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Old 10-01-2019, 06:29 AM   #1
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Firewood ó Why Do So Many Not Care?

I see it every time I go camping ó people bringing truckloads of firewood with them from all over the country. I am sure that most of these people know they shouldnít be doing this, but they just donít seem to care that they are endangering the forests/ecosystems everywhere they go.

There is no need for me to get into all of the different problems caused by transporting non-kiln-dried wood from place-to-place because everybody reading this should (and probably) already know.

Why do people do this?

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Old 10-01-2019, 06:32 AM   #2
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#1 - Cost of buying at/near the campground
#2 - Abundance at home
#3 - Live in same region/vicinity of campground
Take your pick.... there's bound to be more reasons than these quick 3.
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Old 10-01-2019, 06:38 AM   #3
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#1 - Cost of buying at/near the campground
#2 - Abundance at home
#3 - Live in same region/vicinity of campground
Take your pick.... there's bound to be more reasons than these quick 3.
#3 is the only acceptable excuse, depending on how local they are to the campground. Many places have restrictions on crossing county lines with wood.

If you canít afford to buy firewood at or near to the campground, you probably shouldnít plan on having a campfire.

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Old 10-01-2019, 06:41 AM   #4
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#1 - Cost of buying at/near the campground
#2 - Abundance at home
#3 - Live in same region/vicinity of campground
Take your pick.... there's bound to be more reasons than these quick 3.
A few years ago I did the math to put campground firewood cost into perspective and those small bags at $6/bag equated to $700 for a bush cord.

If the governments truly wanted to manage the problem, they would sell local wood at low prices to discourage campers from bring their own wood, but, oh no, they do the opposite.
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Old 10-01-2019, 06:45 AM   #5
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If the governments truly wanted to manage the problem, they would sell local wood at low prices to discourage campers from bring their own wood, but, oh no, they do the opposite.
You canít be serious. You really canít be. Do you feel no personal responsibility with regard to this issue?

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Old 10-01-2019, 06:53 AM   #6
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Even when we are local we still buy at the park because it supports the park. Typically state parks get to keep funds they earn from firewood sales and in my area they cut their own in the slow season during trail clearing or other projects. Also, since we have a motorhome we don't have a great way to transport it.
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Old 10-01-2019, 06:53 AM   #7
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equated to $700 for a bush cord.
I just have to ask, what the heck is a bush cord??? Been burning wood at home for 20 years, and know what a cord is, or a face cord, but bush cord no idea.

In light of this growing problem Nomad is speaking of, man I'm glad I got a propane fire pit. 3 nights of long campfires on one 20 dollar propane tank, no sparks and embers or smoke, right outside my awning so I can sit under awning next to fire, and a twist of a knob when you're ready to turn in and no worries.
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Old 10-01-2019, 06:53 AM   #8
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Where I work, there is evidence of what can happen when invasive bugs are brought into an area. The area I work is kind of a large industrial complex with businesses of all types for several square miles. This spring the Pine Beetle somehow made it's way into this area and by early summer every Pine tree in the entire area was killed off. Some were young trees but many were well established. There is not a single Pine tree left in the area as of today. Probably a hundred or more trees were killed just this year.
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Old 10-01-2019, 06:55 AM   #9
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A few years ago I did the math to put campground firewood cost into perspective and those small bags at $6/bag equated to $700 for a bush cord.

If the governments truly wanted to manage the problem, they would sell local wood at low prices to discourage campers from bring their own wood, but, oh no, they do the opposite.

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Old 10-01-2019, 06:59 AM   #10
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You canít be serious. You really canít be. Do you feel no personal responsibility with regard to this issue?

Bruce
No... not really. Last weekend I dropped a cherry and an oak that was marked as dead along the pasture on my 15 acres. My trees typically die due to black ants hollowing out the bottoms. A number of years back we got hit like most in Western Pa and lost all of the ash trees, I burn those here in a private "Beer Camp" that I have on the property. I still have a couple cords of that stuff stacked on fiber pallets out in the woods.

I dropped the cherry/oak trees specifically to load into the truck bed and haul to the 4 night camp site we were going to. At $6 per little bundle at a typical camp park, I would have needed around $50 a night to feed our fire/drinking period that starts at around 7PM and goes to around 1AM. So it cost me $.25 in 2 stroke gas versus $200 in extortion rate wood rates at a camp site. And I own an unlimited supply of wood.... and a chain saw.... and a splitter.... and a truck.

It just doesn't make sense that I should not use my own wood and equipment.
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Old 10-01-2019, 07:04 AM   #11
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A few years ago I did the math to put campground firewood cost into perspective and those small bags at $6/bag equated to $700 for a bush cord.

If the governments truly wanted to manage the problem, they would sell local wood at low prices to discourage campers from bring their own wood, but, oh no, they do the opposite.
Not in Ontario.

The entire province is impacted by Emerald Ash Borer. Provincial Parks are no longer asking if you brought your own firewood. don't get me wrong, I generally camp 4 hours from home if I was going any further I would source local wood within the park area.
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Old 10-01-2019, 07:05 AM   #12
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...If the governments truly wanted to manage the problem, they would sell local wood at low prices to discourage campers from bring their own wood, but, oh no, they do the opposite...
Well perhaps things are different in Canada, but in the US, the government doesn't either sell or set the price of firewood. In virtually all areas, including Canada, it is illegal to transport undried firewood more than 50 miles and never across the US/CA border...in either direction! Government is not the answer to everything, in fact not the answer to much. In general, environmental restrictions add to the cost of anything but generally are accompanied by a cost/benefit. Dried firewood can be freely transported but the drying process adds significant cost.
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Old 10-01-2019, 07:05 AM   #13
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You canít be serious. You really canít be. Do you feel no personal responsibility with regard to this issue?

