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02-03-2017, 06:10 PM
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#1
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Jefferson County, MO
Posts: 5,449
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RV Show Musings
I was at the St. Louis RV show today and once again didn’t find anything I liked as much or better than what I already own.
This year there seemed to be more trailers and fifth wheels than motorhomes at the show. There really weren’t many diesel pushers on display but there was a decent amount of Class C’s.
The retro style trailers seem to be getting more and more attention with a few more manufacturers getting on board and producing their own style. This Vintage is a product of Gulf Stream.
This Retro brand toyhauler trailer looks like it was made for Halloween. I hope it has good sidewall insulation because that black is going to heat up quite nicely in direct sunlight.
I saw a number of higher end brands with the new 4 step system that folds up into the trailer. I like how sturdy and stable they are but I’m not sold on the idea of storing steps inside the trailer.
This A-Liner had roof extensions that really made the unit look much larger. The price was over $22,000 for this unit. Nope not for me, it didn’t have a bathroom. Also without a bathroom the interest on the loan wouldn’t be deductible as a mortgage loan on a 2nd home.
What’s up with so many outside kitchens sitting so high off the ground? My 5 foot tall wife certainly can’t use them and even I wouldn’t find cooking on the stove comfortable. In the photo look how ridiculously high the microwave is.
Once again there was someone selling the self-contained composting toilet at the show. We’ve had this discussion already on the forum but I still say there is no way I’m going to carry a bucket of “compost poo” or the bucket of pee through my trailer. I’ll stick with my black and gray tanks.
At least three St. Louis area RV dealers didn’t have space at the show. I don’t know if there isn’t enough room for all the dealerships or they just don’t want to participate.
__________________
Bob and Joyce
2013 CC Silverback 29RL
2010 Ford F250 XL Crew Cab 6.4 liter diesel
ATU Local 788
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02-03-2017, 06:37 PM
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#2
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Canadian Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Eastern GTA, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 6,233
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The same thoughts occurred to me at the Toronto RV Show in January. We saw the Vintage and those MorRyde steps. Grand Design Reflection and Keystone Cougar are coming standard with the Torklift GlowSteps now. The MorRyde steps are solid but like you I don't like the idea of them put dirt and water inside when you fold them up.
__________________
2023 Rockwood Signature 8262RBS
2016 Ford F-250 XLT SuperCrew, 6.2L, 4x4, 6'9" bed
2019 Rockwood Signature 8290BS (2019 - 2022)
2011 Rockwood Signature 8293SS (2015 - 2018)
2010 Rockwood Roo 23SS (2012 - 2014)
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02-03-2017, 06:41 PM
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#3
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Lexington, NC
Posts: 2,621
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Interesting info and pix. Thank you.
__________________
2018 Coachmen Apex 249 RBS
2010 Silverado LT 5.3 V8
The world is a great book, of which those who never stir from home
read only a page. - St. Augustine
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02-03-2017, 06:44 PM
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#4
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Site Team
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: top side land of Lincoln
Posts: 7,509
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Okay the microwave is one thing, but not being able to reach in the fridge for a cold one.
Next
__________________
2014 LaCrosse 323RST-TE-C
2009 Chevy 2500HD Z71
Seasonal
Zelda the campin dog
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02-03-2017, 06:58 PM
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#5
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Broken Toe
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Imperial (St. Louis) MO
Posts: 3,745
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We were there too. Those stairs created an instant "we gotta get that" from the wife. I've already been online and it looks like about $300 for the stairs with an easy 20-minute install. I really don't have a problem with how they stow. I'll just sweep or clean the off before stowing them. Not an issue. Probably the only complaint is gonna be when I make my quick check at fuel stops, I never deploy the steps, I just hop in and out. That's not gonna work with these. Gotta make a few measurements, but I'll get some on order in the next couple of days.
MamaBear and I both notice that the displays seemed biased towards the more affordable than the mega-mansions, and thats a big change from former years. I saw many, many sub $25K units. Not much new under the sun in that price range, but its nice knowing that they are courting the younger, family types.
