Need a new trailer with lower tongue weight

[pgandw]

Originally Posted by CaptnJohn

Are there any "full featured" pop ups out there?

The A-frame line up from Forest River is "fully featured". It's a great way for 2-3 people to camp. They all come standard with A/C (not on the roof), heater, water heater, water system, outdoor shower, stereo, microwave, dual propane, and wireless repeater. Can store in a standard garage stall and setup is about 5 minutes.

A-frames weight less than 3500lbs max, and have real tongue weights in the 400lb range.

What the A-frames DO NOT have are:
- separate rooms
- ability to comfortably sleep more than 3 (our kids use separate tents)
- a lot of floor space
- gray and black water (use a bucket for the sink drain)
- a separate bathroom. One model has a combo toilet shower with walls and door. Another has a cassette potty inside a box. The rest have portable toilets.

To me an A-frame is more functional than an R-pod - except for the bathroom.

Fred W
2019 Flagstaff T21TBHW A-frame
2008 Hyundai Entourage minivan
camping Colorado and adjacent states one weekend at a time

[MikeInRaleigh]

The first step here is to take your fully loaded rig to a commercial scale and weigh the rear axle. I would be shocked if you are overloaded on the rear axle, if your WDH is properly set up. I see a lot of fifth wheels being pulled with F150 Ecoboosts.

[Tacky]

How big/heavy a trailer do you have? If you are overloaded on the rear axle with everything empty, either the trailer is huge, or it is not loaded correctly. I suspect you can be in spec by tightening up the WDH and maybe relocating those heavy 6v batteries, or replacing with a single 12 v if you are not dry camping. Anything with 400 lb toung weight will be very small, and I think you could tow a significantly larger trailer with an F150. We'd need a lot more detail to try to help on that end.

[MikeInRaleigh]

Something is still not adding up here. If you have close to 1500 carrying capacity on the truck, you should be able to support close to 1000 lb. tongue weight. Class IV hitches rated for 1000 lb weight carrying are rated for 1400 lb with weight distributing hitch, implying that 25% of the weight is transferred to the front axle and the trailer, when WDH is properly set up. When I am estimating load for my 5th wheel, I allow 250 Lbs. for driver, 150 lbs. for passenger, 100 lbs. for hitch, and 50 lbs. for drinks and snacks. Even if you are carrying a generator, bicycles, etc., it seems you should still be at 700 or 800 lb. available tongue weight with WDH. Also, pickups are light in the back, so, in my experience, the overall carrying capacity is less than the sum of front and rear axles, to the benefit of the available rear axle load. At one time, I pulled my 5th wheel with a Silverado with 1500 lb. capacity. When loaded, I was at around 1800 lbs. total, but was well below the rear axle capacity, including the tires, with the pin directly over the rear axle. Bottom line is I suspect your WDH is not set up correctly.

[pilotpip]

Originally Posted by MikeInRaleigh

Something is still not adding up here. If you have close to 1500 carrying capacity on the truck, you should be able to support close to 1000 lb. tongue weight. Class IV hitches rated for 1000 lb weight carrying are rated for 1400 lb with weight distributing hitch, implying that 25% of the weight is transferred to the front axle and the trailer, when WDH is properly set up. When I am estimating load for my 5th wheel, I allow 250 Lbs. for driver, 150 lbs. for passenger, 100 lbs. for hitch, and 50 lbs. for drinks and snacks. Even if you are carrying a generator, bicycles, etc., it seems you should still be at 700 or 800 lb. available tongue weight with WDH. Also, pickups are light in the back, so, in my experience, the overall carrying capacity is less than the sum of front and rear axles, to the benefit of the available rear axle load. At one time, I pulled my 5th wheel with a Silverado with 1500 lb. capacity. When loaded, I was at around 1800 lbs. total, but was well below the rear axle capacity, including the tires, with the pin directly over the rear axle. Bottom line is I suspect your WDH is not set up correctly.

OP mentioned in an earlier post that there are 4 people and 2 large dogs in the truck.

One other thing of note, the F-150 comes in about 179623972 configurations and those changes include frame, axle and suspension differences that widely effect payload and GCVW. I'm with the others suggesting a different truck.

