Cracks in roof

[lochsa]

Yes, I agree about FR not contractually owing me anything. They've gotten a pretty bad wrap over years for not standing behind their products, but I believe they're working harder now then ever to please customers.

It appears to me that the crack is all the way through but I can't be certain (no noticeable water leaks) nor was I aware of a sealer coat. There is enough of crack that I can put my finger nail into it. I'm not sure about this theory any way because of the bump/delamination that is preceding the cracks. I doubt the sealer is lifting off the fiberglass.

I do think your explanation of too much glue (not enough flex) is very plausible. Do you know how far the 'frames' are?

[Phil57]

If you have the same roof and I think you do it is a single piece of fiberglass. What I have read about this roof it seems a lot of issues are from the install. That large of a sheet over flexing could cause problems after a few years.
What I have been told by FR is mine is caused by inconstant thickness in the sheets. This has been a issue with the supplier the FR uses and has shown up in other manufactures that use they same supplier. The thin spots crack after a short time.
I was also told that this was a issue with Georgetown MH as well. When I brought up your issue Randy nodded and said same issue same supplier.
The only thing different is mine is still in warranty. I have a leftover 2011 that I bought in April of 2012 as a new unit. Mine was built in oct of 2010 and as I understand it that was when a lot if the roof issues came up.

[awwall]

Randy nodded and said same issue same supplier.

Phil, who is Randy? Is he a contact at FR?

[Phil57]

Originally Posted by awwall

Phil, who is Randy? Is he a contact at FR?

Sorry Randy Houser. He is manager for parts and warranty at FR Diesel Motorhome division. He also may ware other hats but he has been my go to guy when I need anything.

[VinceU]

Originally Posted by lochsa

Yes, I agree about FR not contractually owing me anything. They've gotten a pretty bad wrap over years for not standing behind their products, but I believe they're working harder now then ever to please customers.

It appears to me that the crack is all the way through but I can't be certain (no noticeable water leaks) nor was I aware of a sealer coat. There is enough of crack that I can put my finger nail into it. I'm not sure about this theory any way because of the bump/delamination that is preceding the cracks. I doubt the sealer is lifting off the fiberglass.

I do think your explanation of too much glue (not enough flex) is very plausible. Do you know how far the 'frames' are?

Mine are marked 16-18" apart on roof. Just thinking fibreglas is made with woven cloth and epoxy coating. Roof cloth is thin but it also works normally without cracking unless its over stressed. Phil had a good idea bout faulty fabrication. This stuff comes in a roll and installed in one sheet on the roof. It should not crack in a systematic way that your is. If it continues it would become a mainsail heading down the highway, what a mess. Pics I've seen of install is glue tracks in a sinuous path of narrow lines. That would allow the plywood below to work in the longitudinal direction cause is like a spring. Who knows what happened with the failing roofs. FR advertises 10 year roof, hope they stick by you. Meanwhile photos to the roof sheet maker keeps them advised and involved.

[ohiobill]

Looks like mine is starting to crack, similar to Lochas' roof. I can't tell if the cracks go all the way through or not, but you can put a fingernail into the crack. So far, no evidence of leakage. I only have two cracks, but they are 4 ft apart, one running from the ceiling vent to the right side, and another from the right side to the shower skylight. Don't recall seeing them before, and I was on the roof before leaving Florida a month ago.

[Iggy]

VinceU
"FR advertises 10 year roof"
That usually is the material on trailer roofs but does it include MH too?

If this is happening alot on MH only a few years old maybe we need to gather the information who is having these issues.

Anyone?

[Phil57]

I can say that a casual inspection will miss the cracks. I cleaned mine and a week later my great dealer found the problem when he winterized it. When I saw it he had already caulked it and sent pictures of the cracks to FR. He had everything set up for replacement all I had to do was schedule it.

