Surge Protection

[Mr Havercamp]

Originally Posted by ShermanD

Please do not mislead fellow RVers by saying that Joules is just a marketing ploy for it isn't, Just like a circuit breaker, each are designed to operate effectively a set number of times. When it comes to a surge protector, the higher the joule rating, the more times the surge protector will handle an over or under voltage condition.. maybe you are loyal to a specific brand even though it has a lower joule rating and a higher price but I will choose the product that offers the most most protection the most number of times.

now who has the last laugh?

Joules has nothing to do with how many times an EMS will handle low or high voltage conditions. Joules is about how may times a device will take a surge at a given value. 99.9% of the time a surge is going to be above that joule rating whatever it is and the surge capabilty will be toast afterwards. More important is capping voltage. In addition to that, surges are very uncommon, high and low voltage conditions are common.

With the Camco unit when an actual surge happens you toss it in the trash, with the Progressive industries they send you a new surge module. In this post alone the score is 10 for Progressive Industries, 1 for Camco, 1 for nothing whatsoever. Say what about last laughs?

I have found high voltage many times(not a surge) including last Friday. It was as high as 139.

[FollowTheSun]

Watt joule is that … I notice there is some confusion about the use of the term “joule.” Most folks are familiar with the term “watt,” where watt is a unit of power consumption per unit of time. Watt is the amount of energy consumed per unit of time (power). Joule is the unit of energy. One watt is the flow of one joule per second.
Without getting too technical or overly specific, perhaps the following might help folks understand the purpose of surge protection. The purpose of a surge protector is to protect against instantaneous power line voltage transients that are usually very brief, often only a few microseconds in duration. These transient can derive from various source, such a surge induced across power-lines by distant lightning. Such transient surges might exceed several thousand volts and deliver several thousand amps, but because the transient is so brief it may only deliver a few hundred joules of energy. Surge protectors have three important values to consider: joule rating, the ampere rating and response time.
As way of example, Progressive Industries EMS-HWC30 has a surge protection rating of 1,790 joules / 44,000 amps with a response time less than 1 nanosecond (.000000001 second). While 1ns seems ridiculously fast, keep in mind that a transient surge of 10,000 volts peaking after 1us has a voltage rise of 10 volts per ns ... this should illustrate how quickly over-voltage surge rises to troubling values. Most surge protectors use an electronic component known as a metal-oxide voltage-dependent-resistor (MOV). A MOV has high electrical resistance which decreases as voltage increases. This allows the device to absorb the brief transient surges by shunting the excess energy.
While this is all very useful for shunting induced surges from distant lightning strikes, it would offer no protection from a near or direct lightning strike. But near or direct lightning is an entirely different beast where protection against person injury is far more important than concern about electrical damage to your coach.

[hondo]

Man, I sure am enjoying my pop corn on this one.

[Witch Doctor]

Originally Posted by ShermanD

Please do not mislead fellow RVers by saying that Joules is just a marketing ploy for it isn't, Just like a circuit breaker, each are designed to operate effectively a set number of times. When it comes to a surge protector, the higher the joule rating, the more times the surge protector will handle an over or under voltage condition.. maybe you are loyal to a specific brand even though it has a lower joule rating and a higher price but I will choose the product that offers the most most protection the most number of times.

now who has the last laugh?

give me a break you can not say this is not funny lighten up: Power Protection and electrical is Progressive Industries only business. They do not sell paper towel dispensers, garbage cans, patio mats, tacky lights, and toilet paper. I have no dog in this argument I'll stick to PROGRESSIVE, but that is my choice not yours. You got misleaded by my LOL?

[ChateauV10]

Originally Posted by hondo

Man, I sure am enjoying my pop corn on this one.

I count four-

Progressive
CAMCO
Joules, huh?
Protection? nahhhhhh! (my favorite)

[TURBS]

Originally Posted by ShermanD

sorry to inform you but the Camco line surge protectors also has a lifetime warranty for materials and workmanship.



