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Old 10-27-2020, 08:57 AM   #81
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Originally Posted by DRM796 View Post
We have not been fortunate enough to make it out west yet so I want make sure I understand. It is illegal to have 5 cars behind you when traveling the posted speed limit. So you must pull over to allow them passed so they can go above the posted speed limit. If that is the case can someone give me the meaning of the signs with the big numbers posted on it?


It is not illegal to drive the posted speed limit with 5 or more cars behind you.
When towing it is required to allow vehicles to pass only when it is safe for you to do so.
The Ca drivers handbook states driving is a privilege not a right and anyone who has a license has agreed to safe and courteous driving. I choose to follow those guidelines regardless of others who donít. Law enforcement is not my job.
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Old 10-27-2020, 09:01 AM   #82
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Courtesy, and compassion while driving. A very novel concept. If you can safely pull over, do so. Pass it on. That guy you just let around may be the guy that has to be courteous to someone else down the road. It's not a competition. I have to say the same thing to the drivers that want to get around. If you're given the opportunity to pass, do it. Don't fart around, go. So many people are just inattentive drivers. I've given multiple openings for people to get around, and they just hang back there with their thumbs in their you know what's. Very often your opening is only so long, and that driver will just begin to pass when your lane is running out, causing a dangerous situation. If I'm on 4 lanes, it's their problem, but on 2 lane I try to find opportunities to let someone by. Many people just like to follow. Of course that makes it difficult for the guy behind him who wants to get around. The first guy will tailgate you, which doesn't leave an opening for the second guy to pass. He has to pass the first guy and you, which takes a long open stretch. Give them the opportunity, if they don't take it, well then it becomes their problem. I try to treat other drivers like I would want them to treat me if the situation were reversed. Pay attention, be safe.
Oh by the way, Texas drivers expect you to move over to the shoulder no matter what the speed. Most of their highways have a wider shoulder than usual. If you were to do that in Colorado, you'd be in the ditch.
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Old 10-27-2020, 09:05 AM   #83
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We've all seen events where a number of vehicles are following the leader as a group, even AK state troopers. Over time and distance it is recognized for what it is and is accepted for that. Not the same as the highway where the driver is holding up traffic. In most states those traveling the posted limit are not in violation if vehicles are behind them. An exception of course is the driver who can't safely drive as fast as others when terrain causes speed reduction, then resumes the limit as soon as things level out thus holding up traffic. Rather than maintaining his slower speed while letting traffic pass, or pulling to the first safe turnout he causes frustration that causes others to take risks that endanger all in the area. The first of the 4 "C's" of driving is courtesy, use it often. The others, concentration, control, and conservation are important also, but those are topics for different posts.
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Old 10-27-2020, 09:19 AM   #84
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Originally Posted by timfromma View Post
speed lim∑it

/ˈspēd ˌlimit/

noun
noun: speed limit; plural noun: speed limits


the maximum speed at which a vehicle may legally travel on a particular stretch of road.




If I am traveling the posted speed limit then I will not mover over to let anyone pass anymore than I would hold open the door for a bank robber.
I'm clear on the definition of what a speed limit is. Thanks. Do you need the definition of courteous, as it relates to driving behavior?

And making a comparison between someone driving over the speed limit and felonious bank robbery, I don't know what to say. Yes, both illegal. However, if you can't draw the distinction between the two...
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Old 10-27-2020, 09:21 AM   #85
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Interesting that you talk about a moral obligation to facilitate lawbreaking.
Don't confuse morality with legality. There is often overlap, but it is far from concrete.
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Old 10-27-2020, 09:28 AM   #86
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Courtesy, and compassion while driving. A very novel concept.
Not just novel but extremely scarce.

How about the situation where you are in a far RH lane on a freeway being a "good citizen". For over a mile there have been signs advising that your lane will end so you turn on your signal to move left and wait for a break. When one large enough for your truck and trailer shows up someone darts out from behind you and floors it so you can't move over. OR, the car that was matching speed with you floors it when they see your turn signal and blocks you from changing lanes.

