What weight can I pull?

[racerx]

Wanting to buy a larger fifth wheel and want to be safe about it. Below is the information about the vehicle but all this information can be a bit confusing.

2008 Ford F350 Dually Diesel 4x4 with a 3.73 axle ratio

Truck weight 7,227
GCWR 23,500
GVCR 13,000
Max GCWR 5th wheel 18,800
payload 5,300
max towing 16,000


The fifth I am considering has a dry weight of 13,600 ( I am aware this is likely slightly higher than manufacturer states) and the trailer GVWR of 16,000. Trailer length 42 ft.

What say you, is the max fifth wheel I can legally tow with an estimated bed / cab weight of passengers and cargo of 500 lbs.?

[ependydad]

"legally" doesn't come into play. There aren't laws that dictate that you must be within ratings.

However, with a payload of 5,300 pounds- there's not going to be a whole lot that you can't pull.

I have a couple of tools at www.towingplanner.com that you can use for estimating towing capacity and real/wet pin weights.

[ksignoles]

Also check your state laws regarding the need for CDL or special endorsement. TN has one if greater than certain combined weight and my combo is below about 900 lbs, otherwise I would have needed CDL.


2013 Sierra 346 RET
2010 Ford 350 6.4 l CC SRW
Sent from my iPhone using Forest River Forums

[Hutch333id]

I have a 2008 F350 DRW diesel pulling a Cedar Creek 38Fl with a dry king pin weight of 2595lbs. The truck pulls that like it is on rails and I hardly notice it being there.

[racerx]

Thanks for the replies. Feeling a little better about considering going this big.

@ ependydad, the low end on that planner lets me tow 19000 plus.

@ksignoles CDL not required in MO, however, already have a CDL.

@Hutch333id, Great to hear. The weight I would have is similar to yours. Nice to know that a same type vehicle, with similar weights rides and pulls well.

Still a little timid about going 42 ft after only pulling 31.5. I am sure I will get over that.

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by racerx

Still a little timid about going 42 ft after only pulling 31.5. I am sure I will get over that.

With no prior towing experience, I went from a 20' pop-up for 1 summer to a 42' fifth wheel! I'm in my 4th year now and have been very happy.

You can do it!

[CWSWine]

Towing in excess of the vehicle manufacturer’s weight limits could not only prove dangerous, but could even be considered negligent. In the event of an accident with an overweight personal vehicle, you could be held responsible for higher awards in a lawsuit for damages to other people, vehicles or property.
Personal Vehicle Towing Liability for RV’ers — PersonalInjuryClaimsBlawg

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by CWSWine

Towing in excess of the vehicle manufacturer’s weight limits could not only prove dangerous, but could even be considered negligent. In the event of an accident with an overweight personal vehicle, you could be held responsible for higher awards in a lawsuit for damages to other people, vehicles or property.
Personal Vehicle Towing Liability for RV’ers — PersonalInjuryClaimsBlawg

Heh, I feel like we've had this conversation before. IMO- that page is from a lawyer who is selling his services; of course he's going to take that stance. Marketing at its finest.

[aceinspp]

Doesn't matter legal or not there are a bunch of hungry lawyers out there just waiting to pounce. And a bunch of sue happy folks to boot. Later RJD

[CWSWine]

TRAILER TOWING ILLEGALLY
Pickup & SUV drivers towing trailers above legal capacity face liability issues

TRAILER TOWING ILLEGALLY

[jeeplj8]

Originally Posted by racerx

Wanting to buy a larger fifth wheel and want to be safe about it. Below is the information about the vehicle but all this information can be a bit confusing.

2008 Ford F350 Dually Diesel 4x4 with a 3.73 axle ratio

Truck weight 7,227
GCWR 23,500
GVCR 13,000
Max GCWR 5th wheel 18,800
payload 5,300
max towing 16,000


The fifth I am considering has a dry weight of 13,600 ( I am aware this is likely slightly higher than manufacturer states) and the trailer GVWR of 16,000. Trailer length 42 ft.

What say you, is the max fifth wheel I can legally tow with an estimated bed / cab weight of passengers and cargo of 500 lbs.?

remember that in MO the trucks plate must be a weight class for total of truck and trailer:

Registration fees for trucks, including all pickup trucks and all utility-type vehicles that are registered as trucks, are determined by your truck’s weight, and whether you will be using the truck locally (within 50 miles from home) or over a wider area. Your truck’s weight includes the weight of any other trailers or property that you might haul during the registration period.


Currently the largest non-commercial plate you can get is 24K - and you could theoretically go over that with your setup. I run an 18K plate - but with my trailer I would be way overloaded before I hit my 18K.

[Iwannacamp]

Originally Posted by cwswine

trailer towing illegally
pickup & suv drivers towing trailers above legal capacity face liability issues

trailer towing illegally

interesting

[CWSWine]

Originally Posted by jeeplj8

remember that in MO the trucks plate must be a weight class for total of truck and trailer:

Registration fees for trucks, including all pickup trucks and all utility-type vehicles that are registered as trucks, are determined by your truck’s weight, and whether you will be using the truck locally (within 50 miles from home) or over a wider area. Your truck’s weight includes the weight of any other trailers or property that you might haul during the registration period.


