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Old 11-17-2018, 12:42 AM   #1
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Wide Spread Axles Advantage or Not

Looking to upsize our trailer and trying to factor in running gear differences between a few that would meet our needs. There are two TT that are on my short list. A Coachmen Freedom Express running on leaf springs but wide spread axles, and a Lance running on closely spaced torsion axles. I'm currently pulling a single axle on torsion axles and it has been trouble free and trailer is well behaved on the road.
New trailer will be close to twice the weight and up to 9 ft longer(28-29ft). Can people share experiences with the wide spaced axles. I've read they tend to greatly improve straight line stability and load handling but are prone to tire scrubbing in tight turn situations. Not sure that I need to worry about that but have no first hand experience.
Also, advantages/disadvantages of torsion axles vs leaf springs.
Tow vehicle is a f150 145" wb
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Old 11-17-2018, 06:52 AM   #2
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The torsion axles have no “equalizer” and are more sensitive to a properly leveled trailer. If the front of the trailer is continuously high the rear axle torsion arms will rotate more and take more of the load with more wear on those tires.
A few years back, my neighbor did just that with a tandem axle boat trailer and seriously overloaded the rear tires with resultant blow outs. Once leveled, tires did fine.
Personally, I think Lance has a better reputation, but, I have not owned one.

The spread axle is an interesting concept, but, one must ask why. The frame consists of rails of some shape, usually an “I”. Engineering practices allow the use of a smaller I if the load is less concentrated or more spread out.

Assuming you have access to both, go inside and see which one seems more rigid. I also suspect for a similar size and features the Lance will weigh more. Sometimes a sign of a stronger unit
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Old 11-17-2018, 08:07 AM   #3
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The wider spread axles are supposed to help reduce sway (so I'm told)...

They may also spread the weight load a little more as well.

I would think that hitting curbs and tire scrubbing during tight turns and backing up could put more stress on the tires.
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Old 11-18-2018, 01:51 AM   #4
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Was thinking about buying a trailer with torsion axles and they were spread as well. At first I thought torsion axles might be better than a standard leaf with equilizers but if you don't get that trailer perfectly level, one set of tires WILL have more load on them than the other. Couple that with the fact that you read about a lot of torsion axle failures made me decide having the torsion axles was a minus vs a plus.

It wasn't our main consideration in buying a trailer but if everything else was equal and we were deciding on one trailer vs the other, I would pick the trailer without torsion axles.
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Old 11-18-2018, 12:43 PM   #5
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I guess I haven't seen posts about torsion reliability issues. Dexter at least claims them to be very reliabe especially compared to the complexity of leaf suspensions. I understand the potential overload issues and that could be quite significant. Even a level trailer is never in perfect balance weight wise.
Question to me though is how well do leaf suspension actually distribute weight without after market upgrades?
Lance solely uses torsion as well as I believe airstream. I've heard they are significantly more expensive as well so there must be some justification to use them
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Old 11-18-2018, 12:50 PM   #6
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I guess I haven't seen posts about torsion reliability issues. Dexter at least claims them to be very reliabe especially compared to the complexity of leaf suspensions. I understand the potential overload issues and that could be quite significant. Even a level trailer is never in perfect balance weight wise.
Question to me though is how well do leaf suspension actually distribute weight without after market upgrades?
Lance solely uses torsion as well as I believe airstream. I've heard they are significantly more expensive as well so there must be some justification to use them
Leaf spring systems are extremely simple. Way less complex than a torsion system. With the equilizer, you are guaranteed that the weight on each axle is identical.

https://www.google.com/search?q=tors...hrome&ie=UTF-8

I thought like you that they would be better at first. Then I did a little research. Like I said, they wouldn't be the only thing that would keep me from buying a particular trailer. It's just a check in the "Con" box.