[lochsa]

Originally Posted by ohiobill

Looks like mine is starting to crack, similar to Lochas' roof. I can't tell if the cracks go all the way through or not, but you can put a fingernail into the crack. So far, no evidence of leakage. I only have two cracks, but they are 4 ft apart, one running from the ceiling vent to the right side, and another from the right side to the shower skylight. Don't recall seeing them before, and I was on the roof before leaving Florida a month ago.

ohiobill, can you post some picture?

[VinceU]

Originally Posted by lochsa

Yes, I agree about FR not contractually owing me anything. They've gotten a pretty bad wrap over years for not standing behind their products, but I believe they're working harder now then ever to please customers.

It appears to me that the crack is all the way through but I can't be certain (no noticeable water leaks) nor was I aware of a sealer coat. There is enough of crack that I can put my finger nail into it. I'm not sure about this theory any way because of the bump/delamination that is preceding the cracks. I doubt the sealer is lifting off the fiberglass.

I do think your explanation of too much glue (not enough flex) is very plausible. Do you know how far the 'frames' are?

Here's one product advertised and written up like crazy, this would help stop leaks if the glass should crack, I hope! Thinking of applying around all the openings where cracks start.

Iggy I found the 10 year quote on a competitors brochure, its by the membrane mfg as we expected, although I would think application would come to bear also. I'll keep locking, it's where FR expresses warranties, not in sales brochure. I'll keep looking, I remember seeing 1 year coach, 3 year Ford and 10 year roof.




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• Two coats are required
• One gallon of Dicor Fiberglass RV Coating will cover 350 square feet per coat

[VinceU]

While searching found this "wall lining" .090" thick between 1/16 (.062") 1/8" (.125"). Open the brochure attached and zoom up on the white photos. I wonder if this is the same material. Its glass and in this case in used in Lavatory walls. Goofing around in this site it shows expansion gaps in installation for thermal changes? I couldn't remember where I say this weird pebble surface before-----now I think I remember!





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Important! Please Download Wall Liner Installation Guide Here

[Lynkage]

Originally Posted by VinceU

While searching found this "wall lining" .090" thick between 1/16 (.062") 1/8" (.125"). Open the brochure attached and zoom up on the white photos. I wonder if this is the same material. Its glass and in this case in used in Lavatory walls. Goofing around in this site it shows expansion gaps in installation for thermal changes? I couldn't remember where I say this weird pebble surface before-----now I think I remember!

The FRP (Fiberglass Reinforced Panel) is used in lots of commercial applications and lots of bathrooms.

[VinceU]

Originally Posted by Lynkage

The FRP (Fiberglass Reinforced Panel) is used in lots of commercial applications and lots of bathrooms.

Yes, we're trying to find why it cracks. Could be it's being cut too close to roof penetrations like vent openings, not allowing for expansion. Just found this passage which recommends 100% adhesion, I know that wasn't always accomplished. I certainly recognized the stuff but could not figure where it came from. Its warranted for 10 years in some installations but what went wrong, the ops motorhome is 3 years old!

"STANDARD WALL PANEL INSTALLATION INSTRUCTIONS
Generally, frp panels can be installed using adhesive alone, fasteners alone, or a combination of adhesiveand fasteners. The method used should be determined by the room and wall conditions (see the wall
conditions noted above). Check your local building codes for any restrictions or guidelines regarding approved installation methods.
Ø ADHESIVE
If adhesive is used, be sure that it is an frp-formulated product. Frp adhesives are widely available. Follow
the adhesive manufacturer's recommendations for trowel style (e.g., appropriate height of adhesive bead
left by trowel). It is important to apply adhesive carefully and follow all directions to prevent problems that
may result from using too little or too much adhesive. 100% adhesive coverage is recommended using a
"crosshatch" pattern. Adhesive should extend to all edges of the panel and should be applied directly to
the back of each individual frp panel."

Not for certain this is it, but sure looks like it.

[ohiobill]

Originally Posted by lochsa

ohiobill, can you post some picture?

Lochsa, will do as soon as weather permits.

Mine look nearly identical to yours, seeming to run across the roof on a seam, probably where the plywood sheets meet.

