Electric KWH charge for monthly camping

[dwa1000]

I'm sure others have talked about this. I'm in a campgroung in Delaware. The monthly charge is $.30 per KWH. For a month I used about 700 kwh and got hit with a $210.00 bill. I complained and they dropped to $.25. Still I think this is high. What do others pay.

[aeguy010]

I pay .12 cents/kWh here in Ohio.

John

[5picker]

We paid $0.12 per KWH per month while in FL for 4 months. We've been advised it will be $0.13 per KWH this season.

We averaged about 500 KWH per month. ($60)

For comparison only, we pay $0.065 per KWH at our sticks and bricks home in PA.

[chriscowles]

Originally Posted by dwa1000

I'm sure others have talked about this. I'm in a campgroung in Delaware. The monthly charge is $.30 per KWH. For a month I used about 700 kwh and got hit with a $210.00 bill. I complained and they dropped to $.25. Still I think this is high. What do others pay.

I think the most relevant fact is how much the campground pays. That's probably public information from the utility. While you're not going to get it at cost, it can certainly be a basis for a discussion about their charges.

[JerryR]

17 cents per KWH here in Las Cruces, New Mexico. The average commercial rate in Las Cruces is 10.04 cents and the residential is 11.87 cents.

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by chriscowles

I think the most relevant fact is how much the campground pays. That's probably public information from the utility. While you're not going to get it at cost, it can certainly be a basis for a discussion about their charges.

The campground owner paid for all the distribution wires, equipment, and probably individual meters as well (power company usually only supplies meter to campground unless the power company charges each site themselves).

All that cost has to be recovered somehow so the tenant pays more through an increased rate.

All the details are no doubt spelled out in the rental agreement which the tenant signed when leasing.

THAT's the time to decide what's reasonable and what's not.

FWIW, I just paid the electric bill yesterday for my 4-bedroom, 2050 square foot house. Used 660 Kwh and it cost me $71.66. Good luck getting that rate at any seasonal site.

BTW:

Here's some info on Delaware's electric rates

13.58¢
Residential electricity rates in Delaware average 13.58¢/kWh, which ranks the state 13th in the nation. The average residential electricity rate of 13.58¢/kWh in DE is 14.31% greater than the national average residential rate of 11.88¢/kWh.

10.13¢

Commercial electricity rates in Delaware average 10.13¢/kWh, which ranks the state 18th in the nation. The average commercial electricity rate of 10.13¢/kWh in DE is 0.4% greater than the national average commercial rate of 10.09¢/kWh.

[Larry-NC]

Originally Posted by TitanMike

The campground owner paid for all the distribution wires, equipment, and probably individual meters as well (power company usually only supplies meter to campground unless the power company charges each site themselves).

All that cost has to be recovered somehow so the tenant pays more through an increased rate.

I wouldn't be surprised if the permanents and long-termers are subsidizing the transients and the common areas.

[chriscowles]

Originally Posted by TitanMike

The campground owner paid for all the distribution wires, equipment, and probably individual meters as well (power company usually only supplies meter to campground unless the power company charges each site themselves).

All that cost has to be recovered somehow so the tenant pays more through an increased rate.

All the details are no doubt spelled out in the rental agreement which the tenant signed when leasing.

THAT's the time to decide what's reasonable and what's not.

FWIW, I just paid the electric bill yesterday for my 4-bedroom, 2050 square foot house. Used 660 Kwh and it cost me $71.66. Good luck getting that rate at any seasonal site.

BTW:

Here's some info on Delaware's electric rates

As I stated, you can't get it at cost and did not suggest they would.

[Iwritecode]

Originally Posted by chriscowles

I think the most relevant fact is how much the campground pays. That's probably public information from the utility. While you're not going to get it at cost, it can certainly be a basis for a discussion about their charges.

That goes against how I've always understood it to be. I didn't think they were legally allowed to charge more than what the electric company is charging.


https://www.forestriverforums.com/fo...ml#post2391625

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by Iwritecode

That goes against how I've always understood it to be. I didn't think they were legally allowed to charge more than what the electric company is charging.


https://www.forestriverforums.com/fo...ml#post2391625

I can't see how a law like that would stand. Even if there was such a law saying the electricity couldn't be sold for more than it's cost, I'm sure the campground could add a "Delivery Charge" to cover the cost of the system within the campground.

If not then people would probably get one service point and then a bunch of really long extension cords.