Maybe not a 3/4 ton. I went from a 13 F-150 that had an ecoboost, 6.5' bed, and 3.31 gears to an 18 with the 5.5' bed, and 3.55 with the max tow package. Payload in the old one was about 1300lbs. The new one is nearly 1800 and that got me where I wanted to be with room for my kids to grow.

[lswartz]

Take a look at the Rockwood Geo Pro, the G19BH is 360lbs. although batteries & propane will put you over your 400 lbs. Shorter Geo’s have less young weight.

[LivingToCamp]

Look at FR Shasta Oasis 18BH. Sleeps 4 people and a dog comfortably, you can squeeze 5 people as long as 1 person is small.
My TT tows fine with my Mountaineer.


Hitch Weight:
350 lb.
GVWR
4750 lb.
UVW
3182 lb.
CCC
1568 lb.
Exterior Length:
22' 5"
Exterior Height:
10' 6"
Exterior Width:
96"
Fresh Water:
42 gal.
Gray Water:
36 gal.
Black Water:
36 gal.
Awning Size:
12'

[Boomerweps]

Concur with all on the thoughts on revisiting your WDH setup, it should move some weight to both the TT axle(s) and the TV steering axle, 1 or 2 hundred pounds at least, to both axles.
Second, consider moving the heavy 6vdc batteries to the rear or over the axles. Yes, it will require some heavy gauge wire and venting considerations. Likely dropping the underside panels or sheeting to run the wires easier. WTH, owning an RV or TT means customize it till it suits you

[Tblt44]

Tell us about your trailer, brand model ect.
Only 400 lbs tounge weight for a F150 does not seem correct.
With a weight distribution hitch you can sometimes double your hitch weight.
Some shocks have built in helper coil springs which help with payload capacity and help with control.
Monroe load adjusting shock is one.
I have them on my tahoe after the high dollar factory load adjusting shock failed

[BradJB]

Something doesn’t add up here. I have a 2.7L babyboost and easily pull a Grey Wolf 20RDSE. It seems full featured to me. Easily pulled up the mountain at Ashville last week, fully loaded for a week dry camping. That’s with two propane tanks, two 6V batteries, WDH. Sticker says 4087 lb empty weight.

[bikendan]

[QUOTE=Tblt44;2128655]
Some shocks have built in helper coil springs which help with payload capacity and help with control.
[QUOTE]

Air bags or rollover shocks only help with sag and stability. They do NOT increase payload capacity.

[TonyR]

Originally Posted by clr

Well to stay under your 400 pound limit I would suggest that your unit dry should weigh no more than about 3000 pounds. You can get several units that are quite good at that weight limit size. Below are several smaller units that are normally recommended.

Forest River R-Pod Travel Trailer Travel Trailer Series 2342-2836 lbs 18 to 20 feet 2 to 4 people.
· Gas detectors
· Safety-glass windows
· Wood-glazed drawer fronts
· 9 floorplans

KZ Sportsmen Classic Travel Trailer Travel Trailer Series 2126-2840 lbs 15 to 21 feet 3 to 5 people
· Solar panels
· Alum-a-tough roofing
· AC
· Awning with LED lights

Palomino PaloMini 180FB Travel Trailers Travel Trailer Model 2823 lbs 21 feet 3 people.
· Awning with LED lights
· Walkable roof
· Memory foam mattress
· AC and furnace

Lance 1575 Travel Trailer Travel Trailer Model 2775 lbs 20.5 feet 4 people · Skylights
· Stereo systems
· Furnace
· Bluetooth speakers

Airstream Sport 22FB Travel Trailer Model 2860 lbs 22 feet 1 to 4 people · Several entertainment options
· Dinette-cum-bed
· AC
· Ultraleather seating

Good luck and remember RVing in any size unit requires some compromises some were.

We have something in that range...2016 Coachmen Apex Nano 191RBS...22’, dry tongue listed at 315, but ours says 382 on the A frame, loaded trailer 4500 GVR.

Tow it with a ‘17 F-150, 3.5 EB, Fx4, SCAB, 3:55 rear, max tow pkg, 1913 payload (maybe @1600 left after mods). No WDH, but use a Hayes Sway Master. Only two people and loaded trailer is @4200. Tongue weight was a concern at @550, moved stuff around in the trailer and into the truck bed and got down to 480. So far so good. Don’t know if any of this helps, but good luck.

