e2 hitch weight adjustments

[RobinDella]

Looking for clarity. I have an e2 Hitch. I'm pulling a PUMA 25RKSS with a 2005 suburban with new Bilstein shocks and Air lift 1000 air bags. The measurement are 36" uncoupled/ 36 3/4 hitched without WD engaged and 36 3/16 with WD engaged. These numbers seem to be fine however on a CAT scale I have 2920 on front and 4060 on rear and 6580 on trailer axles. I believe I need to adjust to bring more weight to front axle. Any advice is greatly appreciated

[007matman]

From what I understand, the air bags should be flat to take your first measurement. And set your ideal hitch height.

Bags should only be inflated to start to raise the vehicle and take some weight off the springs (you want to make sure that front and rear sag are approximately the same). Putting too much in will make you nose high.

[MillMitch]

What's your front axle weight without the trailer? My E2 setup brought the front axle weight back within 60# of unloaded. Someone with a truck or large SUV should chime in, my setup was a little different than the instructions because of the mechanical self leveling rear in the Durango.

[MillMitch]

Originally Posted by 007matman

From what I understand, the air bags should be flat to take your first measurement. And set your ideal hitch height.

Bags should only be inflated to start to raise the vehicle and take some weight off the springs (you want to make sure that front and rear sag are approximately the same). Putting too much in will make you nose high.

The instructions (copied in below) say to inflate air bags before setting up hitch

as they will be while traveling. This includes full propane tanks, fresh water
tanks, and any other cargo (passengers & gear) the tow vehicle or trailer will
carry, including ATVs for toy haulers. Tow vehicle “auto-level” systems should
also be disabled or turned off. If your tow vehicle is equipped with air bags,
we recommend that you inflate them to the pressure you are expecting to tow
with before setting up the hitch. Inflating them after hitch set up changes the
relationship between tow vehicle and trailer, and can reduce the amount of
weight distribution and sway control you get from your hitch.

[RobinDella]

The book on the e2 says to have bags inflated to the amount you plan to tow. I did that

[007matman]

I called them when I set mine up.

I have an Escalade with the automatic air leveling system. They had me remove the fuses to disable it prior to taking my measurements. You want to be at normal riding height.

[MillMitch]

I would double check the ball height compared to coupler on trailer when level (keeping in mind you will need a 250# torque wrench if you loosen those bolts). If you haven't already, i would inflate air bags, and get TV weighed without trailer, which will give you the base axle weights.
Your front fender measurements look good as per the instruction manual. Does everything look level when you are hitched up?

[MillMitch]

Originally Posted by 007matman

I called them when I set mine up.

I have an Escalade with the automatic air leveling system. They had me remove the fuses to disable it prior to taking my measurements. You want to be at normal riding height.

007matman is towing with something more comparable, so you can ignore mine

[RobinDella]

Originally Posted by MillMitch

I would double check the ball height compared to coupler on trailer when level (keeping in mind you will need a 250# torque wrench if you loosen those bolts). If you haven't already, i would inflate air bags, and get TV weighed without trailer, which will give you the base axle weights.
Your front fender measurements look good as per the instruction manual. Does everything look level when you are hitched up?

MILLMITCH That was my thought exactly I was going to add one or two washers to that and raise the ball up. It has a pretty sharp angle right now which is how dealer set it up. It has just the min number of washers (5) Just not sure how many I should add. and Yes I'm aware of the torgue at 250. Don't have a T wrench that big so I borrow from autozone. also trailer now loaded seems to pitch down in front slightly

[MillMitch]

you are on the right track. After loading the trailer, my tongue increased from 600# to almost 850# which required another washer for me to level it back up. I'm at 7, your TV is bigger and longer than mine, so you probably need more washers. CAT scales are cheap, keep tweaking it.

[RobinDella]

Originally Posted by MillMitch

you are on the right track. After loading the trailer, my tongue increased from 600# to almost 850# which required another washer for me to level it back up. I'm at 7, your TV is bigger and longer than mine, so you probably need more washers. CAT scales are cheap, keep tweaking it.

