Diesel Pro’s and Con’s

[mopwr4me2003]

Not looking to start the Chevy, Ford, dodge war, that’s not what I am after. We are a few months away from looking at a new TV and I am on the fence right now. Gas engines I am familiar with but diesel not so much. What are some of the issues common with diesels? Are these issues something that would stop you from buying a diesel again? Fuel mileage compared to a gasser? I know all vehicles have their issues so that I get. I just don’t know what sort of things to look for if I decide to go used or new. As far as vehicles go diesels seem to hold value and properly maintained run forever. I’m just looking for a little diesel newbie advice and information to make a good purchase.

Just so people know where I am at with my thinking, I have been thinking back and forth with 1500/150 series trucks. The DW and I are thinking of a upgrade to our TT later in the future. So the 2500/250 makes sense for that but do I really need it now. Me thinking well yeah go big or go home, wife not so much [emoji16]. Thanks for any advice, help you might have.

Tim

[Lins]

Well you've opened a can of worms I'm sure. I've driven diesels from the big 3 and currently own a Ram with the Cummins - the only diesel I've owned, the others were work trucks. At work we had problems when the emissions first came out and they switched to gassers briefly until they sorted out the tuning and introduced DEF. Since then, problems have steadily decreased over time with them. They're all good engines. Initial cost is higher, but so is resale, a little more maintenance is required and costs a little more to do. The engine should last a lot longer than any gasser. I do my own routine maintenance and keep an eye on pails of oil for when they go on sale and you also typically can cash in on mail-in rebates. Mileage is typically better empty, but while towing there is not much advantage in MPG, but the torque and exhaust brake are great to have, especially in the mountains. The weight of a diesel will cut into your payload on a 2500 in particular. Emissions aren't as problematic as the internet makes it seem, I do a lot of short drives to work and back with no issues in almost 3 years. Our truck lives outside year-round, sees down to -40C before windchill regularly in winter. I love the diesel, wife loves it as well. Make sure you know what you're in for ride wise, an HD truck is significantly stiffer, but they get better with every update. I would get one again, but I would also keep an eye on the half tons as their ratings are much better than they used to be. If the Ram half tons a couple years ago had the ratings the 2019 has, I might have stuck with another half ton.

I will now promptly unsubscribe...

[Bluepill]

Many stories on this forum of folks who bought too small a truck. The 2500/250 makes more sense because you are less likely to grow out of it, and when you sell it easier to sell and get more money for it.

[BigH]

First off a diesel 2500 can run out of payload as fast as any half ton...

On the holding value...I don't see it. The used price around here is about how much more one originally paid for getting the diesel. Spend more, its worth more, nothing else to it.

If you don't need a diesel I would skip it...even on the diesel forums they say the same thing. My coworker managed a fleet of diesel trucks with reps from the big three. The down time related to emissions was costing them money. They switched everything over to gassers they could and haven't looked back. His company is not alone. The big sewer and water company near me switched from diesel to gas. Even the big garbage collection trucks have gotten away from diesel.

I could have written the check for a diesel the same as I did for my truck, and I fully intended to buy a diesel but I had a rare year to research while getting rid of a lemon Ford that told me dependability was more important to me. Don't let me talk you out of it, they are awesomely powerful and if you need or want a diesel (you seem a little biased towards wanting one), go for it, but if you 'need' to justify it financially or think it is going to be trouble free for 200,000 miles then the odds are against you.

[MR.M]

Originally Posted by mopwr4me2003

Not looking to start the Chevy, Ford, dodge war, that’s not what I am after. We are a few months away from looking at a new TV and I am on the fence right now. Gas engines I am familiar with but diesel not so much. What are some of the issues common with diesels? Are these issues something that would stop you from buying a diesel again? Fuel mileage compared to a gasser? I know all vehicles have their issues so that I get. I just don’t know what sort of things to look for if I decide to go used or new. As far as vehicles go diesels seem to hold value and properly maintained run forever. I’m just looking for a little diesel newbie advice and information to make a good purchase.

Just so people know where I am at with my thinking, I have been thinking back and forth with 1500/150 series trucks. The DW and I are thinking of a upgrade to our TT later in the future. So the 2500/250 makes sense for that but do I really need it now. Me thinking well yeah go big or go home, wife not so much [emoji16]. Thanks for any advice, help you might have.

