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Old 07-21-2015, 12:24 PM   #1
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Need help with new purchase(s) TT and TV

We are looking to purchase our first TT in the near future. There's a ton of information out there that has lead me to just ask the questions. We are contemplating the following TT and TV. 2015 Coachmen Freedom Express BHS (UVW: 5265 lbs, GVWR: 7666, Ext Length: 28'7). TV: 2015 Ford Expedition EL HD tow pkg w/ 3.73 axle (max loaded trailer: 9,100 lbs, GCWR: 15,300, curb wt: 6,500 lbs; wheelbase: 130")

I know that at delivery weights will vary, but these specs will have to do for estimates. It seems like I'd want to consider 15,300 (GCWR truck) - 7,666 (GVWR of TT) - 6,500 (truck curb wt) = 1,134 lbs remaining before reaching max GCWR. Knowing that GCWR estimates one 150 lb driver and full tank of gas this would leave approximately 984 lbs of room for passengers/gear in TV.

I live in the Midwest, but will be traveling out West. This also assumes that I'm loading 2,401 lbs in the travel trailer and reaching the GVWR of TT. This seems unlikely even when hauling the full fresh water tank which should top out around 360 lbs. I think it would be reasonable to assume that we'd pack no more than 1,400 lbs of gear and water which would leave us around 2,000 below the GCWR before passengers.

Would this be a suitable combination?

Thanks in advance for your help!
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Old 07-21-2015, 12:30 PM   #2
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First and foremost... It will be far less expensive in the long run if you look forward... 2 trailer purchases, and buy your TV for THAT trailer. This is from experience....
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Old 07-21-2015, 12:37 PM   #3
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What's the payload capacity of the Expy and trailer tongue weight?
This is the main weakness of SUVs, when it comes to towing, especially when you add passengers, cargo and WDH to the vehicle.
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Old 07-21-2015, 12:47 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by bikendan View Post
What's the payload capacity of the Expy and trailer tongue weight?
This is the main weakness of SUVs, when it comes to towing, especially when you add passengers, cargo and WDH to the vehicle.
It looks like the tongue weight is listed at 667 lbs and I'm seeing payload numbers of ranging from 1,719 to 1,751 lbs.
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Old 07-21-2015, 12:58 PM   #5
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My first TV was a 2001 Expedition. My first TT only weighed about 4,000# loaded. I was almost at the payload limit, even though my "towing capacity" was not close. SUVs use a lot of useful load for the rear cabin area, seats, bling, etc...

It seems that when folks first get into RVing, they almost always get in small. That will usually do one of two things. They will usually either decide it's too cramped, and not as much fun as they thought... and quit... OR... They will start trading up for more room, only to find that their TV is far from adequate for what they want to tow. This requires a lot of cash outlay to move up because of having to replace both the trailer and the TV. This is the reason for my first comment. I would have explained it better but ... OK ... it WAS lunch time...

Good luck with your decision...
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Old 07-21-2015, 01:22 PM   #6
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Good points Schrederman and thanks for the insight. Being new to RV'ing its hard for us to want to buy an additional TV such as a 3/4 ton to pull the trailer 2-5 x per year. It makes more sense to me, right now, to upgrade the family hauler which is why we're targeting the SUV that we are as a TV.

If I simply can't get comfortable with the idea of using this combination then I'll need to re-evaluate which direction to go in. Maybe we make the leap and buy a 3rd vehicle just for towing, maybe we continue to explore with out travel trailer at all.

Thanks again for your insight!
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Old 07-21-2015, 07:13 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deano View Post
It looks like the tongue weight is listed at 667 lbs and I'm seeing payload numbers of ranging from 1,719 to 1,751 lbs.
Payload numbers will vary based on model, the more options the lower the payload. The Exp. is a great vehicle and I'm like you, we camp maybe 6 times a year with one long trip to Florida every year. If you have any specific questions about the Exp, I'm happy to help.
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Old 07-22-2015, 01:45 PM   #8
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Tv

Quote:
Originally Posted by schrederman View Post
My first TV was a 2001 Expedition. My first TT only weighed about 4,000# loaded. I was almost at the payload limit, even though my "towing capacity" was not close. SUVs use a lot of useful load for the rear cabin area, seats, bling, etc...

It seems that when folks first get into RVing, they almost always get in small. That will usually do one of two things. They will usually either decide it's too cramped, and not as much fun as they thought... and quit... OR... They will start trading up for more room, only to find that their TV is far from adequate for what they want to tow. This requires a lot of cash outlay to move up because of having to replace both the trailer and the TV. This is the reason for my first comment. I would have explained it better but ... OK ... it WAS lunch time...

Good luck with your decision...
Read ur post. We used to tent camp. So when the wife said she'd be interested in trailer camping I jumped. I bought a aframe t19qbhw , nice rig don't weigh much so set up the suv Ford Edge max tow 3500. Everything's cool tows well even with 100,000 plus. Wife says I ain't going out of the state with that TV . Cool , bought a Toyota Tundra which states it can do 10,000. Still got the aframe. Everything's cool but if necessary I'm covered for a decent upgrade😀
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Old 07-22-2015, 03:10 PM   #9
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To calculate your payload added from the TT take 12% of the total max loaded weight, then add in the weight of the WDH hitch you will use.

CHeck the door sticker for actual payload limits and make sure you, your family, your stuff, your hitch, and 12% of the max weight of the camper will come in under the payload.

