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Old 10-02-2019, 06:32 AM   #61
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Reading this thread, I have noticed a common theme: so many people don’t ...
We can all have differing views on the original subject, bringing your own wood into a campground.

I, personally, don't understand the 'campfire' craze that some have... I just enjoy being a part of the environment without the fire and smoke - but many think that you just 'must' have it, or you're not really 'camping'...

having said that:
My own understanding is that this is actually a relatively very small tiny part of the 'problem', if any problem with 'foreign' insects really exists...but the states and government facilities have no other way to try to 'control' it other than to mandate these restrictions at their own facilities. They can't mandate it at your home, or your other getaway location on private land, or even at a privately owned rv park, but only at government controlled facilities. Does anybody really think that this 'restriction' is actually going to really impact any real 'issue' with beetles or any other type of potential insect problem? Does anybody really believe that folks really bring a huge cord of 'foreign' wood thousands of miles across the country while they are traveling? Would most of us admit that most camping happens within 25-50miles of home, and that wood from our 'home' area is probably not any different than the 'wood' sold in the campground where we are building our campfire?

As someone else stated, the wood and wood pulp companies and loggers are moving trees and wood EVERY DAY across this country, but I don't see any of them being 'restricted' to where they can haul this wood, or where they can process it, or where they can sell it. Is a campground really that big of a deal?
Really?
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Old 10-02-2019, 06:56 AM   #62
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I call it, "center of the world syndrome". Those who are infected just do not care to follow any rules or laws, or have considerations for anyone else or the environment - as long as they're having a good time.

I see it every time we go camping... People with out of state tags bringing enough lumber to build a cabin, then deciding at 2am they ought to split some of it. And all the other usual offenses... Not cleaning up after their dogs, not following bear aware practices (in those areas where it's required), ignoring quiet hours, blasting their music at all hours, letting their kids and animals run loose through everyone else's campsites, approaching wildlife, leaving their campsites a mess.... The list goes on.

And I'm afraid their condition is not curable...
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Old 10-02-2019, 08:04 AM   #63
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Well ... a lot here way more stuff than just firewood ... we just buy from campground hope it helps them out... actions and laws have unintended consequences that lead to too many bad things or even good things ... I try to do the right thing starting by picking up after my dogs and moving forward from there .... People and Government mostly try also to do the right thing and yet again unintended consequences step in and mess it all up .... People have a high opinion of there place here on earth and how we affect it and until we start turning hurricanes in the other direction and stopping earthquakes and turning back flood waters and stopping any of the other many forces of nature in my opinion we are just a part of all of it ... less important than we give ourselves credit for ... but we should still try to do the right thing ...
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Old 10-02-2019, 08:16 AM   #64
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I, personally, don't understand the 'campfire' craze that some have... I just enjoy being a part of the environment without the fire and smoke - but many think that you just 'must' have it, or you're not really 'camping'...

It may have something to do with just about every campground, well at least every campground I have ever been to, having one of these at every campsite.
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Old 10-02-2019, 08:34 AM   #65
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You can't bring out of state firewood into California, the Ag station checkpoint will ask if you have any.
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Old 10-02-2019, 08:45 AM   #66
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I call it, "center of the world syndrome". Those who are infected just do not care to follow any rules or laws, or have considerations for anyone else or the environment - as long as they're having a good time.

I see it every time we go camping... People with out of state tags bringing enough lumber to build a cabin, then deciding at 2am they ought to split some of it. And all the other usual offenses... Not cleaning up after their dogs, not following bear aware practices (in those areas where it's required), ignoring quiet hours, blasting their music at all hours, letting their kids and animals run loose through everyone else's campsites, approaching wildlife, leaving their campsites a mess.... The list goes on.

And I'm afraid their condition is not curable...

I don't know what I would do if I experienced all of that every time we go camping. Might quit camping I suppose. I've probably seen an instance of those specific things at one time or another, and I would suggest if you're getting all of that every time, you're going to the wrong places.
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Old 10-02-2019, 08:46 AM   #67
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Related problems -

Stink Bugs - I have lived in the same region of GA for over 50 years. Until recently (last 5-6 years) I never saw a stink bug or at least didnt notice em. Recently they infest my porches and carport by the 100's and manage their way into the house frequently.

Lady Bugs - years ago it was as special treat to spot a lady bug. Good Luck thing. Now each spring I am infested.

Deer - I grew up in Ga wanting to deer hunt. Tried, but got board with it because there were very few deer in the area. If one saw a deer on a weekend hunt it was big camfire story for weeks. Now I have them buy the dozens on my 20 acre homesite. I hit em with my vehicles, they eat my garden and shrubs, and farmers in the area speak of severe crop damage they are responsible for.

Armadillo - Same as above..... Were not in area 10 years ago.


I am sure these critters have been/are being transported into the area but I can not for the life of me firuge out how. I am looking to try to put a stop to it. Any guidance as to how these pests are being transported would be helpful.