Other observations:
I saw a couple units with the Lippert ground control auto-leveler for TT's I was not impressed by the stability of them. Seemed to be a LOT of rocking when people walk around in them. IMHO, on par with standard scissor jacks (I.E. tons)
We were wearing our FROG shirts today. Got quite a few questions about doing FROG events. I think we might have made a few converts to try doing rallies. We also got a very snotty and sarcastic sounding "Nice Shirts" from a rep for a SOB. Stay Classy Keystone. Stay classy.
On the whole, I think RV manufactures and dealer have finally come to earth on pricing. Even the 5ver Mega-mansions were $20-$30k cheaper than they seemed a few years ago. I remember seeing a bunch of $85K 5vers even 2 or so years ago. Now I think $70 was about the highest I saw. The only ones that seemed high were the mid-to-upper end TTs. The lower end TT's seemed reasonable, but the prices seemed to go up disproportionately as they got "nicer".
On the same vein... Airstream have lost their freaking minds with the "basecamp" model. $40+K for a dinette, a wet toilet and a 2 burner stove? and that was WITHOUT A/C, microwave or any kind of awning? Surely they are smoking dope in outer space with that thing.
I'm rapidly getting tired of the non-rv vendors in the booths. Verizon? Home Siding company? I had fun with the guy trying to do his "Free weekend trip to Table Rock Lake" spiel. I literally told him "dude, I just dropped $33 grand on an RV. What makes you think I would be in even the slightest way interested in buying a time share? There was also someone selling Sentsy, kitchen cookware and otherwise use and non-relevant crap. Except for the guy selling the dips. As long as he has free samples, he's OK.
Final Observation. Friday was DEFINITELY the day to go. Light Crowds, plenty of time to talk to the reps, and no out-of-contol kids treating the RV's like a McDonald's play place.
Tim
On edit: Flagstaff had a really nice highwall A-frame that had all the bells and whistles (Including power lift for the roof) for $14k. It was surprisingly roomy and comfortable inside. A nice compromise between a pop-up and an Hi-lo.
__________________
FROG Member MO-0008-571 Since 20124444444444My Project Blog: https://cowracer.blogspot.com/
"Camper" 2016 Rockwood Signature Ultralite 8329ss
"Casper" 2017 Ram 2500 Laramie Diesel
..ProPride 3P Hitch - "Yeah. It's worth it."
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02-03-2017, 07:09 PM
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#6
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Farmer
Posts: 4,988
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The old song " WHOO'OH BLACK BETTY" By RAM JAM would be what I'd be singing in the HOT BLAZING SUN in that black Halloween model[emoji28]
__________________
2016 Coachmen Apex 250RLS Ultra Light 2023 Ram 2500 Big Horn Sport 3.73
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02-03-2017, 07:29 PM
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#7
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Farmer
Posts: 4,988
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tapex
The old song " WHOO'OH BLACK BETTY" By RAM JAM would be what I'd be singing in the HOT BLAZING SUN in that black Halloween model[emoji28]
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Wife said targeting Harley owners
__________________
2016 Coachmen Apex 250RLS Ultra Light 2023 Ram 2500 Big Horn Sport 3.73
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02-03-2017, 07:35 PM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 2,270
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oakman
Once again there was someone selling the self-contained composting toilet at the show. We’ve had this discussion already on the forum but I still say there is no way I’m going to carry a bucket of “compost poo” or the bucket of pee through my trailer. I’ll stick with my black and gray tanks.
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Don't be so quick to discount the absolute joy and satisfaction of carrying a bucket of poop through your trailer. LOL
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02-03-2017, 09:15 PM
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#9
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Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Sooke, BC, Canada
Posts: 94
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I'm with you Cowracer. Definitely would not be a deal breaker to have to potentially sweep or wipe down the stairs quickly when stowing.
Aside from them being much more sturdy and stable one other benefit to them is the ability to have doors over the axles.
