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Old 06-06-2015, 06:36 AM   #21
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I've owned a Honda 3000 and now have an Onan Juice Box 4000 w, which I'm selling. I also have 2-2000 watt Hondas. One is the companion model. There is quite a weight difference between the 3000 and 2000 Hondas. Also the 3000's shape makes it a bit difficult to grab onto and lift. I managed to get it onto the tailgate of the truck but that was a few years ago when I was younger and stronger than now. I can grab each 2000 Honda by the handles and carry them both at the same time. I have the external 5 gallon tank and they run forever. We boondock most of the time and they are set up behind the 5er with a tarp strung up over them and they aren't that loud. My Onan when used is plugged into the trailer hitch at the back of the 5er and the TV is at the back of the 5er and we didn't have to turn it up to WOW to hear it. The Hondas are secured by a couple of long cables through the handles and around a fair size tree. I did buy the adapters for the handles to make it more difficult to steal. My two sons and my daughter have 3000 w Hondas for their trailers, but they're young and can manage to lift them with the help of their spouses. Now I have a dually, long box and they go in the box with covers over them for weather. I went from electric start, to remote start and stop and now to pull start. It's always fun making these decisions......
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Old 06-06-2015, 08:51 PM   #22
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Nice thought about the 3000 being heavy, thus harder to steal. Last summer we heard a noise that scared a thief away. In the morning we found a 2000 hiked up to the edge of the bed and my buddy's REALLY EXPENSIVE brand name security had been cut half through. 2000 too easy to carry away
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Old 06-06-2015, 10:19 PM   #23
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The starting point for battery charging should be how much can the BATTERIES take.
20% of capacity per hour for the first 80% and the same four hours for the next 15%...the final 5% can take hours.
So a 100 amp hour battery will take 4 hours to get from 0 to 80% and 8 hours to get to 95%. REGARDLESS OF HOW BIG A GENERATOR OR CHARGER YOU USE as long as both are capable of 20% of amphour output.
Batteries should never be discharged below 50% which is 12.2 volts static. NOT IN USE,
Those who claim to recharge in an hour or two, do indeed partially recharge while they are murdering their batteries.

I further note that the Yamaha 2000 has an 8 amp output for charging and the Honda 2000 has exactly the same. Neither are smart chargers. They will both take a VERY long time to charge your batteries directly and they will not treat them well. Both are GREAT gennies and should be used to drive the standard coach/trailer charger which is generally a 55 amp smart charger these days.
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Old 06-08-2015, 08:47 AM   #24
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My Champion gen doesn't have a 12v charger included. I use a small 12v battery charger I use for my boat. Charges faster, low cost at Walley World or Bass Pro shops. This way I can charge batteries if I have 120v but not the gen.
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Old 06-08-2015, 12:56 PM   #25
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Anyone have any comments on Powerhouse generators? They have what I'm looking for a real good price.
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Old 06-08-2015, 01:46 PM   #26
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My son in law had a powerhouse with remote start. It didn`t last two seasons. Bought it from COSTCO. Returned it and now has a Honda 3000. No remote but he likes it a lot better.
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Old 06-09-2015, 04:45 PM   #27
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if your using the 12 volt recharge from the honda to the battery.. it will take forever ..
if you plug your honda to your trailer ... a good 3-5 hours ...
oh .. sorry to say this .. but you need a new battery in 2 years .. they have to be taken care of ... not drained completely ... and recharged ..

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Old 06-10-2015, 09:19 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by D-mo View Post
if your using the 12 volt recharge from the honda to the battery.. it will take forever ..
if you plug your honda to your trailer ... a good 3-5 hours ...
oh .. sorry to say this .. but you need a new battery in 2 years .. they have to be taken care of ... not drained completely ... and recharged ..

d-mo--mo
Deep cycle batteries are designed to be discharged and charged. I had one I used on an electric motor for a boat and was constantly taking it all the way down and then recharging it. I replaced it after four years but it was still operating and I kept it for a spare.

If you're using a deep cycle battery in your trailer I would imagine it would be the same way and I would expect to get four years or longer. Of course if you using an automotive battery it is not going to hold up.

What id the charge rate from the trailer converter? 10 to 12 amps? The 12 volt on my EU3000i is 12 amps but you can't use the eco or have any 120 volt plugged in to get that. Turn the eco switch on and the 12 volt amperage drops to about 4 amps, even with no 120 usage.

One very important caution, the 12 volt is not regulated so you could cook your battery if not careful! I personally will not use the 12volts. Safer to carry a cheap 120 volt charger to charge a spare batter and not have to worry. Of course your trailer converter is the best bet.

