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Old 05-11-2016, 12:13 PM   #1
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In need of expert opinions please

100% newbie and learning at warp speed (first time truck owners and first time TT owners after having been tent campers for 12 years) We researched before we purchased both and found TV could easily haul the TT. However, since purchasing both in Dec, our needs have changed and we bought a larger TT to accommodate 2 additional campers joining us on a 2 1/2 month summer cross country trip.

Here's where we desperately need some expert opinions:

We know the TV can haul the TT but what we need to know is how much wiggle room in weight do we have? I have scoured and researched every old thread on this site, have called FR to inquire about items included/not included in the dry weight, have googled every towing chart known to man trying to determine the answer myself. However, the three of us researching this have each come up with a different answer. Plus, we aren't sure quite how the payload fits into all the numbers. We would like to be responsible RV'ers as we travel so any insight you can provide would be appreciated.

Specifics:

TV is a 2105 RAM 1500 SLT Crew Cab 4 x 2, 5'7" bed, 3.0L V6 EcoDiesel, 3.55 rear axle ratio, with Max Trailer Weight Rating of 7,870 pounds. Per the Towing Chart: GVWR is 6950, Payload is 1540

TT is a 2016 Cherokee Grey Wolf 26DBH with dry weight of 5757 pounds.

Passengers=1200 lbs

We do have a Reese WD bar and are willing to consider additional things (like airbag assist or suggestions?) if needed.

TIA for any expert opinions as we are at a loss of where else to ask and know the answer is not slighted in some way.
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Old 05-11-2016, 12:33 PM   #2
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You can take your payload of 1540 and put in here and guess about passengers weight and what else you will carry in the truck and see what the max weight TT would be. Remember not to use Dry Weights but a loaded TT with all the camping stuff. You will run out of payload way before you run out of towing capacity. I added about 1500 to 2000 lbs which seems like a lot but after you loaded up with all the stuff that is about what we go camping with.

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Old 05-11-2016, 12:41 PM   #3
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The dry weight of the TT is given with the propane tank full and all other tanks dry. Also that is with NOTHING else in the trailer.
The cargo capacity of the truck is given with a full gas tank and 1 150# driver. So every item that you add to the truck including the passengers and the dog or what ever count towards the CCC of the truck.
I think that the CCC of your truck will be the limiting factor for you, but to ensure you should have the truck and TT weighed at a scales with all the passengers and such that you plan on traveling with.
CCC of truck 1540 + 150 driver calculated into the CCC number leaves 1690 pounds total carrying capacity - 1200# of passengers = 490# of capacity remaining. About 10% of the trailer weight will be tong weight so lets say 575# dry, so you are all ready over the CCC by 85# with nothing in the trailer. Remember what ever you add to the trailer will place an additional weight of 10% on the truck. A WDH will not correct this problem nor will any air bags or similar. So bottom line is you can pull this weight OK but you cannot carry the weight within the ratings of your truck. This is a very common occurrence.
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Old 05-11-2016, 12:54 PM   #4
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Payload is figured from Curb Weight which is NO DRIVER/PASSENGERS but all fluids full.

Tow Capacity is figured from curb weight plus 154 lbs driver and all fluids full

Slide in Camper Capacity is Curb Weight plus 150lb person per seat belt

That is from the supervisor of the F150 truck weighng at the Kansas City Ford Plant.
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Old 05-11-2016, 01:52 PM   #5
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OK based upon CWSwine's correction of my numbers you will be over weight by 235 # before you add any items to the TT.
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Old 05-11-2016, 02:00 PM   #6
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It doesn't make you feel better...I have a 3/4T diesel 4x4 and everyone knows it will pull anything. Not. I have a measly 2065 cargo. What a disappointment.


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Old 05-11-2016, 02:03 PM   #7
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It doesn't make you feel better...I have a 3/4T diesel 4x4 and everyone knows it will pull anything. Not. I have a measly 2065 cargo. What a disappointment.


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Old 05-11-2016, 02:17 PM   #8
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One item y'all are missing: the OP took the payload number from the towing chart, not the yellow label in the driver door jamb. His payload capacity may be even lower.
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Old 05-11-2016, 02:26 PM   #9
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'dem diesels sure are heavy..

Pulled my 26dbh with a 10 Chevy 1500 did great.

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Old 05-11-2016, 02:29 PM   #10
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I am going to suggest that you take 2 vehicles and have most of the passengers in the other vehicle and then you should have plenty of Payload capacity for the trailer.
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Old 05-11-2016, 02:55 PM   #11
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I am going to suggest that you take 2 vehicles and have most of the passengers in the other vehicle and then you should have plenty of Payload capacity for the trailer.
Agreed.
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Old 05-11-2016, 03:58 PM   #12
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In need of expert opinions please

CLR, I see this all the time about payload but it is wrong as a previous poster pointed out. The tow rating includes a 150 lb driver, but the payload rating does not. Hence why stickers say occupants and cargo should not exceed XXXX. The driver is an occupant.


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Old 05-11-2016, 04:28 PM   #13
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In need of expert opinions please

I have been in a similar situation pulling a 4200 lb (unloaded) trailer with a Buick Enclave with towing capacity of 5200 lbs. We travelled 12,000 miles (18,000km) from Ontario to Alaska. We always ran with only 5 gallons of water in our tanks to keep weight down. Had a great trip but was really slow in the Rocky Mountains. Ok if we could start with speed but if you came to the bottom of a big hill we could not go above 20 mph. Speed was never a problem on level ground.