FWIW, my local Natural Gas company, which is regulated by the State, has the costs broken down on the bills. So much for the cost of the gas plus a delivery charge based on the therm's delivered.

Cost of gas is low but in the end we still pay about twice the cost per therm as what it costs our utility.

[Volvodriver]

Several years ago we wintered in an rv park in Port Aransas with a group of folks who had been coming to this park for years. That winter the electric rate for everyone just went through the roof of every ones rv. We were only second year folks with this group but we complained too but paid the bill. A group of us moved to a different park on the island the next winter. Well long story short the park we moved from had to rebate money to about 15 different parties (not us) because the explanation from the state was you can not charge more cents per kwh than you are charged and if you do you become a distributer of electricity and better have an office, trucks, men, etc.
This about five or six years back but it still may hold water.

Dave

[Igave]

The parks we winter at average the usage of folks over time and that’s blended in the nightly cost. If staying over seven days their rate changes (Lower) and at that time the renter pays the electricity based on the meter. The rate for that is on the agreement we sign on entering the park. I don’t think it was exactly the same for the three Arizona parks we spent several weeks each at last year but if I remember correctly they were within 5 cents of each other-11 cents being average. They were all up front about their rate.

[Daycruiser]

Some states regulate the redistribution of Electric in RV parks. Call the utility commission and ask them what the Park is allowed to charge over and above their cost from the utility. I suspect they are at the max the state allows.

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by Daycruiser

Some states regulate the redistribution of Electric in RV parks. Call the utility commission and ask them what the Park is allowed to charge over and above their cost from the utility. I suspect they are at the max the state allows.

Here's a reference showing all states regulations (of those that have them) regarding Sub Metering or Master Metering of utilities.

I believe most RV Parks would fall under "Master Metering" where they get billed off ONE meter and they then use secondary meters to parcel out the charges. Sub Metering could also be the case but with more accounting.

https://www.ncsl.org/research/energy...bmetering.aspx

Here's what Deleware has in place (where the OP was raising the question):

Under Delaware law, landlords who did not install separate submeters for their commercial tenants were regulated under statute prohibiting electricity profiteering where fluctuating utility payments were part of the rent and in light of related federal regulation policy (Del. Code Ann. tit. 25 §5114)

[formerFR]

whether it's 'too much' is totally subjective, as in certain areas of the country the electrical charges are certainly much higher than others - we can't tell you if 'your' rate is too high, especially if the campground is already paying close to that themselves.

Most of the time a 'metered site' is in play, the RV owner is given notice about the rate that will be assessed for the kwh used, so it's hard to say that it should be a 'shock' that you didn't know ahead of time.

Another thought is that the park is free to charge whatever 'kwh' price they wish, just like they can charge any 'site' fee they wish - it's up to the RV owner to accept that, or not.
As some have said, while you might not 'like' the rate, it's probably just as obvious that the same 'rate' is considered in the park's daily and weekly rates, just unknown to the RV owner since it's not 'portioned out' separately, but already included.
A park owner can also consider the underlying infrastructure costs, and maintenance, and future improvements, as part of the overall cost, as well. I don't see why they wouldn't, though many may not.

Metered electricity at any park can get hairy. It's not a 'cut and dry' charge, and since it's based on YOUR usage, it's hard to complain later that the amount is too high - which is really the real reason any park DOES meter separately the monthly and seasonal sites. It gives the RV owners a real reason to be aware of their own usage, just like at your home. You can certainly monitor the meter each and every day and start to get an idea of what your next 'monthly' bill might wind up costing.

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by formerFR

whether it's 'too much' is totally subjective, as in certain areas of the country the electrical charges are certainly much higher than others - we can't tell you if 'your' rate is too high, especially if the campground is already paying close to that themselves.

Most of the time a 'metered site' is in play, the RV owner is given notice about the rate that will be assessed for the kwh used, so it's hard to say that it should be a 'shock' that you didn't know ahead of time.

Another thought is that the park is free to charge whatever 'kwh' price they wish, just like they can charge any 'site' fee they wish - it's up to the RV owner to accept that, or not.
As some have said, while you might not 'like' the rate, it's probably just as obvious that the same 'rate' is considered in the park's daily and weekly rates, just unknown to the RV owner since it's not 'portioned out' separately, but already included.
A park owner can also consider the underlying infrastructure costs, and maintenance, and future improvements, as part of the overall cost, as well. I don't see why they wouldn't, though many may not.

