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Old 07-05-2020, 09:12 PM   #1
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More disappointments with my 2019 GT 34H5

Have family here for the 4th and discovered my ATS is not working. Have full power and everything works when the generator is running, but plugging into shore power nothing happens. Took the cover off the transfer switch and could smell something burnt. Inside the box was a broken piece of plastic that came off one of the contactors. When I looked at the Progressive Dynamics O&M manual for the ATS, on page 3 it states, " do not mount the unit vertically as shown in figure 3 & 4. Doing so will shorten the life of the unit." Guess which way mine is mounted! This $100k+ MH has been nothing but a nightmare! We have only owned it for 8 months and it has been in for repairs for more nights than we have stayed in it. I will not take it back to the dealer in Ohio. It was a mistake the buy from RCD! The last warranty work we had done was at a Georgetown dealer Elkhart Ind. They were to investigate why I could not get the chassis heater and AC to work properly. They discovered someone had removed the air distribution box and controls from under the dash and hood! The selling dealership must have cannibalized my unit and never put it back. I just don't know what to do anymore!
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Old 07-06-2020, 07:40 AM   #2
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Forest River may authorize a mobile repair tech to come by your place and repair it. If not, if you have an extended warranty, they will authorize a mobile repair tech. As for your ATS, does the switch make a click noise after plugging in to shore power. If not I would suspect the switch. Sorry for all of your hassles. It can be frustrating and put a big damper on RVing.
If you need to replace it yourself then it's about an hour job.
My transfer switch lasted about 2 years but the replacement unit has lasted 6 years now.
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Old 07-06-2020, 08:17 AM   #3
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There should be no clicking from the ATS when connecting to shore power. Shore power is the default (de-energized) ATS condition. When using the generator there will be a clicking sound (contactors energizing).
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Old 07-06-2020, 09:28 AM   #4
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That could be the issue! Mine has always "clicked" when shore power is applied. Currently, the generator contactor is pulled in with no power. We purchased the Motorhome new in Nov. 2019. It sure should be under warranty! But once again I have to take it to a dealer to get fixed. 3400 miles and most of them are back and forth to a dealer for repairs.
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Old 07-06-2020, 10:17 AM   #5
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This is a typical ATS wiring diagram. I should have "typically the click should occur when generator is the power source" just in case yours is different. Typically, shore power is default but generator has priority.
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Old 07-06-2020, 10:40 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pojoGTH5 View Post
Have family here for the 4th and discovered my ATS is not working. Have full power and everything works when the generator is running, but plugging into shore power nothing happens. Took the cover off the transfer switch and could smell something burnt. Inside the box was a broken piece of plastic that came off one of the contactors. When I looked at the Progressive Dynamics O&M manual for the ATS, on page 3 it states, " do not mount the unit vertically as shown in figure 3 & 4.
What model or part number ATS do you have? Mine is mounted vertically as well but I don't have access to it right now. I should have it back later this week, hopefully.

I'm guessing it's a PD52 but its manual does not say anything about not mounting it vertically. It does show a "Horizontal Wall Mount" with an UP arrow, which is a confusing choice of words. I'm guessing they mean if you mount it on a wall, the contactor must be oriented in a specific direction and not sideways or upside down.

https://www.progressivedyn.com/wp-co...al-english.pdf

EDIT: I found the PDF you referenced at https://www.progressivedyn.com/pdfs/...S%20manual.pdf

So your contactor is sideways inside the wall-mounted case?

Mine is at the factory waiting for delivery back to me. Do you have a picture you can pass along of how yours is mounted (with the cover off)?

Interestingly, that second set of pictures is not present in the current Owner and Installation Manual I linked to first.

The one with the circle-slash pictures was created on January 16, 2015 while the current manual without the circle-slash pictures was created on Sept. 18, 2019 and modified on Oct. 9, 2019. There may no longer be a restriction on the mounting orientation.