MILLMITCH
Thanks! I care to differ on Cat scales LOL Of course I retired from trucking in 04 (35yrs and 3 million plus miles). They were 6 bucks then but still in todays money I guess they're keeping up with inflation. Having to borrow wrench from Auto Zone is a pain but I'll do what I have to do. I'm thinking start with 2 washers and see what comes of that. Now how do you determine tongue weight? isn't it a percentage of the rear axle weight?

[davellie]

I suggest calling Fastway directly. I called and emailed with them throughout my set up and they were awesome. They put me directly in contact with the engineers and mechanics. They asked for pictures of my set up and all of the numbers and directed me from there. Great customer service.

[007matman]

In this video he addresses air bags but I don't think it's real clear and somewhat misleading.

https://youtu.be/5_kbKyXRZTM

You want the setup to be at normal height prior to install/measurements. That's why on an automatic system they say to pull the fuse. If you go to turn on the system prior to engaging the WD hitch you'll end up with the system that will compensate for the weight and ill-ajustment of the hitch.

If you're inflating the air bags to what you think is needed to support the weight without the WD system engaged and then go to engage it you're not going to get the full benefits of the WD system (similar to what I mentioned above) and it's going to be difficult to dial in properly (you'll end up nose high more than likely).

[MillMitch]

Originally Posted by RobinDella

MILLMITCH
Thanks! I care to differ on Cat scales LOL Of course I retired from trucking in 04 (35yrs and 3 million plus miles). They were 6 bucks then but still in todays money I guess they're keeping up with inflation. Having to borrow wrench from Auto Zone is a pain but I'll do what I have to do. I'm thinking start with 2 washers and see what comes of that. Now how do you determine tongue weight? isn't it a percentage of the rear axle weight?

I actually made a tongue scale out of a 4x4 and bathroom scale (you can find plans and videos online). It is really sensitive to level (the 4x4 being level), but gives me a good idea. Actual tongue loaded was 850#, which was 15% of my loaded trailer. CAT scale with WDH hooked up shows 740# xtra weight on TV axles, so the WDH is pushing about 110# of tongue back to trailer axles; and as noted earlier, brought front axle weight within 60# of unloaded (with hitch in back).
My kids bought me a 250# torque wrench for Christmas which has been helpful tweaking the hitch.
Good luck.

[RobinDella]

Originally Posted by MillMitch

I actually made a tongue scale out of a 4x4 and bathroom scale (you can find plans and videos online). It is really sensitive to level (the 4x4 being level), but gives me a good idea. Actual tongue loaded was 850#, which was 15% of my loaded trailer. CAT scale with WDH hooked up shows 740# xtra weight on TV axles, so the WDH is pushing about 110# of tongue back to trailer axles; and as noted earlier, brought front axle weight within 60# of unloaded (with hitch in back).
My kids bought me a 250# torque wrench for Christmas which has been helpful tweaking the hitch.
Good luck.

MILLMITCH
According to the scale I have 960 of trailer wt transferred to the TV. Trailer loaded weight is 7550 in this situation
. Shouldn't I have more weight transferred to TV. and will washers do the job maybe ?

[MillMitch]

The WDH raises the back of the TV, which pushes weight forward to front axle and back to TT axles. My CAT numbers are below, with and without trailer hooked up. A lot of people will do a 3rd weigh with TT hooked up but without WDH engaged (all the weight sitting on rear axle) to compare to scale #'s with WDH hooked up. Assuming your 960# is the increased TV weight w/ TT hooked up, that means your tongue weight is roughly 15% more than that (this is a general number, yours may be more or less), or about 1104#. Which is 14% of your 7750# (assuming that is the trailer weight and not the TT axle weight from the CAT scale). Your trailer weight will be the Combined weight less the TV by itself.
Sorry, hopefully this makes sense.

