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Old 01-31-2022, 10:10 PM   #41
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Only East Coast cars run on that. Our west coast electrics run on Hydro Power.
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Old 01-31-2022, 10:21 PM   #42
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Only East Coast cars run on that. Our west coast electrics run on Hydro Power.
Almost... although small (63 MW) California still has one and Washington has one as well.
I think the majority in Ca are run off the gas produced from political BS.
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Old 01-31-2022, 10:34 PM   #43
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Some of the posters here are dreaming of Unicorn Farts!
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Old 01-31-2022, 10:42 PM   #44
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Only East Coast cars run on that. Our west coast electrics run on Hydro Power.
California

https://www.electricrate.com/wp-cont...california.png

Nope. Not even close. California is doing good but costly. In fact however, without dinosaur farts you'd be in the dark.
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Old 01-31-2022, 11:15 PM   #45
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For you non engineers waiting for the solution.

There are sort of two electrical problems for engineers. Been working on them since the 1800’s.

One is electrical transmission. Wires are inefficient. No solution in site! Mucho line loss!

Another is electrical storage.

Today most batteries were designed before 1900. Lithium is better. Lithium is likely not a solution. Heating a house up north would take a lot of $10,000 batteries. With, no way to charge them.

The way we are headed, our electric bills will triple at best.

However, I am 72. This likely is not my problem!

Hope I am wrong.
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Old 01-31-2022, 11:36 PM   #46
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Only East Coast cars run on that. Our west coast electrics run on Hydro Power.
You are only partially correct:

https://www.eia.gov/state/?sid=WA#tabs-1
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Old 01-31-2022, 11:40 PM   #47
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You are only partially correct:

https://www.eia.gov/state/?sid=WA#tabs-1
Even in Washington State they would be in the dark without good ole dinosaur farts.
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Old 02-01-2022, 11:38 AM   #48
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You know I do fine this funny in a sad way. With most of the west coast states having lost all common sense when it comes to consumer needs/goods. As an example, Calf wants you to go to all electrical power for your needs. But the CALF infrastructure will not support this requirement so, what does the state government do? Mandate rolling blackouts in high power consumption usage.

There is also a proposal and or new law in Calf. banning all gas/propane grills do to the out-put of particulates when grilling. It is also being considered to ban all campfires in the future for several reason.

For all of you who have stated that the west coast states use HYDRO-Power. What happens when the electrical generating dams are being removed so, fish can migrate up the river? Such as this article has stated to happen by 2023. Where are you going to get the electrical energy for your needs?

https://www.weatherbug.com/news/West...p-Water-Debate

I am just asking where is the commonsense these days.
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Old 02-01-2022, 12:42 PM   #49
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You know I do fine this funny in a sad way. With most of the west coast states having lost all common sense when it comes to consumer needs/goods. As an example, Calf wants you to go to all electrical power for your needs. But the CALF infrastructure will not support this requirement so, what does the state government do? Mandate rolling blackouts in high power consumption usage.

There is also a proposal and or new law in Calf. banning all gas/propane grills do to the out-put of particulates when grilling. It is also being considered to ban all campfires in the future for several reason.

For all of you who have stated that the west coast states use HYDRO-Power. What happens when the electrical generating dams are being removed so, fish can migrate up the river? Such as this article has stated to happen by 2023. Where are you going to get the electrical energy for your needs?

https://www.weatherbug.com/news/West...p-Water-Debate

I am just asking where is the commonsense these days.
This is kind of along the same lines as the Hoover dam creating large reservoirs of water for use in the west. Now with great expansion over time the depletion on the reservoirs looks to be caused by said expansion.
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Old 02-01-2022, 01:50 PM   #50
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This is kind of along the same lines as the Hoover dam creating large reservoirs of water for use in the west. Now with great expansion over time the depletion on the reservoirs looks to be caused by said expansion.
X2. The water level at Lake Mead is not looking good as of a month ago. It's been dropping for the last two years.

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Old 02-01-2022, 02:38 PM   #51
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X2. The water level at Lake Mead is not looking good as of a month ago. It's been dropping for the last two years.



