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Old 05-09-2012, 04:19 PM   #1
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I've done my homework... can you help double-check my numbers?

I've done my homework and read up extensively on towing. I've finalized the model RV and Truck I think I should get. Can someone volunteer to help double-check my numbers for me? I'd be very grateful!

Truck: 2012 GMC 3500HD Ext Cab SRW 2WD Duramax Diesel 6.6L V-8 Turbo
5th Wheel: 2012 Columbus Palomnio 320RS

Changing Gears Calculation: (with numbers filled in)
Fifth Wheel Weight Calculator

11,600 Tow vehicle GVWR
24,500 Tow vehicle GCWR
17,300 Tow vehicle maximum loaded trailer weight rating
??? Tow vehicle maximum king pin weight rating
7,050 Tow vehicle RGAWR
6,741 Tow vehicle GVW
??? Tow vehicle RGAW
10,604 Fifth wheel trailer GVW (or GTW)
2,015 Fifth wheel trailer king pin weight
20% Safety margin

RESULT: The Maximum Trailer Weight of 17,300 is less than the trailer when fully loaded at the Trailer GVWR of 14,080. However, I'm a bit shy of the 20% safety margin at 13,840. And at maximum trailer weight, estimating 25% as pin weight I'm under what the rear axle can handle.



REFERENCES:

Sierra Specs:
2012 GMC Sierra 3500HD Capabilities | Heavy Duty Pickup Truck | GMC

Sierra Brochure:
(PDF page 40; Actual Page 38)
http://www.gmc.com/content/dam/GMC/g...a-brochure.pdf

2012 Columbus Palomnio 320RS
Palomino RV - Manufacturer of Quaility RVs since 1968
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Old 05-09-2012, 04:22 PM   #2
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Old 05-09-2012, 04:38 PM   #3
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[QUOTE=Frogz;193531]I've done my homework and read up extensively on towing. I've finalized the model RV and Truck I think I should get. Can someone volunteer to help double-check my numbers for me? I'd be very grateful!

Truck: 2012 GMC 3500HD Ext Cab SRW 2WD Duramax Diesel 6.6L V-8 Turbo
5th Wheel: 2012 Columbus Palomnio 320RS

Changing Gears Calculation: (with numbers filled in)
Fifth Wheel Weight Calculator

11,600 Tow vehicle GVWR
24,500 Tow vehicle GCWR
17,300 Tow vehicle maximum loaded trailer weight rating
??? Tow vehicle maximum king pin weight rating
7,050 Tow vehicle RGAWR
6,741 Tow vehicle GVW
??? Tow vehicle RGAW
10,604 Fifth wheel trailer GVW (or GTW)
2,015 Fifth wheel trailer king pin weight
20% Safety margin

You are solid provided your 5th wheel hitch is rated for at least 12,000 pounds. ??? Tow vehicle maximum king pin weight rating
I would get one that can handle the maximum camper weight your truck can tow. (say 16,000 pounds)

??? Tow vehicle RGAW is the actual weight with the camper on so you won't have that in this case so you leave it blank.

The 20% safety margin is really not "safety" per se. It is how much under your max possible you want to routinely operate. 20% under will give you plenty of power for hills and stuff; but you can get away with less if needed.

I am thinking you are going to really like this combination.
Safe camping.
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Old 05-09-2012, 06:35 PM   #4
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Thanks for your help!

We're going to be full-timers and over the next year we could log as many as 10,000 miles and stops at nearly 50 parks so we're getting a nice hitch with airbags to smooth out our ride. Specifically this one with the Holland/Binkley hitch:
25K 5th Wheel Air Hitch
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Old 05-09-2012, 07:08 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frogz View Post
Thanks for your help!

We're going to be full-timers and over the next year we could log as many as 10,000 miles and stops at nearly 50 parks so we're getting a nice hitch with airbags to smooth out our ride. Specifically this one with the Holland/Binkley hitch:
25K 5th Wheel Air Hitch
Well THAT should certainly do it.

Plug in 25K in that slot on the calculator and rerun the numbers.
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Old 05-09-2012, 07:25 PM   #6
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My $.02, the 2500HD is rated at 397 hp vs. 360 in the 3500. Also the 2500 has TPMS and the 3500 does not, data from the Duramax forum. Things may have changed for 2012.
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Old 05-09-2012, 08:01 PM   #7
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Thanks for the feedback MIKE44460. I actually couldn't much difference between the two models. The PDF I found lists them both with 397 hp. Maybe something changed?

I did notice the 3500HD can handle 7,050 on it's rear axle while the 2500HD can only handle 6,200. I'm sure a "truck guy" could find other differences, but as I need to be able handle all the pin weight and truck cargo that I can, I'll take the extra 850 lbs.

This trailer in particular puts the washer and dryer and a large closet right over the hitch so I'm expecting a higher pin weight once we're all packed up. (I do plan on weighing it on the way home from the dealer so I know how much we can add.)

I can't wait to pick it up!

Sierra Brochure:
(PDF page 40; Actual Page 38)
http://www.gmc.com/content/dam/GMC/g...a-brochure.pdf
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Old 05-09-2012, 08:32 PM   #8
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The GMC web site has the same Duramax engine in both the 2500HD and the 3500HD 397HP at 3000RPM.