[J Man]

Originally Posted by harpo-the-camper

I recently bought a used travel trailer. I just had my whole rig weighed and ran in to problems. I weighed each axle sedately, with the trailer attached and empty. The truck was empty except for me. All the axles were under their rated limits except the rear truck axle which was 100lbs over the rated load. The TT had a number of upgrades including 6v batteries and a weight distributing anti-sway hitch (which distributes the weight better but adds to your total weight). My rear axle will be way over with a full load so I am thinking of selling the TT and buying a new one.

Does anyone have suggestions for a fully featured travel trailer with a tongue weight of about 3-400 pounds? Weight of the trailer doesn't seem to be an issue as my truck is rated to over 10000lbs towing. My payload is 1500lbs so a tongue weight of 400 pounds leaves me with 1100 pounds for driver, passenger, big dog, luggage, and additional weight in the trailer which I will easily use up. Driver/passengers/dog will be up to 600lb.

Any suggestions for fully featured travel trailers with a tongue weight of about 400 pounds? New or used, I will worry about cost later, my wife is in love with the one we have and doesn't want to sell it.

I was wrong, Ford includes some occupant weights in some of their figures but not in the payload figures.

Your luggage and anything else that will fit should be packed away in the trailer. And you should balance the load so not all of your heavy items are up in the front. You can load things to the rear of the trailer axles to lighten the tongue but doing that too much will create handling nightmares. I believe that you want 12-15% of the trailer weight on the tongue.

Without knowing any other specifics if you have weighed all the occupants/dogs and your hitch and only have 400 lbs left of your 1500 lbs payload then you will need a truck with a larger payload capacity. I don't think you will hurt anything going slightly over the payload now and then but only 400 lbs available for tongue weight is awfully low.

[Jhenson2211]

My newer 2018 Forest River Salem Cruise Lite 201BHXL bumper pull TT is a perfect little camper IMO. It’s about 28’ or so but has bunk beds(sleeps 6-8), and all the goodies. Nice size fresh/holding tanks & looks great too. Best part though is the weights, it’s a tandem axle so the GVWR and axle weight limits are way up there, I’ve loaded the inside completely full of gear and never came close to gross limit. The empty weight is somewhere around 4,000-4,500 and tongue weight loaded was no more than 600 lbs max. I have a 2017 Ram 3500 diesel which I know is way more truck than I need, but this TT was spot on with what I wanted and within budget (will upgrade later on) That Cummins doesn’t even know its back there lol. I pulled it all the way to Colorado from WV last fall and it never even shifted out of overdrive with cruise set at 65 mph. Got 14 mpg avg. whole 3,000+ mile trip too. You definitely don’t want to be pushing your trucks weight limits....that’ll leave you broke down on the side of the road eventually if you tow often

[jwfrede]

You had me there for a minute, like wow a 28' footer for under 5000 lbs, I want the rear living area version!! But that model actually lists at about 24 ft, about right for that weight. You could pull three of these with that truck and you wouldn't even know it until you hit some real mountains which it could still handle comfortably.

[Jhenson2211]

Oops you are correct. It’s listed at 24’ not 28’. I must’ve been thinking about the measurement with hitch and spare tire and all that. Here’s a pic of the main specs:

[bikendan]

Originally Posted by Jhenson2211

Oops you are correct. It’s listed at 24’ not 28’. I must’ve been thinking about the measurement with hitch and spare tire and all that. Here’s a pic of the main specs:

That 23.67' length IS ball to bumper. Can't imagine that your spare tire sticks out another 4'.[emoji6]

[Joe_GA]

Hmmm...where did the OP go to? He said all axles were under weight except the rear truck axle. So, if the front TV axle is underweight, perhaps some weight can be transferred via the WDH. Maybe the WDH was never set up properly. When I bought a bumper pull camper many years ago, the dealer installed my hitch and had it installed wrong. Even drilled holes in the wrong location on the frame. It would be nice if we had more info.

[rockfordroo]

The OP hasn't been back in 2-1/2 weeks. I think he was a drive-by.

[Jhenson2211]

Originally Posted by bikendan

That 23.67' length IS ball to bumper. Can't imagine that your spare tire sticks out another 4'.[emoji6]

Oh ok gotcha. I guess I measured with my motorcycle & carrier when I went to CO or something...hard to tell. My memory isn’t the best either lol.