Metered electricity at any park can get hairy. It's not a 'cut and dry' charge, and since it's based on YOUR usage, it's hard to complain later that the amount is too high - which is really the real reason any park DOES meter separately the monthly and seasonal sites. It gives the RV owners a real reason to be aware of their own usage, just like at your home. You can certainly monitor the meter each and every day and start to get an idea of what your next 'monthly' bill might wind up costing.

Read an article on this earlier that may be a sign of things to come.

How many times do we read posts suggesting that people switch the water heater to electric heat, use a heater or heaters instead of the furnace to save propane. Both because the electricity is "free. Well at least it's included in the nightly charge for non seasonal sites.

The article suggested that parks may start charging for electricity, probably reading the meter at sites early on the morning of checkout. A lot like PPV charges at a hotel. The park they cited in their article said their electric bill was an average of $6,000 per month. Now add cost of getting the electricity to the sites (and paying off the probable bank loan needed to finance it).

OR

Just raise prices to cover the average site's usage.

BTW, the article also said that the electric charge is most likely included in any seasonal site rental agreement so surprises shouldn't be surprises.

[dwa1000]

Originally Posted by formerFR

whether it's 'too much' is totally subjective, as in certain areas of the country the electrical charges are certainly much higher than others - we can't tell you if 'your' rate is too high, especially if the campground is already paying close to that themselves.

Most of the time a 'metered site' is in play, the RV owner is given notice about the rate that will be assessed for the kwh used, so it's hard to say that it should be a 'shock' that you didn't know ahead of time.

Another thought is that the park is free to charge whatever 'kwh' price they wish, just like they can charge any 'site' fee they wish - it's up to the RV owner to accept that, or not.
As some have said, while you might not 'like' the rate, it's probably just as obvious that the same 'rate' is considered in the park's daily and weekly rates, just unknown to the RV owner since it's not 'portioned out' separately, but already included.
A park owner can also consider the underlying infrastructure costs, and maintenance, and future improvements, as part of the overall cost, as well. I don't see why they wouldn't, though many may not.

Metered electricity at any park can get hairy. It's not a 'cut and dry' charge, and since it's based on YOUR usage, it's hard to complain later that the amount is too high - which is really the real reason any park DOES meter separately the monthly and seasonal sites. It gives the RV owners a real reason to be aware of their own usage, just like at your home. You can certainly monitor the meter each and every day and start to get an idea of what your next 'monthly' bill might wind up costing.

I should have made it clear that i have never done a month plus electric ( I thought I did)and that's all i was informed was plus electric. When I pressed I was told "going rate". I got no indication of final cost. Thats why I asked here. The shock was $.30 times what I used. Lesson learned don't park before I know.

[formerFR]

Originally Posted by TitanMike

...

The article suggested that parks may start charging for electricity, probably reading the meter at sites early on the morning of checkout. A lot like PPV charges at a hotel.
OR
Just raise prices to cover the average site's usage.

doubtful, doubtful, as 'check out' times are different for everyone - no one checks out 'exactly' at 11am, so trying to go thru the motions of 'reading' meters, and then assessing an additional 'fee' for that, would be MOST problematic, and certainly NOT customer friendly, as the RV owner already 'paid' for the site the previous day - having to 'pay again' would not be any workable solution in reality.

Yes, increasing overall pricing, if even only $1 per site, is the 'natural' way for any business owner to solve any 'too much electricity cost' issue.

And yes, we've seen several parks that make a BIG notice that: NO ELECTRICAL HEATING IS ALLOWED! or something along those lines. It's like telling a RV owner that they can't use 'both' their roof air conditioners, but only ONE. Or that they can't take their 'own' shower, but must use the bath house. Crazy.

[Iwritecode]

Originally Posted by TitanMike

I can't see how a law like that would stand. Even if there was such a law saying the electricity couldn't be sold for more than it's cost, I'm sure the campground could add a "Delivery Charge" to cover the cost of the system within the campground.

Sure, my CG adds a "maintenance fee" on top of our bill as well.

But the OP is specifically talking about the per/KhW rate, which at .30 seems really high. And from what I understand, the CG isn't allowed to change that specific rate to a higher amount than what they are charged.

[formerFR]

well, 'where' you get the notion that no one is 'allowed' to do something is fraught with issues - since there's no 'national' or 'state' requirement of anything to do with 'electrical cost' passed on to temporary renters/campgrounds, or anything else. If the park wants to do that, they can. If the Rv owner doesn't like it, they're under no obligation to 'stay' there.