Towing with a Ford 5.0 and then a 3.5 EcoBoost

[babock]

Originally Posted by Ilovemywife

Glad to hear Ford added port injection to keep intake valves clean. DI engines are great and I have a little SUV with DI but at 50k miles, it idles a little rough and I know the intake valves are sooted up as a result.

Does anybody know if Ford finally fixed the intercooler issue with condensation and fixed the timing chain stretch issues?

I've never had an issue with EB timing chain stretch but I used a higher viscosity oil and attribute it to not occurring but that is a topic to be discussed elsewhere.

EB oil viscosity spec is 5w30. Out if curiosity, what do you use?

I heard condensation issues we're fixed years ago.

[SailorSam20500]

Originally Posted by jonzer12

There is no comparison between the two and I know how to setup a hitch.

I said nothing about your ability to setup a hitch. However, if you don't have either a Hensley or a ProPride, the way the other hitches react to wind is significantly different. The difference results in a different feel to driving and is one reason folks who have them, like them.

YMMV

[jake wolfpack]

Phasers and chain redesigned in early '15, condensation issue also fixed in '15.

[scooby snacks]

I have owned and towed with both. I have a 27’ Cherokee at about 6300-6500 lbs wet. Had a 2014 f-150 5.0 with 3.55 gears but did not have two package (so it did not have heavy trans cooler). Now have a 2018 f-150 with a 3.5 eb with 3.55 gears and max tow package. Big difference with towing power and performance. 2014 transmission temps would start really rising (235+) in hills and to heat at 60 mph. Anything over 62 or so and it felt like it was struggling and shifting a lot. 2018 with EB will pull 65-70 all day long in any heat or hills without much hiccup. Transmission stay about 208-2010 but will occasionally jump to 213 or so for a few minutes under heavy load.

EB is a freaking beast when driving unloaded. Power and pep remind me of a Ram 1500 I used to have with a hemi. Towing I get about 8-9 mpg. Unloaded I get about 19 mph on daily driving and about 23-24 straight highway.

Biggest thing to remember is it is not going to tow like a 3/4 ton. There is going to be some sway and feeling it when there is a cross wind. You just have to use some common sense and adjust your speed and pay attention. But for the gas mileage I get when 90% of my driving is unloaded, the half ton makes more sense for me than a 3/4 ton with less mpg.

[WolfWhistle]

Only 5 pages in 6-1/2 hours on an engine topic. You guys are SLIPPING

[MR.M]

Originally Posted by scooby snacks

I have owned and towed with both. I have a 27’ Cherokee at about 6300-6500 lbs wet. Had a 2014 f-150 5.0 with 3.55 gears but did not have two package (so it did not have heavy trans cooler). Now have a 2018 f-150 with a 3.5 eb with 3.55 gears and max tow package. Big difference with towing power and performance. 2014 transmission temps would start really rising (235+) in hills and to heat at 60 mph. Anything over 62 or so and it felt like it was struggling and shifting a lot. 2018 with EB will pull 65-70 all day long in any heat or hills without much hiccup. Transmission stay about 208-2010 but will occasionally jump to 213 or so for a few minutes under heavy load.

EB is a freaking beast when driving unloaded. Power and pep remind me of a Ram 1500 I used to have with a hemi. Towing I get about 8-9 mpg. Unloaded I get about 19 mph on daily driving and about 23-24 straight highway.

Biggest thing to remember is it is not going to tow like a 3/4 ton. There is going to be some sway and feeling it when there is a cross wind. You just have to use some common sense and adjust your speed and pay attention. But for the gas mileage I get when 90% of my driving is unloaded, the half ton makes more sense for me than a 3/4 ton with less mpg.

you won't have a problem in high winds if you have a hensley or propride hitch . i hear they can handle 100mph cross winds , then they cause any big-rig passing you to sway , JUST KIDDING

[theinmess]

I can not speak to the 5.0 engine exactly but I have a E350 with 5.4 and I also have a F150 tow package, Second Gen EB and 10 speed trany. I love it all the power I need plus great mileage. I pull a Wilderness 30 KQBSS and I never feel under powered. I like the engine braking in Tow Mode and feel just fine pulling long hills ...in fact to usually out top the big rigs. I too worry a little about a very hard stop but I keep me trailer brakes up to snuff and make sure they are set correctly in the truck. I truly love the combo ..but I do think you need the tow pack for the extra brakes and cooling.

[jfinley002]

Originally Posted by acadianbob

Here's my take. I went from a 3.5 EB F150 to a 6.2 gasser F250 with 4.30's. We pulled a 5er with the EB that was 9K wet and are now pulling a 5er weighing 10.5K wet with the F250.

* The F250 is HUGELY more stable and capable as a tow vehicle. You will appreciate the stability pulling in heavy winds and in the mountains.
* If I could put the EB in the F250, I'd do it in a heartbeat. The ultimate power of the EB and 6.2 are about the same (high RPM) but the EB has a bigger fatter torque curve. The EB shifted less often; held its gears better.
* In daily driving (rural area), I got 19 MPG with the EB and am getting 16 MPG with the 6.2
* If you get an F250 6.2, you definitely want to order one with 4.30 gearset. I see no downside to the 4.30's.
* Both vehicles made it up and through the Eisenhower Tunnel just fine. But, coming down was hair raising in the F150 and just fine with the F250. The EB has weak engine compression braking and the F150 was at the limit of its load capacity making for a nervous descent.

