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Old 11-22-2019, 02:41 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by mxdad View Post
Do you have THD specs for them? I know they aren't easy to find, but Northern Tool states that all of their generators have <6% THD....including open frames:

https://www.northerntool.com/shop/to...des_generators

Scroll towards the bottom of the page.

Generac has it to.
Generac Power Systems - XP Series of Portable Generators
I think that many focus too greatly on "THD" and often don't have any "appliance" or "device" where it will be critical.

Here's a 'blub' from Champion Power Equipment's website that explains industry standards for generator THD and what items will essentially not care if the THD is within that range. They also list the items that are sensitive to THD's over 5%. (Champion 3500 w Inverter is <3% THD).

Quote:
Champion portable generators will output an industry standard total harmonic distortion (THD) rating of about 12%-20% depending on load applied. They will produce a sine wave, not a modified or square wave. This is perfectly acceptable for running common commodities found in your home such as TVs, computers, your appliances, etc.

THD is a measure of the deviation of a sine wave from a "perfect" sine wave. All electricity, including line electricity, has measurable THD.

If you have a specific item that requires less than 5% THD such as a UPS style battery backup, a pellet stove, or high efficiency furnace control board, we recommend purchasing a Champion Inverter Generator (sizes from 1600W to 3500W); Champion DH Series Open Frame Inverter (sizes from 3500W to 8750W) or a Champion Home Standby Generator (range from 8.5KW to 14KW); all units provide a less than 5% THD.
Please consult your specific appliance manufacturer to determine if the appliance requires low THD (less than 5%) to operate properly.

BTW, if your "appliance" runs off 12 VDC any distortion is eliminated as the AC passes through the converter and is buffered/filtered by the battery.
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Old 11-22-2019, 02:48 PM   #22
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Personally, I don't think inconsiderate has anything to do with rules/laws. For example, if your neighbor blows their leaves from their yard to yours, is that breaking a law/rule? Nope....it's inconsiderate. If you are waiting patiently your turn to checkout in the grocery store and someone cuts in front of you, is that breaking a rule/law? Nope....it's inconsiderate.

Treating others the way you would like to be treated is the best litmus test.

Listen....I'm no choir boy and I'm sure I do plenty to irritate people but I try to be considerate. For example, when we arrive late at an RV park, when I back in I turn off my headlights leaving just the parking lights on. My feeling there is my bright headlights don't need to be waking up the neighbor across from me.

A civil society isn't based only on written laws/rules. Or maybe that's what we need these days since so many are about the "me generation".

Vent closed.
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Old 11-22-2019, 02:52 PM   #23
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And what is the real definition of 'inconsiderate'?

Unfortunately that word has opinion associated with it.

What might bother me, might not you and vice-versa.

I'll say it again, it all boils down to whether you are breaking any rules/laws.

If your generator meets the standards for noise level where you are using it and you use it during the hours set forth, it makes no difference how much it bothers someone. You are not doing anything wrong or illegal.
When defining "inconsiderate" as it applies to one's actions they kind of need to put themselves in the other person's shoes.

Since we're talking generators the one operating a generator is probably going to be able to escape the noise by merely going "indoors". The camper they parked next to who is in a tent can't.

I've always found worthwhile to go over and talk with those close to me (when that does happen) and kind of take their temperature regarding generator noise. In the last 20 years I've only had ONE person pack his tent and move while the others understood that the noise would only be temporary. I've also had numerous people who were parked quite a way away ask me if their generator noise was bothering me.

MOST campers are considerate in both directions. BTW, it's amazing how many nice people you can meet if you walk over to the nearby campsite, introduce yourself, and warn them you'll be running your generator and for how long.
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Old 11-22-2019, 02:55 PM   #24
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I have 2 quiet Champion 2000 watt I can connect for 3700 watt. The 4000 are at startup. That entire system cost less than 1 Honda 2000. 2 nights ago I bought another for my daughter. The 1st thing I bought on Amazon ever and last. The $419 price is the same as many other places and $10 higher than 2 others. However, by getting their credit card they knock $60 off. $369 is good. Iíll close the account as Iíll pay the total at 1st billing.
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Old 11-22-2019, 02:58 PM   #25
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Personally I run a 4500 W DuroMaxE unit and have for years.

from their site...
"Both these generators are normal noise makers while running, advertised as producing 69 Db of sound when operating. This is presumed at the typical 23 foot range."

human speech is 60 to 80 Db.

what bothers me is when people run them at 11 pm or 5 am.
that's the inconsiderate part for myself.
another trigger point is those who are packed tight and do not have them exhaust vented above the rigs or trainers. the fumes tend to collect around the trailer at ground level vs clearing the trailer and many times I've been choking on fumes inside our toy hauler even if my generator was turned off.

I run a stack off the exhaust up 10 feet and the wind carries the fumes off.


