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Old 02-22-2021, 02:55 AM   #1
dm6
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Tongue weight capacity on tow vehicle

I am looking for a new trick and I got a lot of information from another post about the importance of the payload and how it needs to be factored in for the tongue weight. I have been casually looking at the payload stickers on some half ton trucks at the dealership and the Fords and Chevy's I saw seemed to be in the 1500-1600 pound range. I happened to notice the sticker on a 2019 Silverado today and it had a payload of 1646 but there was also a trailering sticker that said that GVWR is 7,000, the GCWR is 15,000 (which would mean you could essentially pull a 8-9,000 pound trailer) but it also said the max tongue weight is 940 pounds. Is that something I need to worry about too? Is that going to be a limitation of the receiver or the truck? So far on the few I have looked at, I have just seen the payload stickers and the ones that give the GAWR and GVWR but have not seen a tongue weight limit before. I mean in a case like this, a 6,000 pound trailer could essentially have 900 pound tongue weight assuming 15% plus another 100 pound for the WDH and you would be over this limit.
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Old 02-22-2021, 04:51 AM   #2
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Originally Posted by dm6 View Post
... but it also said the max tongue weight is 940 pounds. Is that something I need to worry about too? Is that going to be a limitation of the receiver or the truck? ....
Tongue weight is definitely something you need to consider and that limit could be a limitation of the truck or the receiver. That limitation may not be structural but related to how a vehicle passed the handling test. A factory truck that has a lift or extreme(ish) off-road package typically has lower limits.

With half tons it will be near impossible to reach the max towing number without being over on the receiver limit for an RV. In fact it will be very difficult to do so even setting a limit a few thousand less than the given max tow rating for a specific truck.

Payload is another consideration because even a trailer that is half the weight of what it listed as max towing limit can have a tongue weight near 1000lbs and that number comes right off the payload. By the time you add up the family, gear and a bag of chips it may not leave much or any reserve payload.

In short you need to consider the limits on the specific truck you are looking at...not some brochure or salesman's word (rv or vehicle salesman -the vast majority know just enough information on this topic to make them dangerous).