I would think that an F150 would be adequate for your current trailer. The EB in a Heavy Duty Payload package F150 would be an awesome combination for you IMO.

I love the F250 towing platform but miss my EB; and I don't want a diesel.

Completely agree with you Bob! Love the ecoboost and would love to see it in a bigger chassis. Doubt it’ll ever happen.

I pull my TT (~7k lbs loaded) with my 13’ Ecoboost and have plenty of going and braking power. Gas mileage goes through the floor.

I get porpoising on some terribly maintained roads and I have a set of Firestone bags with a properly installed WDH. We’ll definitely be going with a 5er and 3/4 ton in the future, but still love the ecoboost. Ford really knocked this motor out of the park. We’ve had the truck for almost 2 years and I still punch it at traffic lights and stop signs if I get the chance. It’s always fun to put your wife’s head in the back of the seat when she’s heads down buried in Facebook on her phone.

[jimmoore13]

Generally speaking:

• A turbo will maintain sea-level power up to about 8500 feet in elevation, so they are desirable in the mountains;
• Many new turbos are torque monsters compared to naturally aspirated engines - especially at lower RPM;
• The HP and torque numbers - especially at a given RPM - speak for themselves when comparing engine types - a current turbo will generally make more power down low in the revs, and a naturally aspirated engine must be revved make power efficiently;
• My greatest concern would be long-term durability, but Ford seems to have created turbo truck engines that can stand up to the abuse.

Not related to trucks, but even sports car makers such as Porsche are finding that a turbo-four will out-perform a naturally aspirated flat six, and it will deliver better fuel economy, too.

[thosey]

I purchased an f-150 with the 5.0 V8 engine in July 2016. It is a quick and powerful ride unhitched from our 2016 Flagstaff 23LB trailer. But hitched to the 4500 Lb trailer (wet), it left much to be desired. The maiden voyage was a 3000 mile trip through New Orleans, San Antonio and back to Pittsburgh, PA within 2 weeks. Some may be satisfied with the performance, but I was not. Any hill and you start pushing on the pedal. You keep pushing but there's very little effect. Finally, it downshifts, the motor gets up into its power band (4000-5000 RPM) and you're back at cruising speed (65 MPH). Any headwind and the same sequence occurs. It gets the job done but not comfortably. I ran it in 5th gear most of the time. I traded the truck in for the 2016 F-150 3.5 ecoboost outfitted exactly the same as the first truck (crew cab, 4X4). The performance is much improved. Now most hills and headwinds are breached by squeezing the throttle a bit. It may still downshift to 5th - and even 4th on steep ones - but it's quite satisfying to give it some gas and get good results. I still get 10-11 MPH but I can now easily, comfortably keep up with traffic. Make no mistake - Pulling out of Denver west-bound on I-70, you'll still be downshifting to keep up with traffic. You know you've got a 2 ton anchor hanging off your tail but you'll finally get into cruising speed with much less thrashing around than with the 5.0. Numbers don't lie. HP doesn't get you up a hill, win a race or tow a load - Pounds of torque provides the "power". The 3.5 has about 30 more pounds of torque that comes on at lower RPMs and leverages that advantage with pleasure.
2016 5.0: 385 HP, 387 lbs of torque
2016 3.5 ecoboost: 365 HP, 420 lbs of torque

Good luck and Happy Trails !

[kamper00]

"It’s always fun to put your wife’s head in the back of the seat when she’s heads down buried in Facebook on her phone.

:roflb lack:

[Mad_River]

I have owned a 2010 Ram with 5.7L, a 2014 Chevy with 5.3L and a 2016 F150 with 3.5L ecoboost. The Ford tows the best using the same 26TBUD. Not really your question, but it might be useful for others reading the thread.

[JKVenero]

I went from an F150 5.0 to an 3.5 echoboost. The reduction in the tow vehicle weight combined with more HP and torque over the 5.0 is like night and day. I'm very happy with my choice to get the ecoboost along with the 20year 200000 mile drivetrain warranty.

[jimmoore13]

Originally Posted by thosey

I<<SNIP>> Any hill and you start pushing on the pedal. You keep pushing but there's very little effect. Finally, it downshifts, the motor gets up into its power band (4000-5000 RPM) and you're back at cruising speed (65 MPH). Any headwind and the same sequence occurs. <<SNIP>>

My RAM with its "mighty" 5.7 "hemi" is much the same. It's older, so it's saddled with with what they call a 4 speed. As far as I can tell, it's just a 3 speed with an electric OD and "tow-haul". No matter.

I developed a technique that I find far more comfortable in the mountains. I manually downshift when climbing. My truck will comfortably run all day in 2nd...yes, 2nd. 60 MPH puts the engine in the sweet spot in the power band, and it's turning about 4000 to 4500 RPM on a redline of about 6500. A bit noisy, but none of the herky-jerky shifting up and down, and it allows nuanced throttle control and a nice steady-state climb up even very steep grades...which always have lots of twists and turns.

