Reese WD/dual cam HP. Weigh numbers

[boubou]

Went to the scales. Again

truck, loaded, dogs and spouse:
Steer axle: 3440
Drive axle: 2600
Gross weight: 6040


Truck and Trailer - no bars attached.
Steer axle: 3000
Drive axle: 3920
Trailer axle: 4880
Gross weight: 11800

Shasta dry tongue is 750 lbs
looks like it's 880 lbs true tongue weight

Truck and Trailer - 6 links of chains engaged - 800 lbs trunion bars
Steer axle: 3340
Drive axle: 3440
Trailer axle: 5060
Gross weight: 11840

Truck and Trailer - 5 links of chains engaged - 800 lbs trunion bars

Steer axle: 3500
Drive axle: 3180
Trailer axle: 5160
Gross weight: 11840

Question #1:
Can I keep the 800 lbs trunion bars?
they are distributing weight. The next size up is 1200 lbs

Question #2:
What number should I use to calculate the tongue weight? loaded trailer?
looks like 5800 lbs (11840-6040=5800 lbs) X .15 = 870 lbs?? is that correct? if so, is 15 % ok?

Question #3:
with 6 links of chains, I am short 100 lbs on the front wheels
with 5 links, I am over 60 lbs on the front wheels
which is better?

[lbrjet]

15% TW is fine. I would go with five links and the front 60lbs less in weight vs 100lbs more in weight. Five links also moved another 100lbs to the trailer axle which is not a bad thing. Five links will also put a little less stress on your bars. Can't really help with the 1200 bars vs. 800 bars. Maybe you can just lighten your TW a bit by loading some items in the rear of your trailer.

[MtnGuy]

Excellent weigh-ins, boubou !!!

The 800 lb. bars appear to be working OK in distributing the weight. As to whether using 5 or 6 links would be best.....I have mixed ideas on that. On my setup, I am 40 lbs. over my truck unloaded weight with the trailer attached. The idea 4 years ago when I set up my hitch is to distibute enough weight to the front axle to get it above the unloaded truck weight. Now the thinking seems to be to get weight to the front axle, but not exceed the unloaded weight. I have to setup a new head assembly on my truck, and don't know exactly how I am going to distribute the weight, but I am leaning towards leaving the front of the truck a little lite this go round......I might have to come back here and eat my words, though.

Several things to consider. Check out the axle weight ratings on the driver's door of your Ram. Make sure the front axle is rated for 3500 lbs.... probably should be. Be aware that as you go through a dip, the weight on the front axle will increase some.

Check out your owners manual and see what it says about loading the front axle.

I don't think you can go wrong with either of those settings. Maybe try out each on the road and see which feels the best ??

The 15% tongue weight good. But you may be able to load your camper back heavy, get the tongue weight down a little, and still be in the 13 to 14% tongue weight range. That might get your tongue closer to 800 lbs., making the spring bars more efficient, and then 6 links might be a better solution for your decision. I have found that loading 40 lbs in the back of my camper decreases the tongue weight 15 lbs. I have my heavy stuff in the back cabinets, and lighter stuff up front, and still have a 13.5% tongue weight percentage.

Again, excellent work.

[MtnGuy]

Originally Posted by lbrjet

Five links will also put a little less stress on your bars.

I think using the 5 links vs. the 6 links will put more stress on the bars instead of less stress.

[boubou]

Originally Posted by mtnguy

Excellent weigh-ins, boubou !!!
Check out the axle weight ratings on the driver's door of your Ram. Make sure the front axle is rated for 3500 lbs.... probably should be. Be aware that as you go through a dip, the weight on the front axle will increase some.

Front and rear GAWR are both 3900 lbs

as for loading, all I've got loaded up front are towing stuff, blocks, hammer and 2 chairs.
Most stuff is stored in the middle of the TT and I've got hoses, power cords and stuff in the back bathroom. I think I'll load the groceries in the bathroom as well, lots of room back there lol
a little unusual loading after reading most people need to load up front.

