mileage
Combined MPG:121
Highway MPGe:112
City MPGe:129
28 kWh/100 mi
EPA range: 315 miles

Clearly there are other factors, but most are statistically insignificant. My Tundra mileage is 9-10 towing a 9,000 lb. 5er.
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Old 10-02-2020, 01:08 PM   #15
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Yes, it is butt ugly! The math is pretty simple:
Tesla Model Y usable KWh battery capacity 72.5
Duke Power KWh rate $0.11
Cost of a "fill-up" $7.98
Miles on a "fill-up" 316
Cost/mile $0.025

Tundra usable tankage 20
Cost per "Fill-up" @ $2.15/gal $43.00
Miles per gallon 15
Miles/tank 300
Cost/mile $0.143
TESLA
EPA Mileage
Combined MPG:121
Highway MPGe:112
City MPGe:129
28 kWh/100 mi
EPA range: 315 miles

Clearly there are other factors, but most are statistically insignificant. My Tundra mileage is 9-10 towing a 9,000 lb. 5er.
Thanks for that. Math was always my worse subject. I got thru it but to this day avoid it like the plague haha.

The other factor being they are wicked fast! I would buy one just for that.
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Old 10-02-2020, 01:09 PM   #16
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The big question is what is the range of the cybertruck pulling a barn door behind it. The motors are more than capable. It's the power density of the batteries that is the issue.

I am a huge fan of electric vehicles. When the industry standardizes "fill ups" so I don't have to wait hours to get a full tank and continue on I will be ready to make the switch.

Battery tech will have a breakthrough. It's just a matter if when.
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Old 10-02-2020, 01:18 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Trawlerphil View Post
Yes, it is butt ugly! The math is pretty simple:
Tesla Model Y usable KWh battery capacity 72.5
Duke Power KWh rate $0.11
Cost of a "fill-up" $7.98
Miles on a "fill-up" 316
Cost/mile $0.025

Tundra usable tankage 20
Cost per "Fill-up" @ $2.15/gal $43.00
Miles per gallon 15
Miles/tank 300
Cost/mile $0.143
TESLA
EPA Mileage
Combined MPG:121
Highway MPGe:112
City MPGe:129
28 kWh/100 mi
EPA range: 315 miles

Clearly there are other factors, but most are statistically insignificant. My Tundra mileage is 9-10 towing a 9,000 lb. 5er.
I am surprised that there aren't hybrid trucks, if for no other reason than regenerative braking; surely, that would be an advantage with an electric tow vehicle, especially because it would reduce break wear. For that matter, why not make trailers with regenerative brakes and a Tesla-style battery?
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Old 10-02-2020, 01:18 PM   #18
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I am surprised that there aren't hybrid trucks, if for no other reason than regenerative braking; surely, that would be an advantage with an electric tow vehicle, especially because it would reduce break wear. For that matter, why not make trailers with regenerative brakes and a Tesla-style battery?
$$$
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Old 10-02-2020, 01:28 PM   #19
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$$$
With todays trucks as expensive as they are (), money is absolutely a consideration. I keep hoping they'll come up with "plug & play" modules that can be installed after purchase, LOL!
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Old 10-02-2020, 01:35 PM   #20
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The big question is what is the range of the cybertruck pulling a barn door behind it. The motors are more than capable. It's the power density of the batteries that is the issue.

I am a huge fan of electric vehicles. When the industry standardizes "fill ups" so I don't have to wait hours to get a full tank and continue on I will be ready to make the switch.

Battery tech will have a breakthrough. It's just a matter if when.
I think the even bigger question is what is the range of the cybertruck pulling a barn door in 100+ degree heat, when power is cut to protect the batteries from overheating? Or, what is the range when it's 35 degrees and raining one night, and the batteries are not only underperforming due to the temps, but are also using their own power to run battery heaters to keep the performance from being even worse - *and* running the cabin heater, and the wipers, and the headlights, etc.
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