Currently the largest non-commercial plate you can get is 24K - and you could theoretically go over that with your setup. I run an 18K plate - but with my trailer I would be way overloaded before I hit my 18K.

Kansas tried to do that to me and I protested. Come to find out that is true for cargo trailers but RV are exempt from the requirement. I found several people already that DMV register the truck and trailer weight and now have just the loaded rating on the truck. They Kansas consider a exempt RV as one with a permanent mounted toilet. You might want to check and see if it is the same in your state.

[jeeplj8]

Originally Posted by CWSWine

Kansas tried to do that to me and I protested. Come to find out that is true for cargo trailers but RV are exempt from the requirement. I found several people already that DMV register the truck and trailer weight and now have just the loaded rating on the truck. They Kansas consider a exempt RV as one with a permanent mounted toilet. You might want to check and see if it is the same in your state.

It is not. KS has a different system in place that does not require any plate for small trailers, and specific weight categories for larger trailers. MO treats every trailer exactly the same regardless of size/weight/type.

[Happy Vibe]

I can't say I have ever seen a boat trailer with a WDH. I'm not even sure how you would attach the brackets to the tongue as the boat trailers tend to have the V set much further back than RV's.

[B and B]

Originally Posted by racerx

Wanting to buy a larger fifth wheel and want to be safe about it. Below is the information about the vehicle but all this information can be a bit confusing.

2008 Ford F350 Dually Diesel 4x4 with a 3.73 axle ratio

Truck weight 7,227
GCWR 23,500
GVCR 13,000
Max GCWR 5th wheel 18,800
payload 5,300
max towing 16,000


The fifth I am considering has a dry weight of 13,600 ( I am aware this is likely slightly higher than manufacturer states) and the trailer GVWR of 16,000. Trailer length 42 ft.

What say you, is the max fifth wheel I can legally tow with an estimated bed / cab weight of passengers and cargo of 500 lbs.?

All lawyer talk threats of jail time aside.

What you have suggested for a trailer is within your trucks capacity! In Ontario 23,500 is the Max combined rating. With your Truck your loaded 5th wheel weight is around 16,000 allowing for your truck loaded estimate.



Happy Camping, take it slow and keep within the tire ratings.

[gfarmcafe]

[QUOTE=ksignoles;922486]Also check your state laws regarding the need for CDL or special endorsement. TN has one if greater than certain combined weight and my combo is below about 900 lbs, otherwise I would have needed CDL.

I'm from Tennessee and you don't need a CDL (Commercial Driver's License) endorsement on a privately ownded RV. Only those professionally paid drivers. That's why we don't need to go thru weight stations or subjected to routine inspections and health requirements.

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by CWSWine

TRAILER TOWING ILLEGALLY
Pickup & SUV drivers towing trailers above legal capacity face liability issues

TRAILER TOWING ILLEGALLY

That article was about hitches and the need for a WDH over 5,000 pounds.

Plus, these references are for civil court with regards to negligence. As I said, there are no laws (aka, in a criminal court) that enforce weight limits. IMO, saying something is legal vs. illegal comes down to criminal courts. Lots of things can get you sued, but that doesn't necessarily make them illegal.

I'd be all ears if you can find me actual case proof that someone was convicted criminally of being over a manufacturer's weight limit.

And, again- I'm all for being within ratings. In fact, I just paid for an individual wheel weighing and have confirmed that I'm under all ratings except one (and because of that, I'll likely dump most of my fresh water for a while until we can get some more things managed). But, I dislike the statement that it's illegal. There's been no proof to back that up, whatsoever.

[TURBS]

1 ton van and trailer over loaded with shingles.
Just took pic.
Receiver hitch broke.
he's / we're lucky it happened right when he back in.



TURBS
08 duramax tuned n modded
2011 32bhok Sabre
2015 camping "11 nights"

[jeeplj8]

Originally Posted by ependydad

That article was about hitches and the need for a WDH over 5,000 pounds.

Plus, these references are for civil court with regards to negligence. As I said, there are no laws (aka, in a criminal court) that enforce weight limits. IMO, saying something is legal vs. illegal comes down to criminal courts. Lots of things can get you sued, but that doesn't necessarily make them illegal.

I'd be all ears if you can find me actual case proof that someone was convicted criminally of being over a manufacturer's weight limit.

And, again- I'm all for being within ratings. In fact, I just paid for an individual wheel weighing and have confirmed that I'm under all ratings except one (and because of that, I'll likely dump most of my fresh water for a while until we can get some more things managed). But, I dislike the statement that it's illegal. There's been no proof to back that up, whatsoever.

It sounds like semantics - but citations for exceeding your plated weight, exceeding the state maximum for private vehicles, or exceeding the weight limit for specific roadways/bridges (all of which depend on specific jurisdiction) ARE criminal citations. They are almost all misdemeanor violations.

And while exceeding a manufacturer suggested restriction is not necessarily an independent crime, it has been used to show criminal negligence in manslaughter prosecutions. Full disclosure - this is generally in cases where the average person would question they safety of the load.

First day of law school they teach you: never use the word the never...and always avoid saying always.