Little to many of these people realize that when I run out of lane I'm coming over. Then they have a decision to make---------
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Old 10-27-2020, 09:29 AM   #87
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Posted speed limits are there for a reason. Theyíre not there for a suggestion. If Iím going to speed limit I donít pull over. Why should I? Iím going to maximal speed allowed by law if Iím going to slow for you when Iím doing the speed limit you find another route.
Try doing that in the #1 lane and see what happens.
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Old 10-27-2020, 09:36 AM   #88
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Do you need the definition of courteous, as it relates to driving behavior?

Apparently you do. Far more people are killed every year in motor vehicle accidents than bank robberies and speed plays a large part in a large amount of these. Be courteous and obey the speed limit, the loved ones life you save could be your own.
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Old 10-27-2020, 09:46 AM   #89
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Citation, please.

-- Chuck
Here you go, 21656 of the California Vehicle Code.

21656.
On a two-lane highway where passing is unsafe because of traffic in the opposite direction or other conditions, any vehicle proceeding upon the highway at a speed less than the normal speed of traffic moving in the same direction at that time, behind which five or more vehicles are formed in line, shall turn off the roadway at the nearest place designated as a turnout by signs erected by the authority having jurisdiction over the highway, or wherever sufficient area for a safe turnout exists, in order to permit the vehicles following it to proceed.

(Amended by Stats. 2015, Ch. 265, Sec. 1. (AB 208) Effective January 1, 2016.)
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Old 10-27-2020, 09:58 AM   #90
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In reading many of the posts I think people are failing recognize the difference between 2-lane highways, one lane in each direction, and 4 lane highways with two lanes in each directioin.

If one is driving in the RH lane on a 4 lane highway, and is doing at least the minimum speed (often 40 mph) then they should NOT have to pull over for anyone (except emergency vehicles).

2-lane highways come with backups and often few safe places to pull over or for others to pass. Just the nature of the beast.
This. Well stated.
The OP seems to ask about pulling over on both multi lane and two lane when traffic is backing up behind you.
On a multi lane (4+), I don't ever see a reason to pull off the road to allow faster traffic to go by. But the RV should never be in the far left lane except when passing.
On a two lane, I will pull over if I can do so safely. But on most two lanes I do go the speed limit, so no problem. Also most two lanes in mountainous areas have passing lanes on steep grades, so I will wait for those to get out of the way.
I will always be courteous to fellow drivers when towing, but I will not pull over where it might cause me to be in a dangerous situation to do so.
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Old 10-27-2020, 10:08 AM   #91
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Apparently you do. Far more people are killed every year in motor vehicle accidents than bank robberies and speed plays a large part in a large amount of these. Be courteous and obey the speed limit, the loved ones life you save could be your own.
So you think you're saving lives by creating moving roadblocks? Wow!

And how about we stop comparing bank robberies with speeding. It's sophomoric at best.
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Old 10-27-2020, 10:14 AM   #92
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This. Well stated.
The OP seems to ask about pulling over on both multi lane and two lane when traffic is backing up behind you.
On a multi lane (4+), I don't ever see a reason to pull off the road to allow faster traffic to go by. But the RV should never be in the far left lane except when passing.
On a two lane, I will pull over if I can do so safely. But on most two lanes I do go the speed limit, so no problem. Also most two lanes in mountainous areas have passing lanes on steep grades, so I will wait for those to get out of the way.
I will always be courteous to fellow drivers when towing, but I will not pull over where it might cause me to be in a dangerous situation to do so.
In California, towed vehicles are prohibited in the #1 lane if there are three or more lanes in the same direction.
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Old 10-27-2020, 10:15 AM   #93
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The Calif law shows up on signs all over. Thanks for posting a photo of it.
It is a good rule to live by. If you are not courteous and try to stay out of the way of other drivers, you are selfish and not a very good human being.
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Old 10-27-2020, 10:17 AM   #94
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The Calif law shows up on signs all over. Thanks for posting a photo of it.
It is a good rule to live by. If you are not courteous and try to stay out of the way of other drivers, you are selfish and not a very good human being.
post #89 has the actual law
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Old 10-27-2020, 04:52 PM   #95
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How does the trooper determine if the line of vehicles is not a caravan or a group traveling together?