Tim

But you will anyways . hahaha . get what suits your needs . diesel , gas what ever . neither is the best for everything . diesels can cost more value is relative since you pay more up front so it's not like they hold their value better then gassers . Longevity is also very debatable . i have 195,000 on my 6.0 gasser and will keep for another 100,000 . some say diesels go 500,000 but i have not seen many seems people trade them in before the warranty is up so they don't get stuck with the huge bills , replacing DEF systems , injectors , etc . But even gas you need to keep in good shape it's just cheaper to do so . been through every sensor in my truck . headers , upper control arms , cv half axles , fan clutch, front bearing , u-joints etc . same goes for diesel only you have the added expense of diesel break downs . MY son 2017 250 6.7 has left him stranded 3 times in a year and a half . My 2003 chevy has never left me stranded in 195,000 miles . to each his own you will learn there is no one truck is the best for all things

[upflying]

OP wrote a post that sounds like something I would write..
I am now looking for a new TV and I have zero knowledge about diesels.
Subscribed.

[Jim34RL]

This is my $0.02 on your question.

I have owned both a 3/4 HD trucks one with a 6.0L gas and one with a 6.7L Cummins diesel engine towing 5th wheel trailers. Let me state here and now I will never ever pull a 5er with a gas engine truck again. In fact my wife and I own two diesel vehicles a VW TDI her car and my 2008 Ram Mega cab 6.7L Cummins.

There are a several reasons for this statement. 1) Ease of filling up tow vehicle with diesel fuel in truck lanes. You can't do that with a gas pick-up truck. 2) The exhaust brake on my diesel will stop both truck and trailer without the use of brakes if needed. A gas engine vehicle will not do that. 3) Low and constant engine torque to get the load started and keep it moving. I am never over 2,000 engine RPM's with my tow vehicle. 4) Better fuel economy with a diesel engine when towing a house. My trailer is 13'-6" tall and 37' long.

The newer diesel trucks are improving the emission equipment and emission equipment problems are being eliminate fast. Now as far as maintenance on a diesel you do need to change the fuel filter/filters every 15,000 miles. Oil changes can be between 6,000 and 10,000 miles depending on oil type such as Dino or synthetic. Air-filter every 40,000 miles or so depending on road conditions. I do my own oil and fuel filter changes, my oil changing cost is $59.45, 3 gallons and a filter, my fuel filter is $42.50 each.

There are no spark plugs or spark plug wires that need to be changed out every 100,000 miles.

[tomkatb]

Review nada and other resale values.

Compare the discounted list price of a diesel to resale. Basically you loose virtually nothing with a diesel.

Oil changes by the dealer are $95 twice a year or every 16,000 miles. Includes tire rotation. Needs fuel filters every 16,000 miles. $95 on Amazon. I change them. I am 70 and arthritic.

There is no other maintenance until a valve adjustment at 100,000 miles.

Maintenance otherwise is pretty much the same. Costs more than a car.

We get 22 mpg at 75-80 unloaded. 11 mpg towing #15,000 fiver. Better than a gas truck. Diesel costs more than gas. 0-$.30. More miles between fill ups.

Diesel is better on power and ability to go up and down hills. Just set the cruise.

The DEF thing has calmed down.

But, if you do not tow much, get a gasser. We went about 7,000 miles last year.

DEF is about $.005 unloaded. $.05 towing. Per mile.

[Vikes79]

I think the better question is what type of trailer you are towing currently and in the next 4 years.

If you are talking 6k lb travel trailers, a HD diesel truck would be a waste.

If you are talking 5vers and the such....a diesel is hard to beat for towing comfort and power delivery.

Modern HD gassers get the job done, but expect 2 to 3 mpg less for the same load and a whole lot of downshifting and rpms every significant grade.

[itat]

Diesel
Pro: more power at a lower rpm; great for towing in the mountains; can tow significantly heavier trailers compared to a gasser
Con: upfront cost, financing the upfront cost (unless you have that much cash on hand), somewhat higher maintenance cost; smelly diesel fuel; possibly longer warmup time in cold winter weather(?)

Gas
Pro: lower upfront cost, lower maintenance cost (still more than a half ton though)
Con: need to rev much higher to get into the power band (some don’t mind this); looses power at higher elevations; not enough power to tow much more than 11K#

I’m sure I’ve missed a few points.

[BandJCarm]

I have 3 trucks. One is diesel dually. It has the lowest maintenance costs of all 3.


If I got out of towing/trailering (I'll always be pulling a fishing boat somewhere), I'd go back to 2500 GMC Diesel. Just the best of all worlds. Old diesels had issues. New ones are great.

[ronheater70]

I switched from a 6.4 Hemi Ram 2500 to a 3500 Ram Diesel.

So far the diesel has proven to be less costly maintenance wise, Slightly more costly fuel wise.. But with the Fuel Cost, at least here anyway, IM seeing enough of a boost in MPG, especially towing that it gets offset. My last trip to the beach towing, I was actually able to go all the way to my destination, which wasn't quite possible with the gasser, I had to stop once for fuel.
Towing is night and day difference, for me anyway.. towing 10K with the Hemi in moderately hilly terrain I would drop to second and near 5K rpms to maintain 60ish MPH, With the diesel, most tows are in 6th gear at 1700 RPMS or so, with an occasional downshift to 5th at 2200 rpm.