The limits: Receiver. Payload. Tow rating. You need to be within on all of these.
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Old 02-22-2021, 12:34 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by dm6 View Post
I am looking for a new trick and I got a lot of information from another post about the importance of the payload and how it needs to be factored in for the tongue weight. I have been casually looking at the payload stickers on some half ton trucks at the dealership and the Fords and Chevy's I saw seemed to be in the 1500-1600 pound range. I happened to notice the sticker on a 2019 Silverado today and it had a payload of 1646 but there was also a trailering sticker that said that GVWR is 7,000, the GCWR is 15,000 (which would mean you could essentially pull a 8-9,000 pound trailer) but it also said the max tongue weight is 940 pounds. Is that something I need to worry about too? Is that going to be a limitation of the receiver or the truck? So far on the few I have looked at, I have just seen the payload stickers and the ones that give the GAWR and GVWR but have not seen a tongue weight limit before. I mean in a case like this, a 6,000 pound trailer could essentially have 900 pound tongue weight assuming 15% plus another 100 pound for the WDH and you would be over this limit.
This is why max tow weight is such a useless, meaningless and irrelevant number. It's based on 10 percent tongue weight, which virtually no one will ever have when pulling a travel trailer. Most manufacturers use 10 percent of max tow weight as max hitch weight. That's why looking at all the other numbers is so much more important, max hitch weight being one of them. Using 15 percent tongue weight is at the extreme end of the scale, but certainly much more common than 10 percent tongue weight. So that truck you saw with the 940 lb tongue weight limitation would have had a max tow weight listed at 9400 lbs on the Chevy tow weight chart. But if you have 940 lbs of tongue weight and you're at 15 percent, that means the trailer can't weigh more than 6266 lbs. Which is why 9400 lbs of max tow weight, in this particular case, is such a meaningless number.
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Old 02-22-2021, 12:57 PM   #4
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This is why max tow weight is such a useless, meaningless and irrelevant number. It's based on 10 percent tongue weight, which virtually no one will ever have when pulling a travel trailer. Most manufacturers use 10 percent of max tow weight as max hitch weight. That's why looking at all the other numbers is so much more important, max hitch weight being one of them. Using 15 percent tongue weight is at the extreme end of the scale, but certainly much more common than 10 percent tongue weight. So that truck you saw with the 940 lb tongue weight limitation would have had a max tow weight listed at 9400 lbs on the Chevy tow weight chart. But if you have 940 lbs of tongue weight and you're at 15 percent, that means the trailer can't weigh more than 6266 lbs. Which is why 9400 lbs of max tow weight, in this particular case, is such a meaningless number.
Appreciate it. So I guess what I am really asking is how to find out this information. Granted I have only looked at a few so far, but this is the first truck I have seen with that towing placard. Everything I have seen has the payload sticker and the GVWR (I suppose even if there is no GCWR listed, it can be looked up in the book by specific model, axle ration, etc.) but how do I find the max tongue weight? And will you find a max tongue weight over 1,000 pounds on a half ton truck?
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Old 02-22-2021, 03:30 PM   #5
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YES, it is MOST DEFINITELY something you need to "worry about". Also, forget towing 9,000#. You state that the GVWR is 7,000# and the GCWR is 15,000#. 15,000 - 7,000 = 8,000# AND, you NEED as "Safety Factor" (generally recommended to be 10% ~ 15%) so, 15% of 8,000# = 1,200#. Extending that math, 8,000# - 1,200# =6,800# MAX SAFE TOW WEIGHT. Pretty much ALL truck salespeople will tell you that their truck will "tow" your trailer. What they "forget" to tell you is that CONTROLLING your trailer is an entirely different critter (ESPECIALLY under less than ideal conditions like going downhill on a curving, wet road or, driving during high cross winds). Remember Mr Murphy" Law.
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Old 02-22-2021, 11:50 PM   #6
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Appreciate it. So I guess what I am really asking is how to find out this information. Granted I have only looked at a few so far, but this is the first truck I have seen with that towing placard. Everything I have seen has the payload sticker and the GVWR (I suppose even if there is no GCWR listed, it can be looked up in the book by specific model, axle ration, etc.) but how do I find the max tongue weight? And will you find a max tongue weight over 1,000 pounds on a half ton truck?
Since max tongue weight is predicated on max tow weight, you'll need a half ton with the max tow package. My max tongue weight is 1200 lbs, because my theoretical max tow weight is 12,000 lbs. Towing placards are only found on some GM vehicles at this time, although other manufacturers will eventually follow suit. This is the trailer information placard on my 2019 Silverado 1500 with the max trailering package. I can't help you with other manufacturers.

[IMG][/IMG]
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Old 02-23-2021, 12:53 AM   #7
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Isn't that tongue weight listed as the max without WDH ? I mean, isn't that number null and void with a WDH ? That is how it is listed on the receiver hitch on an F150 - Max tongue weight without WDH.
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Old 02-23-2021, 01:33 AM   #8
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Isn't that tongue weight listed as the max without WDH ? I mean, isn't that number null and void with a WDH ? That is how it is listed on the receiver hitch on an F150 - Max tongue weight without WDH.

I wouldn't think so, at 1200 lbs tongue weight. This is what my F-150 shows: Max tongue weight 1,050 With WDH
I have tried to rotate this photo but can not. The original is in the proper horizontal perspective. I often wondered how people managed to post sideways pics on here; I guess I know now!
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Old 02-23-2021, 01:43 AM   #9
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BTW, the first time I towed my trailer, it towed great without the WDH. The only reason I got the Andersen hitch was because the CAT scale showed my tongue weight to be over 500 lbs. More than the hitch rating.
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Old 02-23-2021, 02:11 AM   #10
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I don't mean to open a whole new can of worms like in my last thread that went on and on, but this is something that really wasn't talked about. So is that max tongue weight listed a real thing you need to stay under, or are they just taking 10% of the towing capacity to give you an idea? If it is a real number, then a lot of lighter trailers could be over it even if way under the GCVR if they are at 15% tongue weight, and that just seems crazy that a 6,000 pound trailer could possibly be over the limits in some case.