Ray
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Old 07-06-2020, 11:11 AM   #7
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I spoke with a service tech at Progressive today. NXR, you are correct. Your attachment shows fig. 1 & 2. My manual show a fig. 3&4 which are the incorrect mounting configurations for earlier models. According to the tech, the contactor manufacturer corrected the issues with mounting the contactors in horizontal stacked configuration. He stated I must have an old version of the O&M. FYI, my ATS is a PD52C. The C stands for a voltage sensor mod. (small transformer) which tell the gen. to start under loss of shore power, when in auto start mode in the MH control panel. Also, the tech told me that both contactors are N.O. So energizing shore or gen. power does pull in the the respective contactors. (poor design) This will shorten the life of any coil being energized continually. Constant problems with this MH sure disrupts the RV experience. Kind of wish we still had the old tried and true 16 year old Winnebago Adventurer!
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Old 07-06-2020, 11:31 AM   #8
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So energizing shore or gen. power does pull in the the respective contactors. (poor design) This will shorten the life of any coil being energized continually.
Nope, that's not a concern at all. These things are built for tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of operations and a similar number of hours.

The opposite is actually true. If one side defaults to "on" and a failure occurs such as a stuck contactor or a coil open circuit that would prevent the "on" side from de-energizing, you could have both contactors passing power at the same time.

In an RV, that could cause the generator to backfeed the shore power circuit. Since the two sources of power (commercial power and generator power) and not synchronized and not in phase, fires and severe damage happen.

Even if you were not plugged into shore power when that failure occurred, the prongs on your shore power plug would be energized and that is an electrocution hazard because everyone assumes hat "unplugged" means "safe to touch". And it should be.

My guess is that older ATS systems consisted of a single contactor. There were some reported failures where the neutral line contact disconnected before the line contactors did and that results in a momentary "open neutral" condition. This "default de-energized dual contactors" actually is a much safer design.

This short video demonstrates how the Progressive Dynamics dual contactor system works. From the verbal description, it sounds like there is a mechanical interlock that prevents both contactors from being energized at the same time.

HTH,

Ray

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Old 07-06-2020, 12:37 PM   #9
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My ATS has always 'clicked' when connecting to shore power. (GT5)

My ATS failed this year (2020) on my 2017 GT5. I ordered a new switch on Amazon and replaced it. My ATS now 'clicks' when connecting shore power and works perfectly.
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Old 07-06-2020, 01:06 PM   #10
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My ATS always 'clicked' into Shore Power position when I plug in... that is absolutely normal.

Don't confuse a click one way or the other with some type of problem, usually it's the opposite - if you DON'T hear any click over, which means the ATS is not sensing the new power source.

So, to confirm... the ATS is not 'live' without being plugged in or the generator running, so neither set of contacts is doing 'anything', they are NOT energized, because no source of 120v power is coming into the 'box'(ATS). Either power source then will cause the contacts to magnetically 'CLICK' to it's closed position, making all necessary contacts for voltage, and remains there until the power source is removed, or turned off.

Now, if you have the coach plugged in, those sets of contacts will remain on the Shore Power side of the contacts, but IF you then crank the generator, after 20-30 seconds you will hear a 'thump'/'click' when the generator power TRUMPS the Shore Power and changes over the contacts on the Generator input side.
If then, the generator is turned off, and the coach is STILL plugged into Shore Power, an immediate 'thump/click' will tell you that the contacts are now applied to the Shore Power side of the ATS.

So, what happens when the active Shore Power, or even Generator Power, by itself, is removed? Well, the ATS then 'loses' any sensing of 120v power, and simply remains in a state of 'neither' contacts being in position.
If you open your ATS box, and watch while someone plugs in your coach, you will immediately see, and hear, the Shore Power contacts ENERGIZE and make contact.
If, at the same time you are plugged in, you turn on the Generator, in 20-30 seconds you'll see and hear the same thing happen, but on the Generator side of the contacts - NEITHER can be energized, or in the 'contact' position, at the same time - so the 'default' Power Source is actually the GENERATOR, not the Shore Power.
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Old 07-06-2020, 01:20 PM   #11
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... that is If you open your ATS box, and watch while someone plugs in your coach, you will immediately see, and hear, the Shore Power contacts ENERGIZE and make contact.
For future readers, while we're specifically talking about factory default configurations for Georgetowns, "immediately" is not necessarily true for other RV types or manufacturers. Or for people who have installed some type of protective EMS.