The TPMS shows as "STANDARD" on the 2500HD and "AVAILABLE" on the 3500HD.
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Old 05-09-2012, 09:00 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by herk7769 View Post
The TPMS shows as "STANDARD" on the 2500HD and "AVAILABLE" on the 3500HD.
For Tire Pressure Monitoring, I'm planning on getting a Hopkins system so I can monitor the tire pressure of the trailer wheels as well. It will also give me more information than I've had in previous vehicles.
Hopkins Tire Pressure Monitoring System - Hopkins Mfg Co 38100VA - Tire Accessories - Camping World

I've had A TPMS on several other vehicles and I found it quite annoying. A light comes on to tell you that air is low in one tire. How low? Which tire? What's even worse is that once a sensor broke and it didn't bother to tell me that - just the same unintuitive and panicky "check your tires" light. A name brand tire installer shop had a lot of difficulty figuring out what had happened. Only the dealer seemed to be able to fix it.

At least with the system linked above I'll know which tire, what PSI, and I'll have a Green, Yellow, Red warning so I know how urgent the situation is. It's not cheap as I'll also need an extra set to cover the rest of the tires and with a 37' trailer the repeater is recommended. The peace of mind will be worth it and will compensate for the minivan with "run flat" tires I'll be leaving behind.
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Old 05-09-2012, 09:44 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herk7769 View Post
The GMC web site has the same Duramax engine in both the 2500HD and the 3500HD 397HP at 3000RPM.

The TPMS shows as "STANDARD" on the 2500HD and "AVAILABLE" on the 3500HD.
Our 2011 is 397hp.
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Old 05-09-2012, 09:48 PM   #11
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Frogz
out of curiosity - I am wondering why you would select a SRW over the DRW - as the 2 extra tire do offer some benefits above and beyond capacity.
BTW good to see people double checking before signing on the bottom line.
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Old 05-09-2012, 09:50 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by sreddy View Post
BTW good to see people double checking before signing on the bottom line.
Amen Brother!
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Old 05-10-2012, 12:48 PM   #13
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Frogz
out of curiosity - I am wondering why you would select a SRW over the DRW - as the 2 extra tire do offer some benefits above and beyond capacity
Good question! I've been thinking about SRW vs DRW a lot.

I test drove a DRW and I felt like I was taking up the entire lane. While I expect to feel that way while towing, this truck will be my daily driving vehicle as well. If I can tow the RV with SRW, I'd rather do so.

I also have the challenge of keeping the combined GVWR under 26,001 as we will be spending time in a lot of different states. While many states exempt RVs used for "personal use", depending on who you ask, if you own a business and drive an RV, your RV use might be considered a "commercial motor vehicle" and subject to different license regulations. Staying under 26,001 and a trailer under 15,000 steers clear of most states regulations.
RV Driver's License Requirements

While you might ask how will a highway patrol would know I own a business? We'll be getting the trailer "wrapped" with an ad which will make that fact pretty obvious. I've talked this over with DOT contacts in two states and it seems that with the wrap we'll need to register with the DOT as a "property carrier" (we won't be taking passengers for hire). And they advised us that above a combined 26,001 weight we'd also need to have a Class A license.
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Old 05-10-2012, 01:54 PM   #14
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That's interesting Frogz. Does that wrapper and subsequent "property carrier" registration mean that you are subject to stops at weight stations, too?

Oh yea - Great job on running the numbers!
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Old 05-10-2012, 02:00 PM   #15
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That's interesting Frogz. Does that wrapper and subsequent "property carrier" registration mean that you are subject to stops at weight stations, too?
Unfortunately... YES. And a while lot of other requirements like registering each time we plan to enter a new state. I haven't read up on it much yet but will need to soon.

For the benefit of others who might be in this situation, DOT provided me this link for more information:
ETA - A Motor Carrier's Guide to Improving Highway Safety - Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration


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Oh yea - Great job on running the numbers!
Thanks! I've spend WAY too much time on on this!
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Old 05-10-2012, 02:28 PM   #16
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Thanks! I've spend WAY too much time on on this!
Measure twice cut once
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Old 05-10-2012, 05:41 PM   #17
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You might want to look at 4WD options as well. If you are only going to be on hard surfaces, 2WD should do nicely. But if you ever get stuck on dirt it only takes one time to make the day a very long one.

Another thing is that GMC has a auto 4WD option (my truck does not have it). It is suppose to be very nice in the rain and such, so I would expect it would help with control.

I also don't know what the gauge packages are, but I would recommend ScanGaugeII (there is a diesel version now). It really helps a lot for planning stops and managing fuel.
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Old 05-10-2012, 05:52 PM   #18
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You might want to look at 4WD options as well. If you are only going to be on hard surfaces, 2WD should do nicely. But if you ever get stuck on dirt it only takes one time to make the day a very long one.

Another thing is that GMC has a auto 4WD option (my truck does not have it). It is suppose to be very nice in the rain and such, so I would expect it would help with control.
Something I read somewhere advised against 4WD for 5th wheel towing. There was some mention about it adding height to the truck and thus making the hitch connection harder or improper. I really didn't give it much thought after that. This could be wrong for all I know.

Any other Fivers out there with 4WD who want to share their experience?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ng2951 View Post
I also don't know what the gauge packages are, but I would recommend ScanGaugeII (there is a diesel version now). It really helps a lot for planning stops and managing fuel.
I'll look into this. I'm still in the process of selecting options for the truck.

Thanks!
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Old 05-10-2012, 08:10 PM   #19
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Only wished I had 4x4 twice.

If you saw that snowy photo of my Blue boy and bikes I needed to put my chains on to get it out of the spot when the snow froze that night.

The other time I got stuck camping on grass and I needed a CASE backhoe and some 10,000 pound aircraft tiedown chains to get me and the camper out of the mud. Oh, 4x4 would have gotten me "stucker" and the CASE may not have been enough.

Other than that, my 2WD with Posi rear does me just fine for 4 years now. 1 1/2 years with a TT and 2 1/2 years with our 5th wheel.
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Old 05-11-2012, 11:23 AM   #20
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A quick thanks to everyone who chimed in with their thoughts and data!
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