Sounds like your saying it’s ok to break the law and speed but it’s not ok to have people behind you?

I’d love to see this in court where a RVer is accused of doing the speed limit and a trooper complaining that there were speeder behind the RV that needed to break the speed limit. Something is wrong in Alaska if this is true.
The citation will be for delaying five or more vehicles in violation of state law. If others speed, that's on them. But you have an legal responsibility to pull over once you have five vehicles behind you. Your going the speed limit is not a valid defense. The sign says "Delay of Five Vehicles Illegal Must Use Turnouts". There is nothing on the sign or in state law that says "Except those doing the speed limit".

Here is a link to the relevant statute...

http://www.akleg.gov/basis/statutes.asp#28.35.140
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Old 10-27-2020, 04:58 PM   #96
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The citation will be for delaying five or more vehicles in violation of state law. If others speed, that's on them. But you have an legal responsibility to pull over once you have five vehicles behind you. Your going the speed limit is not a valid defense. The sign says "Delay of Five Vehicles Illegal Must Use Turnouts". There is nothing on the sign or in state law that says "Except those doing the speed limit".
That law had to be written by a politician/lawyer, as it makes absolutely no sense if it indeed applies when going the speed limit
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Old 10-27-2020, 05:02 PM   #97
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The citation will be for delaying five or more vehicles in violation of state law. If others speed, that's on them. But you have an legal responsibility to pull over once you have five vehicles behind you. Your going the speed limit is not a valid defense. The sign says "Delay of Five Vehicles Illegal Must Use Turnouts". There is nothing on the sign or in state law that says "Except those doing the speed limit".


I know your wrong and the sign is wrong. If Iím doing the speed limit there is no reason or law telling me to pull over to allow speeders to pass.
The only way I could be delaying 5 vehicles is going under the speed limit so doing the speed limit is valid unless speeding is legal.
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Old 10-27-2020, 05:16 PM   #98
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I know your wrong and the sign is wrong. If Iím doing the speed limit there is no reason or law telling me to pull over to allow speeders to pass.
The only way I could be delaying 5 vehicles is going under the speed limit so doing the speed limit is valid unless speeding is legal.
You can tell it to the judge. But with our hilly and curvy roads there will be times when you will drop below the speed limit, conditions that wouldn't affect more nimble vehicles. Regardless, the statute doesn't provide an exception for those going the speed limit.
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Old 10-27-2020, 05:18 PM   #99
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That law had to be written by a politician/lawyer, as it makes absolutely no sense if it indeed applies when going the speed limit
Drive our roads in the summer and that law makes perfect sense.
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Old 10-27-2020, 05:51 PM   #100
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Something that you learn about Alaska (and YT and northern BC are very similar) from living there: other people are not your enemy, the environment is. Totally backwards from California (and most of the Lower 48). The only time I ever saw the holding up 5 car rule enforced was when a rental RV would not pull over in the designated spots. Alaskans (and our kin in YT and northern BC) know to look out for each other, for one day your life will depend on your fellow human being helping you. Which results in a lot of courtesy and grace to the other person, even if you don't particularly like them.

But when an arrogant Californian comes up to Alaska, with his thousands and thousands of dollars of special outdoor gear, and has no use for the advice of the local yokels, he usually finds in the 1st year that neither he nor his incredible gear is a match for Alaska. It's really tragic.

I had to do the hiring for our engineering group for 6 years. I finally learned it was worth the cost of 2 plane tickets, and several nights of hotels to bring the applicant and spouse to Alaska in December or January, and interview them over several days to see if they were really Alaska material. 90% of the Summer hires would be gone by the next Spring, despite their claiming otherwise in a phone interview, at a huge cost to everybody.

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