Thanks for all your help, it's been a learning experience and it took me a long time to get it right with winter in the way and all

[boubou]

I'd like to add I measured before and after hitching up and get same measurements on front wheels before tt attached and after hooked up with wd on ))

[boubou]

Originally Posted by mtnguy

The 15% tongue weight good. But you may be able to load your camper back heavy, get the tongue weight down a little, and still be in the 13 to 14% tongue weight range. That might get your tongue closer to 800 lbs., making the spring bars more efficient, and then 6 links might be a better solution for your decision. I have found that loading 40 lbs in the back of my camper decreases the tongue weight 15 lbs. I have my heavy stuff in the back cabinets, and lighter stuff up front, and still have a 13.5% tongue weight percentage.

I am not quite clear on the TW calculation
I figured the total Weight of TT and TV loaded with spring bars off which is 11840 lbs minus the TV alone (loaded with people, dogs and fuel) was the TW
How is moving stuff in the back of TT going to change that ratio? the gross weight of TT and TV will still be 11840 lbs. ??

[boubou]

So now I'm wondering...
Given the loaded TT is 5800 lbs and the TV is 6040

if I want real TW I would calculate weights with no spring bars:
3000+3920=6920 substract TV which is 6040 = 880 lbs TW which is 15%

Now if I take 6 links
3340+3440=6780 - 6040 = 740 TW which is 13%

5 links
3500+3180=6680 - 6040 = 640 TW which is 11%

Does this make any sense or are am I brain dead?

[MtnGuy]

Even though it appears so, the tongue weight does not change by using different lengths of chain. The tongue weight is still gonna be 880 lbs. You are just redistributing that 880 lbs around a bit. Some goes to the trailer axles, some to the truck front axle, with some subtracted from the truck rear axle. So, regardless of which chain lengths you finally decide is best, you will still have 15% tongue weight vs. total trailer weight.

[Lonewolfcry]

I always thought the ideal setup would allow the TV to settle an equal amount (front and rear) from unhooked measurements. My TV settled 1" in the rear and 1/2" in front with bars on.
Should I bring the front back up to unhooked measurement?

[MtnGuy]

Originally Posted by Lonewolfcry

I always thought the ideal setup would allow the TV to settle an equal amount (front and rear) from unhooked measurements. My TV settled 1" in the rear and 1/2" in front with bars on.
Should I bring the front back up to unhooked measurement?

The way I read the Reese directions, you are probably on the money.....but the instructions are a little convoluted, at least to me. In part 7 under initial hook-up, it reads "Lower jack. Re-measure front and rear wheel well reference points (vehicle should settle evenly, within about 1/2 inch)". Currently, my truck goes down 1/16" in the front when I hook up the spring bars vs. the truck with no trailer hooked up.....I am adding an extra 40 lbs. to the front axle. If I got that down to 1/2", I would be afraid that I would be overloading the front axle. But.......as I tightened up the spring bars, the back end would come up, so I would not have to go the the full 1/2" on front.

If the vehicle were to settle "evenly", or even worse 1" in front and 1/2" in back (that seems OK with their explanation??) I would think that could put entirely too much weight on the front axle. Of course that is covered later when it reads the front should never settle more than the back. Instead of settling evenly, the 1" on the rear and 1/2" on the front axle, seems a better choice. If your current setup works well, and you are not over either axle weight rating, then you should be good to go.

Trucks and many SUVs are built to carry weight on the back axle. My current "actual" setup has the back of the truck going down 1 1/16", and the front 1/16". That puts me at 89% of the GAWR on the front axle, and 88% of the GVWR on the rear axle. I am adding 520 lbs. to the rear axle, and 40 lbs. to the front axle over the weights of no trailer hooked up. I am comfortable with that, but may slack off just a little when I set up my new head assembly.

[MtnGuy]

Calculating the figures with boubou's rig:

With 6 links: 85.6% of the FAWR, 88.2% of the RAWR.