I also believe all that shifting is hard on the transmission. Those downshifts are under nearly full load, and all the slip and slide inherent in the transmission is just needless wear and tear.

I also spend lots of time in 2nd on the 12-mile, 5000 feet descents common in Colorado...easy on the brakes and the brain damage. Again, I'm cruising along at 60 mph where possible, so I'm not a slow-poke.

Give it a try. I suspect 4th gear on your 6-speed will be the Goldilocks gear...just right in many cases. By the way, my mileage doesn't change with the lower gears. All those heavy throttle applications to force a downshift seem to consume the same amount of fuel as smooth throttle applications and higher RPM.

By the way, even empty, I'll run with OD off when climbing. A typical drive is a 3000 foot climb over the course of about 25 miles. I use OD on the downhills, but even "tow-haul" isn't powerful enough to maintain speed on the climbs. And there's one point - "windy point" in fact - where I pull it down into 2nd for about 1/2 mile for a steep, twisting climb. I shift at a landmark...before I need to shift, and speed stays the same and there's no jerky downshift to upset passengers and to upset the vehicle composure in mid turn.

[Lzerarc]

I started with a '13 eco and 2.70 gears. Terrible combo. An engine that wants to go but is limited. Traded it since towing was limited and needed to down shift constantly going up smallest of hills pulling 6k lbs. Got a '16 EB with Max tow (3.55 obviously) about 2 years ago now. Massive difference. Also got a new trailer about 900 lbs heavier too. So tugging around 7500 lbs loaded doesn't seem to give it any fits. Set cruise at 65 and let her purrr.
My Dad had both. V8 5.0 for years, gave me crap when I got my first EB for similar comments on here. He got tired of not being able to keep up when we caravan our rigs. Now he has an EB! He couldn't believe the difference.

[herdsman]

First, the new ford 5.0 and the old 5.0 (302 ci) have nothing in common other than similar displacement, so ignore those comparisons.

I have had a first gen 3.5 EB and currently have a 2018 5.0. Both are great engines for towing. The 3.5 has better low rpm torque which is great for towing, the 5.0 will generate the same HP, but at higher rpms. Either will do the same job.

[woodrockin]

Originally Posted by herdsman

First, the new ford 5.0 and the old 5.0 (302 ci) have nothing in common other than similar displacement, so ignore those comparisons.

I have had a first gen 3.5 EB and currently have a 2018 5.0. Both are great engines for towing. The 3.5 has better low rpm torque which is great for towing, the 5.0 will generate the same HP, but at higher rpms. Either will do the same job.

Piggybacking on this.... The turbos make the 3.5 a torque monster down low, where the 5.0 being naturally aspirated has a very linear power band. I have driven a 3.5, and I have towed with a 5.0. Either will be more than adequate for your application. I personally like the 5.0 more, but I'm old school.

As far as the porpoising goes, either truck will do that if not setup properly. I would look at your suspension (i.e. worn components) or your weight setup.

[Aggie Dad]

Originally Posted by stustoner

Has any one towed their TT with a Ford 5.0 and then switched to a Ford 3.5 EB motor? Was there a noticeable difference in power from the 5.0? Any difference in suspensions (I think not)?
On another note, has anyone gone from an F-150 to an F-250 pulling the same TT? I assume there was a noticeable difference in power but was the ride better than with the F-150?
I am pulling a 22RR and would like some more power when the Gold Wing in on board.......and the truck does porpoise somewhat and I would also like to reduce that.
Thanks in advance for any info you can provide.

I’ve went from a F150 V-8 to the V-6 Ecoboost. No comparison, more power in Ecoboost. I was towing 35 ft Windjammer. I finally went to F250 diesel pulling same trailer, lot better performance in sway and power. Had to adjust WDH for F250, but no problem doing that, just go by instructions how to adjust or go to U Tube to find videos how to adjust Equalizer hitch.

[Wicked Ace]

Originally Posted by jake wolfpack

Completely agree with compression braking with the eco.

Did either of you have hill descent? It comes with the STX package if you want that but can easily be added with a switch and a quick program change.
It makes a big difference.

[jake wolfpack]

Originally Posted by Wicked Ace

Did either of you have hill descent? It comes with the STX package if you want that but can easily be added with a switch and a quick program change.
It makes a big difference.

Yes. It's a cool feature but heats up the brakes pretty good on steep hills towing and only works at 20mph or less. I have a boat ramp I use where you descend down into a steep canyon via a series of switchbacks and if you don't shut your surge brakes off the trailer will be smoking at the bottom. The only time I ever heated up my 150's brakes was when I used hill descent control. It uses the trucks abs system, while works very well and I was able to remove my feet from the pedals and just steer, I can come down the same hill using gears and manually braking without heating up the trucks brakes at all.

Then there's my 6.7 on the same hill that I just hold the brake until it shifts to 1st and can take my feet off the pedals at that point and it just walks down the hill, not getting pushed at all by the boat and not using any brakes.