Note:Rumors that wild hogs are starting to be transported into the region though I have not seen them yet
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Old 10-02-2019, 08:47 AM   #68
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Perhaps someone can ask the PA Dept of Agriculture how do you inspect a vehicle. Do you look up in the hollow bed sides of a pickup, how about in the heater/AC ducting, behind the wheels, inside the air cleaner, inside all the reinforcing under the hood, inside the doors. Come on, anyone with a few brain cells knows that a small bug could hitch a ride almost anywhere and in a lot of places you can not look. More gubmint gobblygook that will do little if anything at all. It wont be long until the spotted lanternfly is state wide and in many other states same as the EAB. Moving firewood or not will have no effect one way or the other.

For those burning pallets, pallets are how it is suspected that a lot of these pests came into the US to begin with. The EAB in pallets brought to Detroit, and the lanternfly in crates of granite from China brought to eastern PA. Those spent weeks if not months in containers on ships or sitting in ports and quarantine areas. Maybe gubmint should of been doing their job when those came in to begin with?

Propane firepits? Save the planet will you? Better look at what is involved to get at that gas, such as fracking.

Doing a quick look at your car is not going to stop anything, it may make one feel better.
Fracking for Propane aka LPG?
Fracking produces lots of Natural Gas. LPG is produced during refining Crude Oil which can come out of the ground through many different methods.
Yes, it's still a fossil fuel but when burned it produces far fewer pollutants than a poorly fueled wood fire (wet fuel +garbage).
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Old 10-02-2019, 08:48 AM   #69
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Lots of this bagged firewood is heated in klin to kill remains of bugs and meets the requirements of shipping. But if they baned campfires all together it would be ok fine with us. Your campfire just stinks up the area for the person camping down wind who might have allergic reactions to the smoke.
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Old 10-02-2019, 09:05 AM   #70
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Fracking for Propane aka LPG?
Fracking produces lots of Natural Gas. LPG is produced during refining Crude Oil which can come out of the ground through many different methods.
Yes, it's still a fossil fuel but when burned it produces far fewer pollutants than a poorly fueled wood fire (wet fuel +garbage).



Read up on the Marcellus Shale, Hardly any oil comes out of a Marcellus well, all Marcellus wells are fracked. LPG is also obtained from what is called "wet gas". In the Marcellus the wet gas is the jackpot. The wet gas is the reason why Shell is in the middle of building an Ethane Cracker plant in Western PA at a billion dollar + cost, and two others are in permitting. They pull the LPG out at the head end or mid stream.


A cut and paste...."Much growth in propane supply is expected to come from the Marcellus shale play in the northeastern U.S. Industry observers estimate the Marcellus shale alone can supply more than 2 billion gallons of propane per year."
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Old 10-02-2019, 09:22 AM   #71
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I don't know what I would do if I experienced all of that every time we go camping. Might quit camping I suppose. I've probably seen an instance of those specific things at one time or another, and I would suggest if you're getting all of that every time, you're going to the wrong places.
The majority of our camping is at State and National Parks. We're not camping in the "wrong" places. Other people are doing wrong things in otherwise great places.

The behaviors I listed are just a few examples of the multitude of things I've observed over my lifetime of camping. I did not indicate that ALL of these things happen during a single outing. But yes, every time we've gone camping, there has always been someone breaking the rules or being inconsiderate.

So, when we camp, we do our very best to be part of the solution, and not part of the problem. We abide by the rules and laws, we're always considerate of other campers, and we make sure our recreational activities NEVER impact wildlife, the environment, or other people in a negative way.
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Old 10-02-2019, 09:57 AM   #72
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I see we've again devolved into a battle with the inconsiderate campers discussion. Same as the dump station battle, or the noisy stereo, or the dog battle. The discussion is about rules that make sense. Hauling contaminated wood into areas spreads many pests to the forests, simple. I've watched the Colorado forest be destroyed by Spruce Budworm, and Pine Bark Beetles, etc. Roaring Fork loop at Granby Colorado used to be heavily wooded, now it's a wide open meadow and treeless. We all need to pay attention to save a resource we all want to use. Having the attitude that hauling contaminated wood around is OK is the same attitude people have when they throw their trash out the window, or pull the dump valve without a hose attached, or letting their dog poop by your trailer and not picking it up. Some people just don't care. We choose not to carry firewood, more because of the space, and the mess, and the smoke. That's our choice. Don't mind when others have a fire. I just hope they will follow the rules to help preserve our forests both in a time of fire ban, or in the spread of pests. Not that difficult to understand.
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Old 10-02-2019, 10:20 AM   #73
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Having the attitude that hauling contaminated wood around is OK is the same attitude people have when they throw their trash out the window, or pull the dump valve without a hose attached, or letting their dog poop by your trailer and not picking it up. Some people just don't care.

We choose not to carry firewood, more because of the space, and the mess, and the smoke. That's our choice. Don't mind when others have a fire. I just hope they will follow the rules to help preserve our forests both in a time of fire ban, or in the spread of pests. Not that difficult to understand.
Great post
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Old 10-02-2019, 10:41 AM   #74
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This thread is being closed as it has run its course and has deviated into unrelated topics. The general subject of protecting the planet has very passionate supporters on both sides of the discussion and the need to prevail disrupts the purpose of the forum.



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