With 5 links: 89.7% of the FAWR, 81.5% of the RAWR.

IMHO, either 1 of those is a good setup. If it were me, I think I would try the 6 links, and see how it drives compared to the 5 lengths. If it drives just as good, then I think that is what I would use. But that is just me......to follow the Reese directions exactly, you might even have to tilt the head assembly back more to get more weight distributing to get the "vehicle to settle evenly, within about 1/2" as indicated in their instructions.

BTW, notice the rear axle weight with no spring bars attached....that 880 lb. tongue weight has added 1320 lbs. to the rear axle, putting it over the RAWR, while taking 440 lbs. off of the front axle. To me, that shows the importance of using a WDH.

[boubou]

Originally Posted by mtnguy

BTW, notice the rear axle weight with no spring bars attached....that 880 lb. tongue weight has added 1320 lbs. to the rear axle, putting it over the RAWR, while taking 440 lbs. off of the front axle. To me, that shows the importance of using a WDH.

I wouldn't consider going without one!
who does???

[boubou]

Originally Posted by mtnguy

Even though it appears so, the tongue weight does not change by using different lengths of chain. The tongue weight is still gonna be 880 lbs. You are just redistributing that 880 lbs around a bit. Some goes to the trailer axles, some to the truck front axle, with some subtracted from the truck rear axle. So, regardless of which chain lengths you finally decide is best, you will still have 15% tongue weight vs. total trailer weight.

So when people have low tw, theybtend to move stuff up front to prevent trailer sway. If I understand well, this makes no difference in tw but still helps balancing?
They say 11 to 15% tw is ideal. How does one know how much tw one has until you go to the scales? (after getting the trailer). What happens when tw is way too low?
Just curious

[MtnGuy]

Originally Posted by boubou

So when people have low tw, they tend to move stuff up front to prevent trailer sway. If I understand well, this makes no difference in tw but still helps balancing?

Moving stuff around in the camper does affect the tongue weight. In my case, if I travel with with my fresh water tank full (over and a little behind the back axle), I lose 20 lbs. of tongue weight. If I travel with my water heater full (which I usually do, located in the back of my camper), I lose 20 lbs. on the tongue weight. My grey tank is directly in front of the axles, and my black tank is in front of the grey tank. A full grey tank will add 40 lbs. to my tongue weight, and a full black tank will add 80 lbs. to my tongue weight.....I have never had to travel with those full.

That will affect the weight distributing on the TV. If I have to travel with the waste tanks full, the tongue is going to press down on the hitch more, and tend to raise the front end of my TV more. But in the process, the spring bars are going to bend more, so not all of that extra tongue weight is gonna be added to the hitch.....if that makes sense.

Originally Posted by boubou

They say 11 to 15% tw is ideal. How does one know how much tw one has until you go to the scales? (after getting the trailer). What happens when tw is way too low?
Just curious

You don't know the tongue weight until you hit the scales. You can weigh the tongue with a Sherline or the bathroom scale method, but that still does not give you the total trailer weight, so you have no idea what the tongue weight percentage is.

If the tongue weight is too low, the extra weight at the back of the trailer is going to cause instability. That extra weight back there is gonna exacerbate any side to side motion by trying to make the back of the trailer catch up with the front. The forward motion will tend to bring it back in line, but the weight might then take it to the other side....and so the sway continues.

[boubou]

Originally Posted by mtnguy

Even though it appears so, the tongue weight does not change by using different lengths of chain. The tongue weight is still gonna be 880 lbs. You are just redistributing that 880 lbs around a bit. Some goes to the trailer axles, some to the truck front axle, with some subtracted from the truck rear axle. So, regardless of which chain lengths you finally decide is best, you will still have 15% tongue weight vs. total trailer weight.

So Amount of chains will not change tw but gear in tt does....
Wd is just that. Wd
Got it
Thanks for your patience in explaining this