TV specs: 2011 Durango w/ tow package and 5.7L GVW 7100, max front axle 3200, max rear axle 3900, GCVW 13,100
TT specs: yellow sticker unloaded 5,234, GVW 7600,
CAT scales TT hooked and WDH engaged: front axle 3020, rear axle 3740, TT axles 4900, Combined 11660
TV back for reweigh after dropping off trailer: front axle 3080, rear axle 2940, combined 6020 (which puts the TT at 5640 without water)

[RobinDella]

Originally Posted by MillMitch

The WDH raises the back of the TV, which pushes weight forward to front axle and back to TT axles. My CAT numbers are below, with and without trailer hooked up. A lot of people will do a 3rd weigh with TT hooked up but without WDH engaged (all the weight sitting on rear axle) to compare to scale #'s with WDH hooked up. Assuming your 960# is the increased TV weight w/ TT hooked up, that means your tongue weight is roughly 15% more than that (this is a general number, yours may be more or less), or about 1104#. Which is 14% of your 7750# (assuming that is the trailer weight and not the TT axle weight from the CAT scale). Your trailer weight will be the Combined weight less the TV by itself.
Sorry, hopefully this makes sense.

TV specs: 2011 Durango w/ tow package and 5.7L GVW 7100, max front axle 3200, max rear axle 3900, GCVW 13,100
TT specs: yellow sticker unloaded 5,234, GVW 7600,
CAT scales TT hooked and WDH engaged: front axle 3020, rear axle 3740, TT axles 4900, Combined 11660
TV back for reweigh after dropping off trailer: front axle 3080, rear axle 2940, combined 6020 (which puts the TT at 5640 without water)

MILLMITCH
That was the number I got but wasn't sure if it was 10% or 15% (1140) tongue wt. TOO MUCH!! So if I add a couple of washers that will push weight toward front AND back to TT? also you was real close on TT weight, it was 7550/ Truck weighs 6010 unhitched

[pdqparalegal1]

Originally Posted by MillMitch

you are on the right track. After loading the trailer, my tongue increased from 600# to almost 850# which required another washer for me to level it back up. I'm at 7, your TV is bigger and longer than mine, so you probably need more washers. CAT scales are cheap, keep tweaking it.

Originally Posted by RobinDella

MILLMITCH
Thanks! I care to differ on Cat scales LOL Of course I retired from trucking in 04 (35yrs and 3 million plus miles). They were 6 bucks then but still in todays money I guess they're keeping up with inflation. Having to borrow wrench from Auto Zone is a pain but I'll do what I have to do. I'm thinking start with 2 washers and see what comes of that. Now how do you determine tongue weight? isn't it a percentage of the rear axle weight?

Either buy a scale to put under tongue jack or go to Cat scale. Put trailer axles on one scale pad and tongue jack on the other. You’ll have to remove from trick to do this. Drive truck off scales and level TT and grt weights. That will give you axle(s) weight, tongue weight, and total weight of trailer.
There are other various combinations you can use to get a lot of information.

[MillMitch]

Originally Posted by RobinDella

MILLMITCH
That was the number I got but wasn't sure if it was 10% or 15% (1140) tongue wt. TOO MUCH!! So if I add a couple of washers that will push weight toward front AND back to TT? also you was real close on TT weight, it was 7550/ Truck weighs 6010 unhitched

short answer is yes, but check measurements after.
And what pdqparalegal1 said is the most accurate way to weigh the TT including tongue weight.

[RobinDella]

Originally Posted by MillMitch

short answer is yes, but check measurements after.
And what pdqparalegal1 said is the most accurate way to weigh the TT including tongue weight.

Don't want to tie up scales for that. Easier way to get total trailer weight is to weigh full set up then go drop TT and weigh truck. as far as tongue weight I can calculate all that. I believe I have all the info I need to 'tweak' this. I know I'm close and appreciate your time and knowledge on this matter MILLMITCH you've been very helpfull.