Upgraded to a truck for our next trip to California and had no issues even on Highway #1 with it's hair pin turns at the bottom of a steep hill.
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Old 05-11-2016, 04:49 PM   #14
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I would have thought by the year 2105 Dodge trucks would have advanced just a little bit more!

One of the best things to do is get all the info from door jam. Towing charts is an umbrella for all 1500 trucks. You need to be more concerned with YOUR trucks capacities. One sticker will have all axle weight ratings, the other (yellow sticker w\tire info) will have payload number.

It's highly unlikely that you could squeeze all this in and be under ratings. But if you ask for a "show of hands" on forum on who is OVER on at least one of their rating. You would be very surprised how many are. I am NOT condoning this by any means, especially being rookies, but over by a hundred pounds isn't terrible either.
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Old 05-11-2016, 05:00 PM   #15
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Reconsider the 1,200 lbs of passengers. I don't think that many could fit into the cab.
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Old 05-11-2016, 05:33 PM   #16
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Crystal - I think you'll be overloaded (a little) on several key parameters. As others have pointed out, you need to get the payload from the yellow sticker on the door jam of your truck. I have a very similar truck and my actual payload is only 1,200 pounds. Every option adds weight (including air suspension!). My empty camper is lighter than yours, but actual weight by truck scales is 6,120 and the truck (4X4) weighs 5,960. If we estimate your trailer heavier by 300 pounds (loaded for travel) and your truck lighter by 300, we'd be pretty close. Pin weight is the problem, mine is 800 pounds and yours will be at least that much. Me, the wife, and the dog puts me 80 pounds over the 1,200 payload and 90 pounds over the GVWR.

Guess what? Truck handles the trailer just fine! The same chassis is rated to tow over 10,000 pounds with a Hemi. The EcoDiesels are de-rated in part because the intercooler is in front of the radiator which means on long heavy hot tows the engine will overheat (actually it de-fuels to prevent overheating). Take your time, stay at or below the speed limit and don't race any EcoBoost Fords up a hill. You'll be fine.
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Old 05-11-2016, 08:04 PM   #17
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Lots of mentions here about looking at the yellow sticker to get the payload. That's a big mistake because it's a generic number that has nothing to do with your particular truck. It's a good starting point for comparison with other vehicles.

The only way you can get the REAL payload is to take your truck to a CAT scale. My truck sticker shows a "payload" of 1,761. Even if that number was truly accurate, you will never, ever, operate it at a weight to obtain that figure because it doesn't include any fuel or driver weight. My CAT scale weight with a full tank of fuel, driver and one passenger gives a remaining payload of 1420 pounds. Reduce that by about 180 to 200 pounds for the EcoDiesel. The 1420 number is just fine with me because the hitch adds 1,000 pounds and I've never traveled with more than the one passenger.

You mentioned airbag assist. Since your truck fully loaded is going to be within 200-300 pounds of the maximum rear axle weight they will do little to nothing to helping to increase maximum weight. However, I strongly recommend you install them (I used the Airlift 1000) for the sole reason of increasing lateral stability. It's really remarkable how they help with that. As far as height changes, with the trailer attached there's less than 1.5 inch difference in ball height above ground at the maximum 35 psi in the airbags.
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Old 05-11-2016, 08:35 PM   #18
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Lots of mentions here about looking at the yellow sticker to get the payload. That's a big mistake because it's a generic number that has nothing to do with your particular truck. It's a good starting point for comparison with other vehicles.
I totally disagree that the payload on the yellow sticker is "generic". It is unique to every truck that rolls off the assembly line. The weight on that sticker is a result of the either the vehicle being weighed at the end of assembly, or for some manufacturers, a result of a tabulation of the known weights of every component for that build.

I will agree that the payload number changes, usually a decrease, the minute you purchase the truck and put all of your stuff in the cab, those mud flaps, the bed cover, etc. However, is much better than using the payload value from a towing chart or the mfr brochure.
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Old 05-11-2016, 08:43 PM   #19
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I totally disagree that the payload on the yellow sticker is "generic". It is unique to every truck that rolls off the assembly line. The weight on that sticker is a result of the either the vehicle being weighed at the end of assembly, or for some manufacturers, a result of a tabulation of the known weights of every component for that build.

I will agree that the payload number changes, usually a decrease, the minute you purchase the truck and put all of your stuff in the cab, those mud flaps, the bed cover, etc. However, is much better than using the payload value from a towing chart or the mfr brochure.
Then how can my truck have the exact same sticker number (1,761) as the truck sitting next to it on the lot. But, my truck had the factory trailer hitch and the 5.7 Hemi engine and the other truck did not have a trailer hitch and had the smaller (and lighter) Pentastar V6 engine. The stickers on both were identical.
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Old 05-11-2016, 08:55 PM   #20
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My neighbor and I have the same truck except he has leather bucket seats shift on fly 4X4 and doesn't have tailgate step. His payload is 205 lbs less than mine. Team four what's your payload? We have same trucks it is hard to see but mines is 2819 lbs. I will get picture of neighbors soon.
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