Jim
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Old 06-10-2015, 09:37 AM   #29
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Don't know? The places I like to camp at have limited number of serviced sites so will dry camp. I would like to run the furnace at night and recharge the battery the next day. I understand that the furnace will drain the battery in one night. Also, does your Yammi power your a/c?
If you want (Heat/A/C/and a Full Batt) Run a 3000+ Quite HONDA all the time you are (Off the Grid)! Youroo!!
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Old 06-10-2015, 10:09 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by oldtool2 View Post
Deep cycle batteries are designed to be discharged and charged. I had one I used on an electric motor for a boat and was constantly taking it all the way down and then recharging it. I replaced it after four years but it was still operating and I kept it for a spare.
Just plain wrong. From Trojan: Battery Maintenance | Trojan Battery Company
  1. Shallow discharges will result in a longer battery life.
  2. 50% (or less) discharges are recommended.
  3. 80% discharge is the maximum safe discharge.
  4. Do not fully discharge flooded batteries (80% or more). This will damage (or kill) the battery.
Your anecdotal evidence is not supported by any battery manufacturer and the attached depth of discharge curve for T-105 deep cycle 6V Trojans proves the point.




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Originally Posted by oldtool2 View Post

What id the charge rate from the trailer converter? 10 to 12 amps? The 12 volt on my EU3000i is 12 amps but you can't use the eco or have any 120 volt plugged in to get that. Turn the eco switch on and the 12 volt amperage drops to about 4 amps, even with no 120 usage.

One very important caution, the 12 volt is not regulated so you could cook your battery if not careful! I personally will not use the 12volts. Safer to carry a cheap 120 volt charger to charge a spare batter and not have to worry. Of course your trailer converter is the best bet.

Jim
The Honda has an 8 amp output at 12V. It is not designed as a battery charger and will not act like a modern 3 stage charger...further increasing the liklihood of battery homicide. An 8 amp charger even if configured as a modern 3-4 stage unit would take about 6 hours just to get to 80% charged on a single Group31 battery. Add another few hours to 100%.
As you suggest...the BEST way to use a generator to charge batteries is to use the 120V plug to power a REAL charger rated at at approximately 20-25% of the 20 hour capacity of the batteries (at 12V). Most 2 battery set ups today are best served by a 40-50amp charger. Roughly in the $150-200 range. Progressive or Iota models with smart charging are good values and well built.
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Old 06-10-2015, 10:31 AM   #31
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If you are looking to charge a battery with 1 or 2 honda generators. Why not one and a decent battery charger. Lot less $ invested. BTW the Honda 3000i Handi is an awesome generator. It will run a 13.5K Btu AC unit. I have a transfer switch in my home breaker box and when the power is out, it has been worth every dime I paid for it, and it doesn't use a lot of fuel.
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Old 06-10-2015, 10:29 PM   #32
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Just plain wrong. From Trojan: Battery Maintenance | Trojan Battery Company
  1. Shallow discharges will result in a longer battery life.
  2. 50% (or less) discharges are recommended.
  3. 80% discharge is the maximum safe discharge.
  4. Do not fully discharge flooded batteries (80% or more). This will damage (or kill) the battery.
Your anecdotal evidence is not supported by any battery manufacturer and the attached depth of discharge curve for T-105 deep cycle 6V Trojans proves the point.The Honda has an 8 amp output at 12V. It is not designed as a battery charger and will not act like a modern 3 stage charger...further increasing the liklihood of battery homicide. An 8 amp charger even if configured as a modern 3-4 stage unit would take about 6 hours just to get to 80% charged on a single Group31 battery. Add another few hours to 100%.
As you suggest...the BEST way to use a generator to charge batteries is to use the 120V plug to power a REAL charger rated at at approximately 20-25% of the 20 hour capacity of the batteries (at 12V). Most 2 battery set ups today are best served by a 40-50amp charger. Roughly in the $150-200 range. Progressive or Iota models with smart charging are good values and well built.
Not trying to spread false information , just had personal experience to go by. If I read your chart right you can get about 500 cycles at 100% discharge, more the less you discharge. I don't consider that bad. 500 nights of boondocking is a lot.

The EU3000is is 12 amp which I was referring to. The 2000 might be 8 amps? Doesn't really matter, the best is to run the converter to charge with.

Jim
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Old 06-11-2015, 08:24 AM   #33
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Yes the 3000is is 12A the 3000IH is 8.3 amps.

You will note that the difference between a 50% discharge and a 100% discharge is 700 cycles. Most people would rather not buy 2.2 batteries instead of 1 to get 1200 cycles.
NOT accusing you of anything but good intentions and being wrong on something that could cost a lot of folks here a lot of money! I've been wrong a time or two myself if my wife is to be believed!
*********

Oh and for the group...please note that you will NOT get the same number of cycles from most other deep cycle batteries...these are TROJAN golf carts being measured... WHAT will hold true is the RELATIVE cycle life based on depth of discharge. These are also STATIC tests and life is SHORTER for batteries bumping down the road.
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Old 06-15-2015, 09:50 PM   #34
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I have decided to go with 2, 2000 gens. Now deciding between Honda or Yamaha. Probably Yamaha as I'm a Yammi guy. Thanks for all the imput.
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