Lance makes a very good trailer. My friend is buying one. We didn't see a floor plan that we liked which is more important than what axles the trailer has. We did not like the step up into the dinette on models we looked at. Airstream is just WAY overpriced for what you get..and no slides!!! My parents used to have an airstream...they hated it because it was just too claustrophobic and storage sucked because of the curved roof.
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Old 11-18-2018, 01:25 PM   #7
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I agree that leaf systems appear simple but there's actually a myriad of parts there.
On the Grand Design site there have been threads on how troublesome the leaf suspensions can be. It basically boils down to poor design and cheap build. Bushing failures, broken shackles, etc..
Your comment about the equalizer. Are you referring to that yellow aftermarket type or just the typical center connection device on most setups?
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Old 11-18-2018, 01:35 PM   #8
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Disadvantages of wide spread axles are the above mentioned scrubbing in turns and ALSO the inability to put a "chock" between the tires for stability when camped.
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Old 11-18-2018, 01:47 PM   #9
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Following on from above, I have had a lot of of tandem axle leaf spring trailers. Some I built. The “equalizer” I talk about can be either the plain steel lever or the fancier rubber containing version.
Some were in salt water, winter snow and salt. I have had single axle torsions.
Never had a failure with either, but, the plastic bushed leafs got sloppy as the plastic wore. I put in bronze bushings and greasable bolts. The greasable version lasted the longest, provided I did my part with the grease gun.
Knowing the price point of the Lance and Airstream, I cannot comment on their logic.
Another reason to have tires with sufficient head room of load capacity.
Suspensions are maintenance items that should have a regular schedule.
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Old 11-18-2018, 02:27 PM   #10
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Your comment about the equalizer. Are you referring to that yellow aftermarket type or just the typical center connection device on most setups?
The simple equilizer part between the sets of leaf springs.
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Old 11-18-2018, 02:45 PM   #11
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I compared torsion axles to leaf and I noticed the first trailer of about same length and weight had torsion's and around 1800 lbs of cargo weight. The trailer I bought had leaf's and around 3100 lbs of cargo weight. Every time I look at trailers that is what I see most is cargo weight difference with the same size trailer.
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Old 11-18-2018, 02:48 PM   #12
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I haven't read of any rash of torsion axle failures.

I've always believed that simple is usually more reliable. Getting rid of leaf springs in favor of internal torsion elements, shackles, bolts, bushings, equalizer linkage, just seems to me that a lot of failure points are eliminated.

As for equalizing the load, just pay closer attention to hitch height and WDH adjustments.

Also, with spring/equalizer setups the front of the front spring and rear of the rear spring are pivot points. When a wheel encounters a bump a phenomena called "bump steer" occurs due to simple geometry. This causes one wheel to steer one direction followed by the next wheel steering the opposite. One of two things then occurs. Tire wear or the beginning of sway, sometimes both.

On a torsion axle the tire's alignment to the road doesn't vary in relation to it's direction of travel.

My old trailer was spring/equalizer and my new one torsion. The new one is an absolute delight to tow down the highway.
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Old 11-18-2018, 02:59 PM   #13
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Countered?

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Disadvantages of wide spread axles are the above mentioned scrubbing in turns and ALSO the inability to put a "chock" between the tires for stability when camped.
Wouldn't that be countered by the reduced likelihood of scraping the back end when transitioning between roadway and steep driveway?

The further rear the axle, the less chance of dragging the bumper.

Larry
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Old 11-18-2018, 03:12 PM   #14
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Wouldn't that be countered by the reduced likelihood of scraping the back end when transitioning between roadway and steep driveway?

The further rear the axle, the less chance of dragging the bumper.

Larry
True but then there is the risk that a huge percentage of the load would be carried on one axle. This would require a stronger pair of frame rails to minimize deflection, increasing overall weight of the frame. On the highway on relatively flat surfaces the spread axles would distribute the weight along the frame rails minimizing this flex over the fulcrum. I can see some benefit in a long trailer.
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Old 11-18-2018, 03:24 PM   #15
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Disadvantages of wide spread axles are the above mentioned scrubbing in turns and ALSO the inability to put a "chock" between the tires for stability when camped.
I have wide spread axles and they do make a Large X-Chocks that work. That is what i use.
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Old 11-18-2018, 03:48 PM   #16
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Thanks TitanMike
Love the first hand experience perspective.
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Old 11-18-2018, 03:55 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by onetonford View Post
I compared torsion axles to leaf and I noticed the first trailer of about same length and weight had torsion's and around 1800 lbs of cargo weight. The trailer I bought had leaf's and around 3100 lbs of cargo weight. Every time I look at trailers that is what I see most is cargo weight difference with the same size trailer.
I believe I've seen torsion axles available up to 7000# per axle. Maybe what you're seeing is the use of torsion on rigs where the target gvwl is lower to begin with. The elimination of all the hardware associated with leaf must reduce weight. I'm betting one reason lance used these is weight savings
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Old 11-18-2018, 04:03 PM   #18
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Being a racer and hauling all over the country I'd recommend the torsion axle with spred. Less parts to break and maintain and able to haul without sway.
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Old 11-18-2018, 04:26 PM   #19
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Buy the Lance. Much better built trailer!
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Old 11-18-2018, 05:04 PM   #20
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Disadvantages of wide spread axles are the above mentioned scrubbing in turns and ALSO the inability to put a "chock" between the tires for stability when camped.

Ultra-Fab Products 21-001095 Super Grip Chock (X-Large,2 Pack)

Bought these on Amazon last year and they work great on my Freedom Express wide spread axles!
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