Bruce
OooopsÖ.meant to quote Bruce's response.
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Old 10-01-2019, 07:06 AM   #14
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Bush cord is defined here...

"I just have to ask, what the heck is a bush cord??? Been burning wood at home for 20 years, and know what a cord is, or a face cord, but bush cord no idea."




https://www.thespruce.com/firewood-cord-storage-1907998


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Old 10-01-2019, 07:15 AM   #15
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I just have to ask, what the heck is a bush cord??? Been burning wood at home for 20 years, and know what a cord is, or a face cord, but bush cord no idea.

In light of this growing problem Nomad is speaking of, man I'm glad I got a propane fire pit. 3 nights of long campfires on one 20 dollar propane tank, no sparks and embers or smoke, right outside my awning so I can sit under awning next to fire, and a twist of a knob when you're ready to turn in and no worries.
A full cord.
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Old 10-01-2019, 08:08 AM   #16
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There are sawmills, mom and pop operations, all over the US that move timber and processed product across state lines daily. All they have is a USDA permit, anyone can get one. It's nothing more than a piece of paper. I can assure you from being associated with this industry, not much thought is put into any inspections for invasive pets, and they may be cutting timber 150 miles from the mill or further.


A by product at most of those sawmills is cut and split firewood or slab wood. A few operators kiln dry it to supply that market, but most don't. A few hundred bucks will get you a 10 T dump truck heaping full, 4-5 full cords. They'll bring it to wherever you're located. Take a look at all the vendors on your local Craigslist.



These quarantines that started for the most part with the Emerald Ash borer @ 2002, had little to do with moving firewood if moving forewood had anything to do with it at all, but that's the easy reason for government to blame and keeps the folks at dontmovefirewood.org employed. Do you really think folks moving Firewood moved a pest from where it was originally found in Detroit, to 35 other states in less than 20 years? Are you aware an Emerald Ash borer has wings and can fly?







Interestingly the new en vogue pest is the spotted lanternfly. Here is actual text of the quarantine guidelines in PA. Do you really believe anyone is doing all this? Sticking to the quarantine you can not move your RV from a quarantined county to a non quarantined one, or even your car or truck. So before you cross from Lancaster County to York County, Inspect every square inch, nook and cranny, of your pickup. Carry a creeper. I supposed you would also need a cutting torch because they're are thousands of areas on a vehicle these pests can hide that you don't have access to.





"The quarantine restricts the movement of certain articles. Industries and regulated articles under the quarantine that are not to be removed/moved to a new area are:
  • Any living stage of the Spotted Lanternfly, Lycorma delicatula, including egg masses, nymphs, and adults
  • Brush, debris, bark, or yard waste
  • Landscaping, remodeling or construction waste
  • Logs, stumps, or any tree parts
  • Firewood of any species
  • Grapevines for decorative purposes or as nursery stock
  • Nursery stock
  • Crated materials
  • Outdoor household articles including recreational vehicles, lawn tractors and mowers, mower decks, grills, grill and furniture covers, tarps, mobile homes, tile, stone, deck boards, mobile fire pits, any associated equipment and trucks or vehicles not stored indoors"


The solution is not to ban moving firewood. The solution is to shut down the entire North American Forest Products Industry which is valued in the billions of dollars.


The bottom line is these rules and quarantines are nothing more than a government feel good measure that does nothing to address anything.
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Old 10-01-2019, 08:36 AM   #17
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The problem I often run into is that there is no firewood available in or near the state parks that I go to.
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Old 10-01-2019, 08:49 AM   #18
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What makes me laugh are the campgrounds that won't let you bring in any outside wood yet will sell you wood for $5-$6 a small bundle that is harvested in an area that emerald ash borer has been identified as a problem meaning the wood they are selling isn't kiln dried or anything and that ok. What a joke.
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Old 10-01-2019, 09:04 AM   #19
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What makes me laugh are the campgrounds that won't let you bring in any outside wood yet will sell you wood for $5-$6 a small bundle that is harvested in an area that emerald ash borer has been identified as a problem meaning the wood they are selling isn't kiln dried or anything and that ok. What a joke.
What I hate is paying so much for such a small amount of wood. Usually it is not enough to even get a good fire going for only a few minutes. Most wood they sell is small in nature. Not against banning the hauling of wood but please put some good "back burners" in the bundles you sell us.
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Old 10-01-2019, 09:15 AM   #20
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What I hate is paying so much for such a small amount of wood. Usually it is not enough to even get a good fire going for only a few minutes. Most wood they sell is small in nature. Not against banning the hauling of wood but please put some good "back burners" in the bundles you sell us.
Mike
Don't get me wrong I like Anchor Down Campground I think it's great...But you don't get much bang for the buck when it comes to buying their wood...I think this is like $6.00 and it doesn't burn very long This is more like kindling wood the pieces are so small LOL
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