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Since max tongue weight is predicated on max tow weight, you'll need a half ton with the max tow package. My max tongue weight is 1200 lbs, because my theoretical max tow weight is 12,000 lbs. Towing placards are only found on some GM vehicles at this time, although other manufacturers will eventually follow suit. This is the trailer information placard on my 2019 Silverado 1500 with the max trailering package. I can't help you with other manufacturers.

[IMG][/IMG]
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Old 02-23-2021, 02:13 AM   #11
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Is this on the actual hitch? If so, then that would be a limitation of the hitch and not the truck, right?

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I wouldn't think so, at 1200 lbs tongue weight. This is what my F-150 shows: Max tongue weight 1,050 With WDH
I have tried to rotate this photo but can not. The original is in the proper horizontal perspective. I often wondered how people managed to post sideways pics on here; I guess I know now!
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Old 02-23-2021, 04:30 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Virginian View Post
I wouldn't think so, at 1200 lbs tongue weight. This is what my F-150 shows: Max tongue weight 1,050 With WDH
I have tried to rotate this photo but can not. The original is in the proper horizontal perspective. I often wondered how people managed to post sideways pics on here; I guess I know now!
Thanks ! Been a while since I have seen that sticker.
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Old 02-23-2021, 04:33 AM   #13
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Is this on the actual hitch? If so, then that would be a limitation of the hitch and not the truck, right?
Which is a limitation of the truck also because the hitch is used on the truck !
Just don't get a setup so heavy that the tongue weight is over 1050.
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Old 02-23-2021, 08:11 AM   #14
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This is why max tow weight is such a useless, meaningless and irrelevant number. It's based on 10 percent tongue weight, which virtually no one will ever have when pulling a travel trailer.
But almost all boat owners do...or lower. My triple axle is 7%. I max out my tow rating before my tongue.
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Old 02-23-2021, 10:55 AM   #15
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That 10,500 trailer weight on the hitch actually exceeds the maximum tow capacity of my truck, per the Ford towing manual.
The manual lists my tow capacity at 7,800, as equipped.
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Old 02-24-2021, 12:11 AM   #16
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But almost all boat owners do...or lower. My triple axle is 7%. I max out my tow rating before my tongue.
That's why I specifically referenced travel trailers. While I've never towed a boat, I do understand they are quite different in regards to tongue weight.
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Old 02-24-2021, 12:12 AM   #17
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I don't mean to open a whole new can of worms like in my last thread that went on and on, but this is something that really wasn't talked about. So is that max tongue weight listed a real thing you need to stay under, or are they just taking 10% of the towing capacity to give you an idea? If it is a real number, then a lot of lighter trailers could be over it even if way under the GCVR if they are at 15% tongue weight, and that just seems crazy that a 6,000 pound trailer could possibly be over the limits in some case.
That tongue weight is a real limit. As is every other weight on that placard except for curb weight, which is just there for general info.
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Old 02-24-2021, 12:18 AM   #18
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I have tried to rotate this photo but can not. The original is in the proper horizontal perspective. I often wondered how people managed to post sideways pics on here; I guess I know now!
Here you go.

[IMG][/IMG]
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Old 02-24-2021, 12:23 AM   #19
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Isn't that tongue weight listed as the max without WDH ? I mean, isn't that number null and void with a WDH ? That is how it is listed on the receiver hitch on an F150 - Max tongue weight without WDH.
If this was directed toward me, the answer is no. The owner's manual mandates a WDH if the trailer is over 7000 lbs. But it also limits load bearing max weight at 800 lbs and WDH weight at 1200 lbs.
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Old 02-24-2021, 12:36 AM   #20
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If this was directed toward me, the answer is no. The owner's manual mandates a WDH if the trailer is over 7000 lbs. But it also limits load bearing max weight at 800 lbs and WDH weight at 1200 lbs.
We already revisited that.
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