My EMS is wired before the ATS. When shore power is turned on my EMS has a built-in delay of its own. Once its delay times out then you'll see the ATS do its thing. I hear a CLUUUUUNNNKKKK as both the EMS and ATS contactors energize in rapid sequence.

And unless you really know what you're doing safety-wise, never plug in shore power or run the generator with the ATS cover removed. I can guarantee the "thrill" will be very short indeed...

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Old 07-06-2020, 01:34 PM   #12
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This $100k+ MH has been nothing but a nightmare! We have only owned it for 8 months and it has been in for repairs for more nights than we have stayed in it.
Can you detail what other issues you've had? They might help a future reader out or someone here might have a quick fix that does not involve traveling.

Does one involve that plastic electrical wiring "chain" having its links come apart, the black "chain" on the rear side of the dinette/recliner slide?

The reason I ask is that we looked at a 2019.5 34H5 at RCD on March 23, 2019 and it had one of those chain links separated about in the middle of the chain. From a quote they sent me this was the VIN: 1F66F5DY8K0A00131

I suspect some of your problems may be from "lot rot" because you had a 2019 model year delivered in Nov. 2019. We ordered ours at the end of March 2019 to get what we wanted factory-installed and it was delivered to the dealer at the end of May 2019 as a 2020 model year.

I didn't even realize that custom ordering was an option or that it would be that quick until I saw a forum posting by someone else.

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Old 07-06-2020, 04:41 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by pojoGTH5 View Post
Have family here for the 4th and discovered my ATS is not working. Have full power and everything works when the generator is running, but plugging into shore power nothing happens. Took the cover off the transfer switch and could smell something burnt. Inside the box was a broken piece of plastic that came off one of the contactors. When I looked at the Progressive Dynamics O&M manual for the ATS, on page 3 it states, " do not mount the unit vertically as shown in figure 3 & 4. Doing so will shorten the life of the unit." Guess which way mine is mounted! This $100k+ MH has been nothing but a nightmare! We have only owned it for 8 months and it has been in for repairs for more nights than we have stayed in it. I will not take it back to the dealer in Ohio. It was a mistake the buy from RCD! The last warranty work we had done was at a Georgetown dealer Elkhart Ind. They were to investigate why I could not get the chassis heater and AC to work properly. They discovered someone had removed the air distribution box and controls from under the dash and hood! The selling dealership must have cannibalized my unit and never put it back. I just don't know what to do anymore!
I feel for you, I had brought a brand new 2018 FR 31L5 and had nothing but issues with it from slides that were either stuck out or in, AC units leaking inside when running, and many more. Spent 7 months out of the first 12 in the shop. This year slide issues once again contacted FR Warranty Director. Very helpful, had a local shop approved to repair it. All fixed and just recently decided it was time to move on to a DP and will never look back. Quality for the much money was lacking to say the least from the very beginning. Sometimes it's better to buy used instead of new. Anyway back to the clunking, when I plugged into shore power mine clunking as well, each and every time. Listening to issues with the ATS in such a short window I guess I'm glad it's gone though like the layout. Wish you luck...btw I won't claim my new, albeit used, is any better but hoping all the bugs have been worked out for me.
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Old 07-06-2020, 06:30 PM   #14
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The numbers match. RCD is a terrible RV dealer!!! When we looked at the unit in Nov. 2019, I knew it had been sitting a long time. The chassis batt. was dead and they had to jump it to get it started. When they finally got it started, went to put the dinning slide out and there was a god awful grinding snapping noise. The plastic roller chain was still broken. They said they fixed it and when we made the deal and went back to pick it up, the slide went in and out fine. Got home (4hr.drive) put the slide out to show the kids and the chain broke again. I have made the 4hr. drive to RCD 3 times now for repairs and I will never go back!!! I would like to stop in and dump my black water tank in their parking lot, but that would be illegal.
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Old 07-06-2020, 07:27 PM   #15
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NXR, I'm not surprised the unit we bought is the same unit you looked at 6 months before we bought it. You asked "what other issues had I had." Well, here we go:

Front tires out of balance. Bad vibration.
Pulled to right at highway speed.
Chassis heater/AC would not work. Stopped after an hour drive to find wiring harness not plugged together under the dash. Heater blower now worked but could not adjust the direction of air flow.
The unit was full of dead "stink bugs" In the cupboards, the bed, heater ducts, shower, and basement compartments, Will still find them sometimes.
Got home, put the slides out to show the grandkids. When I put the dining slide back in I did not realize the plastic chain had broken again and it bunched up and pushed the slide trim off of the wall.
The support legs on the bed slide folded under when the slide came in.
Put the overhead bunk down to show the kids where they could sleep, went half way back up and stopped. Had to read instruction book how to manually put it back up.
Received recall notice on the Refrigerator gas line. "DO NOT USE GAS REFRIGERATOR" was the message.
During one of the return trips to the dealer, the trim board above the microwave fell off.
When the warm weather came, the headliner on the overhead bunk has come unglued. It hangs down and I rub my head on it every time I get into the drivers seat.
And now the ATS!

My wife and I have RV'd for almost 50 years. Honeymooned in an 8 ft. pick-up camper. Then a used 5th wheel, and 2 different new 5th wheels. Then to a used motorhome, then a bigger used motorhome, and now the new GT5. This now has become the worst experience in RVing.
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Old 07-06-2020, 08:31 PM   #16
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I have a 2020 GT5. My list problems so far include the following
1 track for shower door installed backwards so water flows out on the floor
2 Out door shower over tightened so it cracked
3 Heat and vibration in one of the theater chairs does not work
4 Rear awning will not go out
5 Over head bunk stopped 90 % up. Will not go up or down
6 Recall for fuel line to fridge
7 Leak in the way bay

The Precision Plex control panel shows my unit correctly but the diagnostic panel shows it as GT36b5 so I can not manually open the the awning.

I emailed and called Precision Plex of course they have not responded.

I am also getting frustrated
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Old 07-06-2020, 09:15 PM   #17
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Got home, put the slides out to show the grandkids. When I put the dining slide back in I did not realize the plastic chain had broken again and it bunched up and pushed the slide trim off of the wall.
This problem plagues both the 2019 and 2020 model years. We caught it when my wife heard something odd and stopped the slide extension so there was no damage. My unit is currently at the factory waiting for the transport service to deliver it back. I specifically asked for that issue to be resolved so we'll see what, if anything, was done to correct it.

Some people's dealers have put an elastic strap underneath to help pull it along. Success has been elusive, though.

I've noticed it happen more at 50 degrees and below so I'm sure it's just the plastic stiffening up. So for now I watch the chain with a flashlight while it's moving and push it down the hole if needed. Not optimal but it works.

Quote:
The support legs on the bed slide folded under when the slide came in.
A friend with a 2019.5 36B5 has the same issue. He tried bracing it with a bracket but has not resolved the issue yet. He never took it back to the dealer for any repairs, preferring to work on things himself.

We have not had that issue yet and he said our leg is installed differently. I think he said our legs are rotated 90 degrees so the wide part of the 2x4 faces the cabinets. Is that different from yours?

Quote:
Received recall notice on the Refrigerator gas line. "DO NOT USE GAS REFRIGERATOR" was the message.
Forest River recalled every 34H5 because one dealer found the propane line at the fridge was routed too close to the propane burner. When they investigated they found the line routing was "inconsistent" so they recalled all of them, including ours.

