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Old 06-02-2017, 06:10 PM   #21
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63K to 89K OUCH!


Yea... but they sure are pretty.
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Old 06-03-2017, 01:34 PM   #22
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Auto companies provide detailed towing information on their vehicles which is just a Google search away. Since you are focused on Ford products, I'm providing the following link to their newer vehicles - https://www.ford.com/towingguides/. You just need to make certain you are on the right vehicle combination (engine, body style, rear end ration, etc.). Most will give you a statement about what has already been included in the weights (small print). For my two cents, these are maximum weights assigned by the manufacturers and following them will keep you 'legal.' They may not always be 'reliable' numbers for particular circumstances like towing up or down steep grades. As noted, you are paying attention to the right things and taking positive steps to ensure the safety of your family.
I actually think these numbers are just the opposite, designed for the lowest common denominator. I bet the numbers could be exceeded by a bunch if the average person took care in other areas and didn't drive like an idiot, pushing every situation to the breaking point. Modern stuff is so much more capable than stuff 20 years ago, yet the ratings haven't moved much. My modern minivan would put a beat down on a 80's Corvette in any performance test you could put together and a modern F150 puts a beatdown on a 80's F150 yet payload and towing ratings haven't moved much.
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Old 06-04-2017, 07:05 AM   #23
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Old 06-04-2017, 10:25 AM   #24
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This in interesting... How could I find out this information on a vehicle I'm considering for purchase?

If I could, I would just buy a 2500 truck and call it a day with more than enough capacities. But we need an SUV due to kids and dog (soon to be dogs).

I feel like I'm so close to my limits with the SUV. We have been looking at the 2015-2016 Ford Expedition EL and their weights come in from 1,398 to 1,450. Interestingly the Lincoln Navigator L comes in from 1,479 to 1,499. So more of our focus has been on that vehicle.

But it's really a game changer if you are telling me I can add in 150 pounds for a driver and possibly the weight of fuel too.

I have seen in the Ford literature they boast a 1,600 pound payload package. I wonder if this is the Sticker (1,450) and the Driver (150)?

Ron
When I was towing a TT I used a F150 Lariat super crew cab. It had a 1900 payload and towing capacity of over 9000 lbs. It's been a while so those are rough estimates. The super crew cab had a spacious back seat area. It also had an accurate back up camera with a zoom function allowing me to put the ball directly under the tongue every time.
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Old 06-04-2017, 10:29 AM   #25
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Auto companies provide detailed towing information on their vehicles which is just a Google search away. Since you are focused on Ford products, I'm providing the following link to their newer vehicles - https://www.ford.com/towingguides/. You just need to make certain you are on the right vehicle combination (engine, body style, rear end ration, etc.). Most will give you a statement about what has already been included in the weights (small print). For my two cents, these are maximum weights assigned by the manufacturers and following them will keep you 'legal.' They may not always be 'reliable' numbers for particular circumstances like towing up or down steep grades. As noted, you are paying attention to the right things and taking positive steps to ensure the safety of your family.
Fully agree. I got a tow vehicle that was overkill and my maximum target was 70% of what the manufacturer claimed. I always felt safer towing knowing I still had a good cushion factor.
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Old 06-04-2017, 10:55 AM   #26
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When I was towing a TT I used a F150 Lariat super crew cab. It had a 1900 payload and towing capacity of over 9000 lbs. It's been a while so those are rough estimates. The super crew cab had a spacious back seat area. It also had an accurate back up camera with a zoom function allowing me to put the ball directly under the tongue every time.
Son 6 ft age 14
Daughter - 5'10" age 14
Dog collie 80 pounds

I can't see how a truck will work. I had the kids sit in a F350 yesterday. While a massive truck, I can't see them in the back seat with the dog for long road trips.
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Old 06-04-2017, 11:05 AM   #27
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How about 1 brother in law 6' 7" 350 lbs and the other brother in law 6' 6" and 260 lbs and still plenty of room in the back seat for a dog? Those super crew cabs are like having a living room in the back.
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Old 06-04-2017, 02:24 PM   #28
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Hi Ron045, tow height/payload is set by the mfg. based on motor, Brakes, gear ratio, suspension and original tires. Payload is weight after full tank of fuel, refer to manual for better explanation, usually posted on drivers side post. After your TV is all loaded up don't forget to add the TT tongue weight. Be sure to read manual about TT and when TT has to have brakes. If your into camping/travel and buying new/used TV plan 2 RVs ahead, TT to 5r.
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Old 06-04-2017, 02:41 PM   #29
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I'd get brakes on the TT unless it weigjed nearly nothing. It can come in real handy when you have to unexpectedly and suddenly stop. Especially on downhill and sandy stops...
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Old 06-04-2017, 07:39 PM   #30
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How about 1 brother in law 6' 7" 350 lbs and the other brother in law 6' 6" and 260 lbs and still plenty of room in the back seat for a dog? Those super crew cabs are like having a living room in the back.
I'd like to see a picture of that. I'll be they're covered in dog hair and can't eat anything in the back without the dog begging for it.

Maybe for a short trip, but not for a long one.