I have RAM 1500 5.7L V8 with 10,500 max tow and I tow a Coachmen Freedom Express 292BHDS that is 6104 dry and 7400 max.

When we travel it is me, my husband, and our 30 lb dog, along with several bicycles and a yeti cooler filled with nothing but ice.

The payload on my RAM is 1620. I had to do some math and make some adjustments to keep our Truck from being over loaded.

I installed fork mounts on the dinette to move the bikes to the axles of the TT.
I load all food and clothes into the trailer before we start to tow.
I stop for ice as close to the campground as possible. And recently I bought an ice maker so I can just make ice one we get there.
I bought some lighter weight chairs.
I moved some things around in the camper to reside under the dinette, closest to the axles.

I bought a Blue Ox WDH, which wasn't a whole lot lighter than the original EAZ-Lift WDH, but is far and above better at transferring the weight and stabilizing the trailer.

Weight carried near the axles translates into 12% of that weight pressing down on your truck.

Weight carried near the tongue of the trailer or in the bed of the truck translates into 100% of that weight pressing down on your truck.

When loaded properly, I will overload the TT before I overload the Truck, but small changes and careful consideration makes this so. Lazy loading and throwing everything into the truck will result in my Truck being over it's Payload limit.

What I aim for is for the truck to be as heavy as possible BUT STILL BELOW PAYLOAD LIMITS, and the trailer to have 12% of it's total weight on the tongue. Having the truck be as heavy as possible but not overloaded helps the truck have better control over the TT. Light truck/heavy camper = poor control.

You'll love the Freedom Express. Check the stickers inside the doors on the expeditions and be sure you've allowed for enough payload. Move heavier items inside the trailer closer to the axles to reduce impact to your payload.

You may need to look at after market help for the suspension if you find the Exp is too soft. You may need to buy at least a middle-of-the-line WDH to assist in better WDH and control.
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Old 07-22-2015, 06:32 PM   #10
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Will it work Forest??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deano View Post
We are looking to purchase our first TT in the near future. There's a ton of information out there that has lead me to just ask the questions. We are contemplating the following TT and TV. 2015 Coachmen Freedom Express BHS (UVW: 5265 lbs, GVWR: 7666, Ext Length: 28'7). TV: 2015 Ford Expedition EL HD tow pkg w/ 3.73 axle (max loaded trailer: 9,100 lbs, GCWR: 15,300, curb wt: 6,500 lbs; wheelbase: 130")

I know that at delivery weights will vary, but these specs will have to do for estimates. It seems like I'd want to consider 15,300 (GCWR truck) - 7,666 (GVWR of TT) - 6,500 (truck curb wt) = 1,134 lbs remaining before reaching max GCWR. Knowing that GCWR estimates one 150 lb driver and full tank of gas this would leave approximately 984 lbs of room for passengers/gear in TV.

I live in the Midwest, but will be traveling out West. This also assumes that I'm loading 2,401 lbs in the travel trailer and reaching the GVWR of TT. This seems unlikely even when hauling the full fresh water tank which should top out around 360 lbs. I think it would be reasonable to assume that we'd pack no more than 1,400 lbs of gear and water which would leave us around 2,000 below the GCWR before passengers.

Would this be a suitable combination?

Thanks in advance for your help!
I( am not even going to go into the issue of weights and will it work or not, enough people are doing that already, BUT let me tell you that you are looking at a "SUV" and they are not the best tow vehicles when you compare them to a pick-up. The mai8n issue is going to be the rear suspension, most unless you get a 2500 series it will have a SOFT suspension so the mommy will be comfy when taking the kids to soccer, so it will be sponge, and it will sink when you put the trailer on it.

SO if you feel that is your best choice (stay with a suv) make sure you go through the options list and get all the trailering options they have, and then after you purchase it install air bags in the rear, and PLEASE make sure you purchase some kind of sway system!

SO I hope I have not scared you out of anything, as you can make it work, many do but you need to know what you are getting into, and more important what you will need to make it safe for your family and all on the roads. SO I wish you and your family many years of enjoyment in all the parks and campgrounds you can make it into.

Happy Camping
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Old 07-23-2015, 09:18 AM   #11
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I tow a similar size trailer with a 2012 Expedition and am very happy with it. I actually went from a 1/2 ton GMC crew cab pickup to the Expedition as our tow vehicle as it just works better for our family. 95% of the time the Expy is a soccer vehicle and we love our trailer so have no plans to go bigger. We take the trailer to some soccer tournaments. I did the weights about 15 different ways and am confident that everything works. I tow at between 5,000 and 5,500 lbs depending on the trip. We just got back from a week long trip to and through the Smoky Mountains and the Expy towed really well. In my opinion the GMC truck and the Expedition tow our trailer very similarly and if I had to pick nits, I would say the truck towed my setup slightly better on the highway at 60-65 mph and the Expy tows better on more windy 45-55mph roads. Good Luck making your decision(s).
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Old 07-25-2015, 08:34 AM   #12
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You'll have no problem with that combo. You'll love the way the Ecoboost pulls. Load everything you can in the trailer if you are worried about TV payload. The best piece of advice I can give is to get a good hitch. I highly recommend you get a ProPride. It is pricey, but Considering you are about to spend probably around $80k, the Propride shouldn't break the bank at $2700ish. You can worry yourself to death on these forums about weighing this or buying that or planning for your 84th trailer and so on.
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