The warning was to turn the propane off entirely because the fridge does not have its own propane line shut-off. We rarely run the fridge on propane and there was no heat damage to our line so we just turned the tank off when not using it for cooking. That's one of the things being done at the factory.

Quote:
When the warm weather came, the headliner on the overhead bunk has come unglued. It hangs down and I rub my head on it every time I get into the drivers seat.
Yeah, mine did that as well but I must not be as tall as you. I didn't even ask them to fix it at the factory. My friend with the 36B5 has the same covering on the bottom of his top bunk bed and it did the same thing. If it gets annoying I'll just use some decorative screws with big heads to hold it up.

Quote:
And now the ATS!
Unless that broken plastic was done at install it was just a manufacturing defect and those happen. Or maybe the ATS got dropped sometime.

We've had quite a few more items than you, most of which are detailed here for other's awareness. That being said, we lived in our 34H5 for four months straight this winter with only a few minor issues. So yeah, we're quite happy with it.

The common "wisdom" is an owner of a new rig spends the first year getting things fixed regardless of how much they paid or the manufacturer. I've read a lot of posts from people with units that cost three or four times more and have the same problems. I read voraciously before we upgraded from our 10' pop-up to the motorhome so I was prepared for almost anything. Forest River has really stepped up and our dealer, a small family-owned business on the west side of Cleveland, OH, usually did a superb job on the repairs and the timeliness. Many people say that choosing a good dealer is more important than the correct unit. I wouldn't go quite that far but it sure has helped us.

One concern we had with your dealer was that we saw a real disconnect between the service department and the sales department. For example, we asked for a quote on getting Sumo Springs installed. The front ones are extremely easy to install and takes an hour to do both. The rears are more complicated and require drilling of the frame. They quoted the same number of multiple labor hours for the front as for the rear. That's a blatant over-charge although the service manager called it "the flat rate price", after I specifically noted the install time difference.

They quoted almost double for the TPMS install from what it cost. They marked up the Splendide washer/dryer combo hundreds over the retail price and tacked the install on the top of that. They would not call out the precise Splendide model number on the quote until I asked multiple times. I suspect we would have ended up with the unvented model rather than the vented model if we had not pushed the issue and also bought from them. Etc.

When I talked to the salesperson, who we liked a lot, he effectively shrugged his shoulders and said the service center was a different profit center and they set their own rules. I expect I was not the first potential customer to complain about that. He said he would talk to the service manager and I told him to let the service manager know that he was about to blow a sale. It didn't help and that told me that the salesperson would be of little help resolving problems post-purchase. You may have had an entirely different experience with your salesperson so I could be wrong.

Good luck,

Ray
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Old 07-06-2020, 10:05 PM   #18
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The numbers match. RCD is a terrible RV dealer!!! When we looked at the unit in Nov. 2019, I knew it had been sitting a long time. The chassis batt. was dead and they had to jump it to get it started.
Yeah, when we looked at it the batteries were also dead and needed jumped. The salesperson said that people often leave the battery switch on. I was wondering if it had sat there all winter.

Well, you probably got a lot better price than they quoted us anyway.

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Old 07-07-2020, 09:02 AM   #19
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How do you contact Georgetown for factory service?
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Old 07-07-2020, 10:20 AM   #20
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How do you contact Georgetown for factory service?
You're not going to like this answer but you're supposed to work through the selling dealer. Just tell them you want to go back to the factory for your issues and see what happens. Also ask them to give you the factory rep's contact so you can free up some of the dealer's time and nothing is lost in the communications.

For us, we had a slide issue that the dealer did not have the capability to handle so it was an easy decision for them. The factory rep asked for the entire list of issues and said they could fix them all at the same time, which made us feel good.

You also could expand the SERVICE section here and try giving Nick a call or email:

https://forestriverinc.com/rvs/conta...gionSelected=1

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