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Old 06-04-2017, 07:47 PM   #31
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I guess "room" is subjective they both are huge guys and had plenty of room. A dog will be a dog and begging whether it's a phone booth or a stadium. But it sounds like you really want the high end SUV.
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Old 06-04-2017, 07:48 PM   #32
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I fault vehicle manufacturers. We're quick to blame RV manufacturers, but vehicle manufacturers could solve a lot of arguments, and go far towards true safety, with ONE prominent statement that means something, instead of the zillion stickers that say "An airbag is present" or something........it needs to say:

"The towing capacity of this vehicle can NOT be considered until after the cargo carrying capacity (also called Payload) is within all stated limits".
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Old 06-04-2017, 07:59 PM   #33
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I fault vehicle manufacturers. We're quick to blame RV manufacturers, but vehicle manufacturers could solve a lot of arguments, and go far towards true safety, with ONE prominent statement that means something, instead of the zillion stickers that say "An airbag is present" or something........it needs to say:

"The towing capacity of this vehicle can NOT be considered until after the cargo carrying capacity (also called Payload) is within all stated limits".
Absolutely right. The other thing I noticed was the difference in tongue weight percentage of towing weight. That can range between 10 to 20 percent of trailer weight.
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Old 06-04-2017, 08:44 PM   #34
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I fault vehicle manufacturers. We're quick to blame RV manufacturers, but vehicle manufacturers could solve a lot of arguments, and go far towards true safety, with ONE prominent statement that means something, instead of the zillion stickers that say "An airbag is present" or something........it needs to say:

"The towing capacity of this vehicle can NOT be considered until after the cargo carrying capacity (also called Payload) is within all stated limits".
That's a confusing statement. My new truck has a towing capacity of 21,660 pounds. That's not related to payload. The limiting factor is gross combined vehicle rating...in my case 30,300. That means that if I do have a 21,660 pound trailer hooked up then the max weight of the truck is limited to 8,640 pounds. Since the empty weight is 8,200 that means my available payload is only 440 pounds. For every less pound of trailer weight the available payload will increase by one pound...until the max truck weight of 14,000 pounds is reached. If I'm already at max payload (meaning the truck now weighs 14,000 pounds) then the max towing capacity is 16,400.

So, I believe the statement should read "The towing capacity of this vehicle can NOT be considered until after the TOTAL weight of the vehicle is determined". 1500 and 2500 series vehicles usually reach max vehicle weight and max towing weight at almost the same time. It's rare for a 3500 series vehicle to pull the max allowable weigh unless the vehicle is only using a small amount of payload.
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Old 06-05-2017, 05:51 AM   #35
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I guess "room" is subjective they both are huge guys and had plenty of room. A dog will be a dog and begging whether it's a phone booth or a stadium. But it sounds like you really want the high end SUV.
No... Not really. Would I rather have a more capable truck that costs less than an SUV. You betcha.

So... show me, Please. Help me understand how others do this successfully, because I can't be the only one with this problem.

My large breed dog takes up 2/3's of the back when lying down. I've tried putting the dog in-between the kids and I've folded down the 40 side of the seat and had the dog there with the two kids sitting shoulder to shoulder on the 60 side of the seat. Neither worked well when considering a long day in the car. Squeezing two passengers and a dog might be great for a trip over to the next county, but is it comfortable for a 8+ hour drive daily when doing long road trips?

Respectfully,
Ron
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Old 06-05-2017, 06:34 AM   #36
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Space and allergy constraints have driven the decision for our dogs to ride in the camper.
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Old 06-05-2017, 06:43 AM   #37
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That's a confusing statement. My new truck has a towing capacity of 21,660 pounds. That's not related to payload. The limiting factor is gross combined vehicle rating...in my case 30,300. That means that if I do have a 21,660 pound trailer hooked up then the max weight of the truck is limited to 8,640 pounds. Since the empty weight is 8,200 that means my available payload is only 440 pounds. For every less pound of trailer weight the available payload will increase by one pound...until the max truck weight of 14,000 pounds is reached. If I'm already at max payload (meaning the truck now weighs 14,000 pounds) then the max towing capacity is 16,400.

So, I believe the statement should read "The towing capacity of this vehicle can NOT be considered until after the TOTAL weight of the vehicle is determined". 1500 and 2500 series vehicles usually reach max vehicle weight and max towing weight at almost the same time. It's rare for a 3500 series vehicle to pull the max allowable weigh unless the vehicle is only using a small amount of payload.
You're right, that's a better way of saying it. Thanks!!
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Old 06-05-2017, 06:46 AM   #38
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Space and allergy constraints have driven the decision for our dogs to ride in the camper.
That statement will get you blasted, I'm guessing............
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Old 06-05-2017, 07:16 AM   #39
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No... Not really. Would I rather have a more capable truck that costs less than an SUV. You betcha.

So... show me, Please. Help me understand how others do this successfully, because I can't be the only one with this problem.

My large breed dog takes up 2/3's of the back when lying down. I've tried putting the dog in-between the kids and I've folded down the 40 side of the seat and had the dog there with the two kids sitting shoulder to shoulder on the 60 side of the seat. Neither worked well when considering a long day in the car. Squeezing two passengers and a dog might be great for a trip over to the next county, but is it comfortable for a 8+ hour drive daily when doing long road trips?

Respectfully,
Ron
All I can tell you is my huge brother in laws took a 4 hour ride to Cape Cod and they said it was like riding in a living room. They were surprised at the room and they both own full sized vehicles (Lincoln Town Car & the largest sized BMW I think 760 model). I've been in the back of the Town Car and think the Super Cab is more roomy. Two 6 footers aren't going to fill the back seat nearly as much as my brother in laws.

Anyway, it's a suggestion and you might want to take a Saturday and bring the family to try out the seating in a Super Cab. The Lariat was a really nice ride and a good workhorse at the same time IMO.
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Old 06-05-2017, 07:19 AM   #40
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That statement will get you blasted, I'm guessing............
Well, maybe not as much as putting the dog in a crate on the roof of the vehicle! A la Romney like😀
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