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Old 11-22-2019, 03:00 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by TitanMike View Post
I think that many focus too greatly on "THD" and often don't have any "appliance" or "device" where it will be critical.
Agreed....that's why I was asking. I have used a couple of open-frame generators (1 champion and 1 Hondas) and never had an issue with anything. I've seen more electronics wiped out by a faulty or cheap voltage regulator than by distortion.
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Old 11-22-2019, 03:06 PM   #27
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Quote:
human speech is 60 to 80 Db.
I believe that number excludes teenagers, especially high school girls.
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Old 11-22-2019, 03:37 PM   #28
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Generators

I have not seen an open frame generator that is below 60 DB. I have both types and would not consider bringing my open frame to a crowded campground. Just a matter of being respectful to fellow campers. There are now some good lower cost enclosed generators for around $600 that are very quiet, EX-Predators. Their 3000 watt- tests @ 62 DB on my meter @ load. It would also help if there was a standard test for manufactures to measure them by. What always gets me, is that some people feel entitled to do whatever they want w/o regards to anyone else. Or the "someone else is doing it, so I am exempt". If you are in the woods by your self, whatever works. In a campground, show common courtesy.
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Old 11-22-2019, 03:39 PM   #29
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Spot-on jd4010.
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Old 11-22-2019, 03:53 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Tundra 2014 View Post
I have not seen an open frame generator that is below 60 DB. I have both types and would not consider bringing my open frame to a crowded campground. Just a matter of being respectful to fellow campers. There are now some good lower cost enclosed generators for around $600 that are very quiet, EX-Predators. Their 3000 watt- tests @ 62 DB on my meter @ load. It would also help if there was a standard test for manufactures to measure them by. What always gets me, is that some people feel entitled to do whatever they want w/o regards to anyone else. Or the "someone else is doing it, so I am exempt". If you are in the woods by your self, whatever works. In a campground, show common courtesy.
I save my open frame champion 3500/4000 watt generator for power outages at my house. Runs in my garden shed with double doors open and since our power outages only occur during storms everyone has windows and doors closed.

Neighbors are also welcome to come over and get some fresh coffee or heat something in the microwave
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Old 11-22-2019, 04:28 PM   #31
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Sorry. I have to come down on the OPEN FRAME GENERATORS ARE BAD side of this.



Bad not only because they are rude and obnoxiously loud. They are that. Frankly ought to be outlawed totally within 100 yds. of humans.



But secondly, most produce a really poor quality of current. Throw it on an oscilloscope and not only is it not a good sine wave, but it puts out a ton of distortion.



Most are bad for electronics and bad for motors. They cause excess heat and motor wear. Duh. The AC is a big motor and is not served well by MOST, especially the cheap, open frame generators.



OptionS: Build a big sound proof collapsible box then to save neighbors the temptation of sabotaging the thing to shut it up. OR Save it for center field at NASCAR.


This sounds like a personal opinion. And to shut up as you say someoneís generator because it bothers you, seems YOU need to be in a field all by yourself
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Old 11-22-2019, 04:30 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mxdad View Post
This goes both ways. You could say that over the last several decades people let more and more things bother them. Camping (like other things in life) has evolved...instead of people in tents and popups, we now have houses on wheels.
There's definitely been an evolution. Some blame it on "millennials."

A less-controversial, non-RV example:
I've lived in the same house and neighborhood for 35 years. The traffic on the streets is the same as it has been when I moved in. (NC DOT and the city publish traffic counts every year and I follow them.) There have been NO significant increases in annual traffic accidents on these residential streets, either.

For over 25 of those years, all the streets were 35 mph (no signs). In the last ten or so, a bunch of "whiners" have insisted that the streets be posted for 25 mph and that speed bumps and otherwise-unnecessary stop signs be installed. In most cases the city would rather give in than fight--and our quality of life decreases. The City Council (directs the city traffic engineer) would rather keep the whiners happy and get re-elected than to do the right thing.
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Old 11-22-2019, 04:41 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jd4010 View Post
Personally, I don't think inconsiderate has anything to do with rules/laws. For example, if your neighbor blows their leaves from their yard to yours, is that breaking a law/rule? Nope....it's inconsiderate. If you are waiting patiently your turn to checkout in the grocery store and someone cuts in front of you, is that breaking a rule/law? Nope....it's inconsiderate.

Treating others the way you would like to be treated is the best litmus test.

Listen....I'm no choir boy and I'm sure I do plenty to irritate people but I try to be considerate. For example, when we arrive late at an RV park, when I back in I turn off my headlights leaving just the parking lights on. My feeling there is my bright headlights don't need to be waking up the neighbor across from me.

A civil society isn't based only on written laws/rules. Or maybe that's what we need these days since so many are about the "me generation".

Vent closed.
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Old 11-22-2019, 05:00 PM   #34
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I think I will just chill out.

DW to DH "Here's your Martini"

DW to DH "Gee, their open frame generator is louder than a Honda"

DH to DW "Yup, lets have another Martini"

Putting on headphones with the "Rolling Stones playing"

Chilling out and relaxing, no stress.

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Old 11-22-2019, 05:18 PM   #35
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Good reading many opinions .... some time in my forties I came to realize (yes it took that long) that one of my new goals in life was to do less and less of things I do not want to do... camping puts me in a good place to achieve much of that goal and I have to say I just would not be in a place camping next to loud generators ... if you want to great be smart with the choices you make
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