Their 55301 30 AMP Power Defender Voltage Protector has a 2450 Joule rating while the Progressive industries EMS PT-30C only has a 1790 Joule rating.



The main thing everyone needs to know is the higher the joule rating the better.



The low voltage drop off on the Camco is a 102 while the power defender is a 104 which is negligable considering they are both within the UL listing required voltage range for electiric devices.



Amazon Prime price for the Camco 55301 is $199.95

Amazon Prime price for the Progressive Industries EMS PT-30C is $248.25



When comparing apples to apples, the Camco is by far the better deal

Camco does not offer lifetime warranty. "Prove it"
Camco is not the best deal.
Made in China

Progressive is the best deal
Lifetime warranty
Made in the USA




2015 Columbus 320RS
2008 2500HD Duramax
2015 nights camped "34"
2016 nights camped "14"

[Witch Doctor]

RV Power & Surge Protection—Hardwired
BACK TO OUR PRODUCTS

Our products are proudly made in the U.S.A. This is from the progressive web site, I didn't read "MADE IN CHINA" Maybe the plug in portables, but I didn't buy that.

[TURBS]

To the op.
This will help you decide.
https://www.rvupgradestore.com/rv-su...uide-a/279.htm

Please don't cheap out on a camco or surge guard brand.


2015 Columbus 320RS
2008 2500HD Duramax
2015 nights camped "34"
2016 nights camped "14"

[BandJCarm]

Bon Joules!

[Mr Havercamp]

Originally Posted by BandJCarm

Bon Joules!

Lol.....now thats funny!

[BandJCarm]

It's a gift.

You should see my face................

(P.S., I absolutely get a HUGE kick out of the tete-a-tete on this site, on all these subjects. I really get bothered when they shut a thread down. I love it. Plus, if you look past all the hoopla, there is a TON of true information to glean. Danged information costs me a ton of money here!!!! LOL But it's great to have. 99% of the back and forth here is based on the concept of "I don't have the best, I got stuck with X, so let me try and explain to all you noobs why X is absolutely peachy keen to use and let me justify my ownership of X"................)

[Kenny kustom]

Originally Posted by BandJCarm

It's a gift.

You should see my face................

(P.S., I absolutely get a HUGE kick out of the tete-a-tete on this site, on all these subjects. I really get bothered when they shut a thread down. I love it. Plus, if you look past all the hoopla, there is a TON of true information to glean. Danged information costs me a ton of money here!!!! LOL But it's great to have. 99% of the back and forth here is based on the concept of "I don't have the best, I got stuck with X, so let me try and explain to all you noobs why X is absolutely peachy keen to use and let me justify my ownership of X"................)

Nail on the head.

I couldn't afford/justify the best, so here's my awesome, third place.

Hard wired 50a Pi ems in my basement. Love it.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

[MillerTime]

Originally Posted by jec9017

I am fairly new at this and the DW asked about surge protection after searching reviews on the internet still confused are these things worth the investment? the best i can tell the less expensive units are worthless what do yall think
Thanks
JECRG

A transformer in our campground went haywire last year. Our 50 amp hardwired, progressive ems system killed our power and our camper stayed safe. One of our neighbors lost most of his electronics....about $7,000+ of replacement parts, appliances and labor .
I'm thinking my $300 ems was well worth the money!

[tenttotrailer]

Originally Posted by TURBS

Camco does not offer lifetime warranty. "Prove it"
Camco is not the best deal.
Made in China

Progressive is the best deal
Lifetime warranty
Made in the USA




2015 Columbus 320RS
2008 2500HD Duramax
2015 nights camped "34"
2016 nights camped "14"

Common sense tells me not to weigh in on this but can't help myself.....so something is the best deal if it is made in the USA? Or something is the best if it is a lifetime warranty? Or is your arguement that lifetime warranty and as a bonus it is made in the USA? So if a surge protector came in a transparent case with no manufacturer name and numbers but the spec sheet showed it was superior, keeping in mind lab testing so apples are compared to apples, would you buy it not knowing its origins of manufacture?