I plan to call FR on Monday. Who did you talk to there? I don't think I'd be interested in a metal strip and screw fix...

[lochsa]

As Iggy suggested, I spoke with:

Steven Stombaugh
Service and Warranty
574-206-7611 Ph.
574-206-2484 Fax
sstombaugh@forestriverinc.com

He's a very nice guy. Let us know the outcome.

[Lynkage]

Originally Posted by VinceU

Yes, we're trying to find why it cracks. Could be it's being cut too close to roof penetrations like vent openings, not allowing for expansion. Just found this passage which recommends 100% adhesion, I know that wasn't always accomplished. I certainly recognized the stuff but could not figure where it came from. Its warranted for 10 years in some installations but what went wrong, the ops motorhome is 3 years old!

"STANDARD WALL PANEL INSTALLATION INSTRUCTIONS
Generally, frp panels can be installed using adhesive alone, fasteners alone, or a combination of adhesiveand fasteners. The method used should be determined by the room and wall conditions (see the wall
conditions noted above). Check your local building codes for any restrictions or guidelines regarding approved installation methods.
Ø ADHESIVE
If adhesive is used, be sure that it is an frp-formulated product. Frp adhesives are widely available. Follow
the adhesive manufacturer's recommendations for trowel style (e.g., appropriate height of adhesive bead
left by trowel). It is important to apply adhesive carefully and follow all directions to prevent problems that
may result from using too little or too much adhesive. 100% adhesive coverage is recommended using a
"crosshatch" pattern. Adhesive should extend to all edges of the panel and should be applied directly to
the back of each individual frp panel."

Not for certain this is it, but sure looks like it.

I have never known FRP to be an exterior product.

[VinceU]

Originally Posted by Lynkage

I have never known FRP to be an exterior product.

Bad news is this stuff is more plastic than fiber! "Fiber reinforced plastic" like I said, ain't no vette or boat.
"FIBERGLASS REINFORCED PLASTIC (FRP) PANELS" this is .090" thick or less bonded to a substrate. Just important is secured properly or allowed to "float". I think sometimes this was overlooked.

[lochsa]

Originally Posted by VinceU

Mine are marked 16-18" apart on roof. Just thinking fibreglas is made with woven cloth and epoxy coating. Roof cloth is thin but it also works normally without cracking unless its over stressed. Phil had a good idea bout faulty fabrication. This stuff comes in a roll and installed in one sheet on the roof. It should not crack in a systematic way that your is. If it continues it would become a mainsail heading down the highway, what a mess. Pics I've seen of install is glue tracks in a sinuous path of narrow lines. That would allow the plywood below to work in the longitudinal direction cause is like a spring. Who knows what happened with the failing roofs. FR advertises 10 year roof, hope they stick by you. Meanwhile photos to the roof sheet maker keeps them advised and involved.

Concerning the pictures of the install process you've seen, can you recall exactly what the glue line patterns looked like (i.e. spacing, direction, etc)?

Also, suppose the 4' spaced cracks on my roof line up directly with the glue tracks. Other than the dicor perimeter and cutouts (a/c, sky light, etc..), there really doesn't seem to be anything else holding the roof on, does it?

Also, I have another theory: Is it possible that anincorrect type of epoxy was used to secure the roof thus reacting with the fiberglass over time? Note the delamination.

[ohiobill]

Originally Posted by lochsa

ohiobill, can you post some picture?

Lochsa, here are some pictures of my roof. So far it doesn't seem to have the ridges yours does and the cracks do not go all the way accross. Yet!

The first picture is near the shower skyight, the second is the right side of the vent, with a macro shot, then the left side of the vent.

[Iggy]

Your motorhome is flexing but these cracks started by a screw hole.
Those look like fracture cracks being so jaggered. I bet you will find out that each were started by a screw being drilled into something under the weather proofing stuff around the vent.

If it was straight I would say it was a manufacturing defect in the making of the product.


My thought only.