I Love it!

[Greg in michigan]

We bought a new 2004 Nissan titan back in 2004 and pulled our # 6000 empty , #7000?? Loaded tt from Michigan to Florida 9 times. Work great but a little slow going over the 5000 foot mt. Otherwise great. After owning the truck 14 years the only think other then maintenance was a fuel pump. We had such great luck with it we bought another Nissan titan. This time a titan xd Cummins turbo diesel. It was a retirement gift to ourselves along with a new rockwood 2606ws. Ithe 2606ws weights 6365 empty and ??? Loaded. Should never weight more then #8000. Should go up mt. Better being s turbo diesel but won't know untill this years Florida trip.
Around here the 3/4 ton from the big 3 were 9000 to 12000 dollars more equipped the same. I figured why spend the extra to pull 18000 lbs if our rv is 8000lbs.
Our rv is 30 foot and dont see ever going larger. It's our largest rv of our 5 we've had since 1992.
So far our longest trip was 800 miles from Michigan to Duluth mn. So far we love both

[frank4711]

Good reading .... thanks

[TheWolfPaq82]

Originally Posted by itat

Diesel
Pro: more power at a lower rpm; great for towing in the mountains; can tow significantly heavier trailers compared to a gasser
Con: upfront cost, financing the upfront cost (unless you have that much cash on hand), somewhat higher maintenance cost; smelly diesel fuel; possibly longer warmup time in cold winter weather(?)

Gas
Pro: lower upfront cost, lower maintenance cost (still more than a half ton though)
Con: need to rev much higher to get into the power band (some don’t mind this); looses power at higher elevations; not enough power to tow much more than 11K#

I’m sure I’ve missed a few points.

Not bad. I'd toss in "Diesel" better MPG, but more maint. if live in cold climate. Anti-gel and such. Lot depends on what TT you're looking to get into eventually.

[mopwr4me2003]

Originally Posted by TheWolfPaq82

Not bad. I'd toss in "Diesel" better MPG, but more maint. if live in cold climate. Anti-gel and such. Lot depends on what TT you're looking to get into eventually.

So as for our current TT we just have a shamrock 183. Fully loaded about 4600#. We were talking about in 2-3 years time a slightly larger TT no longer a hybrid style but probably one around 5-7000# range maybe a little more. I know eventually probably 8-10 years down the road a 5th wheel but who knows that far down the road. We do want to travel in areas with mountains and such which is one reason I was considering it. The other reason is if we have the truck now we open up a few more options for a TT and wouldn’t have to worry to much. I know for now the truck would be a little overkill So this is why I have come to the all mighty knowing people of this forum [emoji16].

[REL]

If you go diesel get a 1 ton..the weight of the engine and tranny kill the payload capacity on a 3/4.

[itat]

IMO, for a 7000# TT you don’t “need” a diesel. Once you move to a 5th wheel it may be needed but if that’s 8-10 years down the rod, stick with a gasser for now. A 3/4 ton gasser would be great for a 7000# TT.

I agree with REL though. If you opt for a diesel pickup, skip the 3/4 ton and get a 1 ton.

[Crusadernoob]

Diesel, no comparison towing, fuel mileage. We average just over 12mpg towing our fifth wheel, I've been over 20mpg just cruising around. Exhaust brake is a huge advantage. Diesel is only $.03 more expensive for me right now, but usually up to $.40 more. The biggest thing I see out of the last 6-7 year old Duramax is the DEF reservoir, a 20 minute repair for a GM.
Gas engines, pull ok, no exhaust brake, usually average 9mpg or less, love to scream around 4,500+ rpm's. Biggest things I see with GM is lifters and/or camshafts.

I love our Duramax, 06 so old school, no DEF, still has plenty of torque. I would advise on either one you decide, gas or diesel, go 1 ton SRW.

[NMWildcat]

We have pulled with both diesel and gas, and half, 3/4, and 1 ton. Once you tow with diesel, easy decision to never go back to gas. If pulling any toy hauler or fifth wheel, a half ton is out, in my opinion.
We choose 3/4 ton diesel now as it is also our daily driver and rides slightly better than the 1 ton. I'm weird about keeping maint records, and per year, or per mile, the diesel is cheaper than any of our gas trucks over their life. Of course I keep all my trucks a LONG time. I still have the first truck I ever bought
As far as payload concerns in the 3/4 vs 1 ton, for single rear tire, not much REAL difference. Why do I say that? Do your own research and make your own decision. But on the other hand, you can usually get 1 ton trucks cheaper, at least around here.
Have fun shopping!