Day before yesterday I drove over " Shasta Lake" (lakehead area) and now it's just a river, or more like a creek". Lake is now pretty much empty with a huge bathtub ring around it to remind us how little water remains.
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Old 02-03-2022, 07:35 PM   #52
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Here in the capitol of California, all our large municipal vehicles; busses, garbage trucks, utility trucks have been switched over to natural gas. Now I know that in 12 years everything new here is supposed to be electric, but how are those items going to be charged? We can't even keep the power on when the wind blows!
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Old 02-03-2022, 07:58 PM   #53
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I'm confused.......... we were closing coal fired power plants and shipping our coal overseas......... so foreign countries can burn coal,,,,,,,,, then we are opening new natural gas electric power plants..........

UPS tractor trailers now are fueled by natural gas. to not use diesel .......... at least in the mid Atlantic................

How does any of it help .............. anything


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Old 02-03-2022, 08:01 PM   #54
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Since burning propane doesn't produce methane like natural gas does, a ban on propane appliances wouldn't make much sense.

They seem to be concerned about the level of methane in houses from natural gas stoves, but I'm not sure I buy that.

Natural gas does not produce methane, methane is contained in natural gas. When natural gas is processed, propane, methane and ethane are removed. Ethane is used in the production of certain plastics.

Methane is used as fuel and produces less hydrocarbons than natural gas or propane.


"Methane provides a great environmental benefit , producing more heat and light energy by mass than other hydrocarbon, or fossil fuel, including coal and gasoline refined from oil, while producing significantly less carbon dioxide and other pollutants that contribute to smog and unhealthy air."
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Old 02-03-2022, 08:50 PM   #55
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I must be doing something wrong

Our electricity costs us about $75 a month and we fill our propane tank (500gal) once a year around $1000-/+.
Our house that we(me and some helpers)just built last year uses radiant heat in the floor(concrete slab) and in the ceiling/upstairs floor). We have 10 3’x5’ windows that take the abundant New Mexico sunshine and convert it to warmth on even the coldest days.

The heat system also provides domestic hot water on demand.
I bitched about the county and what I thought were stupidly invasive rules about how I was to build but I have to say now it was worth the small extra costs and aggravation.

Building with minimum 2x6, with the 2” foam we put on the outside and R21 in the walls behind Hardy Plank siding and R38 in the roof and in the second floor floor.

All of our lights are LED and I can run everything in the place with a 5000watt back up generator. Our three biggest draws are as always the fridge, the dryer and the well pump.

I guess my point is last centuries building methods and power generating methods will with time catch up. It WILL cost to make changes but those changes will, if my house is any indication, be worth the effort.
The hardest part will be convincing the naysayers that it can work.
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Old 02-03-2022, 08:52 PM   #56
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Re last post

I realize none of this has ANYTHING to do with campers. I was just running off a the keyboard.
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Old 02-03-2022, 08:54 PM   #57
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THIS “NEWS” IS FAKE !!! There is NO BAN on Natural Gas or Natural Gas Appliances. I just bought a new house in a new construction community that runs almost everything on Natural Gas, and the houses and appliances are in such demand that it takes MONTHS to get them. No “ban” in sight!!!!
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Old 02-03-2022, 08:57 PM   #58
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Ya I figured it was just more fear mongering.
There is so much crap out there it’s hard to know what to believe.
I think some of these people know it’s crap but they sooooo want to believe it.
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Old 02-03-2022, 09:21 PM   #59
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Oh man ! I hope I live long enough to see how them idiots are gonna electrically heat all the homes in the frigid areas that stay below 32*F or even below 0 for months ! Will it be windmills, solar arrays, or coal fired steam stations !!!

seems to work out all right in Quebec, where electric is the most popular heat source. And some places are near the Arctic circle. They are blessed with a Large amount of Hydroelectric Power. In fact Hydro Quebec sells a lot of Power to the northern states.


Just to clarify, Natural Gas IS methane. it gives off CO2 and Carbon Monoxide when used. I belive that it is seen as a "Transitional Fuel"


and yes, Living in Ontario where 50% of our power is atomic, I agree that we need to get over the squemishness about atomic Power and build more.
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Old 02-03-2022, 11:24 PM   #60
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I fly an ambulance, a flying icu really, for a job. When I fly through 18,000 ft, I always marvel at the fact that half of the atmosphere is below me, half above me. It’s not that high. In fact, if you were to model the atmosphere on an average globe, you could do it with saran wrap.

I don’t know if there is a solution at all, at times it is hard not to think we are (as a race, the human race) doomed. Flying over major metropolitan areas, thats a lot of power bills.
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