[retired06]

Don't mean to hi-jack this thread but l'm just a dumb pipe fitter. A friend of mine has a portable pi unit and told me he read it said not to be used with an inverter generator. True or false?

[davel1971]

Originally Posted by tenttotrailer

Common sense tells me not to weigh in on this but can't help myself.....so something is the best deal if it is made in the USA? Or something is the best if it is a lifetime warranty? Or is your arguement that lifetime warranty and as a bonus it is made in the USA? So if a surge protector came in a transparent case with no manufacturer name and numbers but the spec sheet showed it was superior, keeping in mind lab testing so apples are compared to apples, would you buy it not knowing its origins of manufacture?

common sense tells me your just looking to argue. PI is clearly the most popular brand, and for good reasons. I don't care where it's made. It does the job better than any other product. The fact they are the only ones who back it up with a lifetime warranty shows they have confidence in their product, because they make one product and do it right.

[MillerTime]

Originally Posted by tenttotrailer

Common sense tells me not to weigh in on this but can't help myself.....so something is the best deal if it is made in the USA? Or something is the best if it is a lifetime warranty? Or is your arguement that lifetime warranty and as a bonus it is made in the USA? So if a surge protector came in a transparent case with no manufacturer name and numbers but the spec sheet showed it was superior, keeping in mind lab testing so apples are compared to apples, would you buy it not knowing its origins of manufacture?

I go for best reputation to handle the job im looking to get done, within a certain price range. But will go up in my price range if needed to.

PI has the best reputation from all I've seen, and they are priced right around where many others are.

.....plus.....its saved my camper, so that holds up its quality reputation!!!
USA made is a plus!

[BandJCarm]

I sorta care where it's made. In fact......and I'll admit it....I'd buy a slightly inferior product if it was made in the USA. But origin is 2nd on my criteria, I have to admit.

I have a PI, it has worked flawlessly and done it's job, and it's saved my bacon, and I don't care what it cost.....and honestly, I don't even know or care where it's made, other than yes, the USA is a big plus to me.

[TURBS]

Originally Posted by tenttotrailer

so something is the best deal if it is made in the USA? Or something is the best if it is a lifetime warranty? Or is your arguement that lifetime warranty and as a bonus it is made in the USA? So if a surge protector came in a transparent case with no manufacturer name and numbers but the spec sheet showed it was superior, keeping in mind lab testing so apples are compared to apples, would you buy it not knowing its origins of manufacture?

YEP!
You can't argue with made in the USA.
Nor can you argue with lifetime warranty.
I really don't see the problem.



2015 Columbus 320RS
2008 2500HD Duramax
2015 nights camped "34"
2016 nights camped "14"

[tenttotrailer]

Originally Posted by davel1971

common sense tells me your just looking to argue. PI is clearly the most popular brand, and for good reasons. I don't care where it's made. It does the job better than any other product. The fact they are the only ones who back it up with a lifetime warranty shows they have confidence in their product, because they make one product and do it right.

Nope....don't wish to argue...but I had a thought it would go that way.

The Op posted his/her original question was about surge protectors, what are they, are they worth the money....please help. It went from that question to which version of Progressive Industries was the best. So right now I will drop the caveat that I own a progressive industries product but I bought mine on my knowledge of stereo electronics and household electricty and I bought the best to save my expensive stereo. I then put the same rational in RV's and protecting them with a surge protector. I bought the PI version as it was on sale and the other local dealers stocked Camco and Surge Guard...if the other dealer had the Surge Guard on sale I probably would have bought that one. There were none made in Canada (sic). yes I can think of three times where my surge protector saved my expensive asset...one being on my own houses front plug.

I saw this discussion was starting to lean towards the trailer tire discussion that all tires made in China were junk therefore everything coming from China is junk. So tongue in cheek I posed my comment of country of manufacture. So back at me, if a surge protector was equal to all others (quality and price and warranty) and came from Canada, would I buy the Canadian version, you bet! But the Op posing the question wants to know quality/function vs nationalism.......yes I am done.

Kevin