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02-04-2017, 07:13 AM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Jefferson County, MO
Posts: 5,449
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cowracer
Other observations:
On the same vein... Airstream have lost their freaking minds with the "basecamp" model. $40+K for a dinette, a wet toilet and a 2 burner stove? and that was WITHOUT A/C, microwave or any kind of awning? Surely they are smoking dope in outer space with that thing.
Tim
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I can't believe I forgot to mention and post a photo of the Airstream Base Camp. I would buy a R-Pod or teardrop trailer before I laid out $40,000 for this little bitty thing. On the plus side a sign did say it came with a lifetime warranty.
__________________
Bob and Joyce
2013 CC Silverback 29RL
2010 Ford F250 XL Crew Cab 6.4 liter diesel
ATU Local 788
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02-04-2017, 05:19 PM
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#11
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Broken Arrow, OK
Posts: 354
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Has anyone seen the 2017 Riverside 32 LOFT? It has a basement game room. Love the layout but seeing it in person we couldn' t believe it was a bumper pull. Sat really low on the tires and basement room while cool probably would not work for teenager, but wow it was different!
__________________
Pam & Don
2003 Ford Expedition EB
2011 Rockwood 2304s
108 days camped 2013
74 days camped 2014 so far
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02-04-2017, 05:30 PM
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#12
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Idaho
Posts: 9,839
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oakman
I can't believe I forgot to mention and post a photo of the Airstream Base Camp. I would buy a R-Pod or teardrop trailer before I laid out $40,000 for this little bitty thing. On the plus side a sign did say it came with a lifetime warranty.
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I saw one of those on a semi flatbed trailer in Boise Monday afternoon, not bad looking, I'd be worried about tongue weight.....
__________________
2016 F350 6.7L LB CC Reese 28K 2014 Chaparral Lite 266sab
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." 2014 19 days camping 2015 17 days camping201620 days camping
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02-04-2017, 05:55 PM
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#13
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Pearl River, Louisiana
Posts: 842
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cowracer
We were there too. Those stairs created an instant "we gotta get that" from the wife. I've already been online and it looks like about $300 for the stairs with an easy 20-minute install. I really don't have a problem with how they stow. I'll just sweep or clean the off before stowing them. Not an issue. Probably the only complaint is gonna be when I make my quick check at fuel stops, I never deploy the steps, I just hop in and out. That's not gonna work with these. Gotta make a few measurements, but I'll get some on order in the next couple of days.
MamaBear and I both notice that the displays seemed biased towards the more affordable than the mega-mansions, and thats a big change from former years. I saw many, many sub $25K units. Not much new under the sun in that price range, but its nice knowing that they are courting the younger, family types.
Other observations:
I saw a couple units with the Lippert ground control auto-leveler for TT's I was not impressed by the stability of them. Seemed to be a LOT of rocking when people walk around in them. IMHO, on par with standard scissor jacks (I.E. tons)
We were wearing our FROG shirts today. Got quite a few questions about doing FROG events. I think we might have made a few converts to try doing rallies. We also got a very snotty and sarcastic sounding "Nice Shirts" from a rep for a SOB. Stay Classy Keystone. Stay classy.
On the whole, I think RV manufactures and dealer have finally come to earth on pricing. Even the 5ver Mega-mansions were $20-$30k cheaper than they seemed a few years ago. I remember seeing a bunch of $85K 5vers even 2 or so years ago. Now I think $70 was about the highest I saw. The only ones that seemed high were the mid-to-upper end TTs. The lower end TT's seemed reasonable, but the prices seemed to go up disproportionately as they got "nicer".
On the same vein... Airstream have lost their freaking minds with the "basecamp" model. $40+K for a dinette, a wet toilet and a 2 burner stove? and that was WITHOUT A/C, microwave or any kind of awning? Surely they are smoking dope in outer space with that thing.
I'm rapidly getting tired of the non-rv vendors in the booths. Verizon? Home Siding company? I had fun with the guy trying to do his "Free weekend trip to Table Rock Lake" spiel. I literally told him "dude, I just dropped $33 grand on an RV. What makes you think I would be in even the slightest way interested in buying a time share? There was also someone selling Sentsy, kitchen cookware and otherwise use and non-relevant crap. Except for the guy selling the dips. As long as he has free samples, he's OK.
Final Observation. Friday was DEFINITELY the day to go. Light Crowds, plenty of time to talk to the reps, and no out-of-contol kids treating the RV's like a McDonald's play place.
Tim
On edit: Flagstaff had a really nice highwall A-frame that had all the bells and whistles (Including power lift for the roof) for $14k. It was surprisingly roomy and comfortable inside. A nice compromise between a pop-up and an Hi-lo.
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Lol! The Keystone guy wasn't being snotty, that was just his jealousy showing through!! How many people did you see with "Keystone" group shirts on??? Exactly........ jealousy!!
__________________
Karen and Rick
2020 Forester 2251SLE
Previous: 2018 Berkshire XL 40C
2011 Honda CR-V toad
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02-04-2017, 06:03 PM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Pearl River, Louisiana
Posts: 842
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oakman
I can't believe I forgot to mention and post a photo of the Airstream Base Camp. I would buy a R-Pod or teardrop trailer before I laid out $40,000 for this little bitty thing. On the plus side a sign did say it came with a lifetime warranty.
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Yeah, I don't know what's in that "Airstream Kool-Aid" but I know I wouldn't want any!
__________________
Karen and Rick
2020 Forester 2251SLE
Previous: 2018 Berkshire XL 40C
2011 Honda CR-V toad
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02-04-2017, 06:42 PM
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#15
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Somewhere in the Ozarks...
Posts: 1,137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Havercamp
Don't be so quick to discount the absolute joy and satisfaction of carrying a bucket of poop through your trailer. LOL
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The funny thing is, Mr. Havercamp- I think you might be serious...
Kidding! Just kidding!
__________________
2015 Forest River Rockwood Signature Series Ultra Lite 8289WS w/Diamond pkg.
2014 RAM CTD 6.7 Tradesman 4WD Auto Crew Cab Long Bed
Honda eu2200i generators
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02-04-2017, 09:50 PM
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#16
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Lexington, NC
Posts: 2,621
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This thread is a great finger on the pulse of the RV industry for those of us who haven't made it to the shows.
Thanks for the very comprehensive info and pix.
__________________
2018 Coachmen Apex 249 RBS
2010 Silverado LT 5.3 V8
The world is a great book, of which those who never stir from home
read only a page. - St. Augustine
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02-04-2017, 10:24 PM
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#17
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 5,037
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oakman
I can't believe I forgot to mention and post a photo of the Airstream Base Camp. I would buy a R-Pod or teardrop trailer before I laid out $40,000 for this little bitty thing. On the plus side a sign did say it came with a lifetime warranty.
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Lifetime warranty or not, to me, that looks like an awful skin job. All those dimples in the stainless! Are they making them in China and importing?
__________________
Al
I am starting to think, that I will never be old enough--------to know better.
Tolerance will reach such a level that intelligent people will be banned from thinking so as not to offend the imbeciles. Fyodor Mikhailovich Dostoevsky, Russian Novelist
S.E. Mich. Flagstaff 26FKWS / 2022 F-150 3.5 EcoBoost SCrew Propride
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02-04-2017, 10:57 PM
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#18
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Left Coast
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: vancouver,washington
Posts: 15,649
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Quote:
Originally Posted by itat
The same thoughts occurred to me at the Toronto RV Show in January. We saw the Vintage and those MorRyde steps. Grand Design Reflection and Keystone Cougar are coming standard with the Torklift GlowSteps now. The MorRyde steps are solid but like you I don't like the idea of them put dirt and water inside when you fold them up.
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Got a set of the Torklift steps coming.....OC has a set and I tested them while visiting in Florida a couple weeks ago.....very sturdy and the steps adjust to 3 different heights, as do the ground support feet( they might adjust to 4....the support feet).....All alum. with bolts (no rivets)with teflon in between moveable areas....This will be the first Rockwood with them, so they're being custom made
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