Factory PEX to hose connections

[chrissoniat]

Originally Posted by AZ Pete

In my experience the vinyl hose is too large ID for the pex fittings, and after replacing the factory oetiker clamps, only to have them leak again, I went to screw type hose clamps that are designed for fuel injection line...they can be tightened more, and can be retightened if need be

We had the same experience, i.e., the PEX clamps didn't fit on the vinyl tubing in the RV, and we used screw clamps.

[adaycj]

https://photos.app.goo.gl/yaS59icFySoeYguf9

Originally Posted by gw1800

I tired to find a connector for a flexible PVC tubing. very few and far between. Even harder to find is one that would connect PVC to PEX.

Honestly, it isn't as easy as that anyway. I went to two plumbing supply places locally. There are fittings that exist for the braided stuff. The problem is none of the parts combine.

The copper PEX B rings don't fit on the braided hose without lots of fooling around on each connection. Then getting the braided hose on the braided hose fitting with an uncrimped ring is also very difficult. Further, when crimped onto an appropriate braided hose fitting it is too tight and will likely crack the fitting. It's the same story with PEX oetiker clamps. The PEX world does have already half crimped, vs wide open oetiker clamps, but it still doesn't solve the over crushing problem. The wide open ones just fit on the braided stuff to begin with.

The braided hose will fit on PEX A fittings tightly, creating another issue. The expansion/shrink in place clamping system still leaks on braided hose (sigh). Both paper slips in the PEX A fitting box and the shrink ring box specifically stated to only use on proper labeled PEX A parts ... as if they knew the RV industry would try it.

Two paragraphs to say, it's an all or nothing thing. I'm sure a PEX/Braided adapter exists. I have 0% faith that the RV industry could keep it all straight even if they had all of the right parts for both systems and the needed adapters.

With only a modicum of skill I was able to re-plumb my TT with PEX B. They could just do that. For more flex ... well that is one reason PEX A exists. Of course you can't tie it in knots like the RV industry does with the braided home hobbiest level hose they cludge onto PEX.

[Igave]

We are in an rv resort where they also have casitas and villas. Most folks winter here then close their units down for the summer while they travel or go home. The casitas/villas are built using pex hose and fittings by commercial plumbers. This past fall when returning folks turned on their water, ten units leaked. That would be behind walls, ceilings, etc. and sounds like at the connections. So, it’s not only an issue on rv units.

[gw1800]

There are different methods and types of PEX crimps. The cinch type is more prone to failure than the solid ring compression type. My neighbor is a master plumber and he only uses the compression rings. Of course the tool for the compression rings is expensive.

[Homebrew]

Found this pocket tool at lowes, works good but must crimp it twice .

[NJKris]

Originally Posted by Igave

We are in an rv resort where they also have casitas and villas. Most folks winter here then close their units down for the summer while they travel or go home. The casitas/villas are built using pex hose and fittings by commercial plumbers. This past fall when returning folks turned on their water, ten units leaked. That would be behind walls, ceilings, etc. and sounds like at the connections. So, it’s not only an issue on rv units.

The tool calibration needs to be checked now and then. I suspect my crimps were made with by an untrained worker, or out of calibration tool, or both, since they all began leaking by end of first year, and after I did it myself with brand new tool, 2 years later still no problems. (braided hose to water filter connections, city water inlet, etc).

[CaboSnow]

I have had the same problem with ALL my trailers and motorhomes. I bought the metric cinch clamps and replaced all screw-type clamps and those spring type clamps. Small price to pay for Peace Of Mind.

[FirstFiver]

Originally Posted by NJKris

Amazing that a business that was started in 1996 (Forest River), still hasn't figured this out yet. They've had 25 years to get it right.

They did figure it out:
It costs more money to do it the right way.
So...do it the cheap way. It's the customer's problem once they take delivery.

[adaycj]

Originally Posted by FirstFiver

They did figure it out:
It costs more money to do it the right way.
So...do it the cheap way. It's the customer's problem once they take delivery.

Yep. And the lawsuits (class action or otherwise) never prevail. They just claim they will fix it for free under warranty, so there are no damages to claim in a suit. External costs are way harder to include in a suit. Lost trips, aggravations, lost value from water damage evidence ... FR isn't paying for that stuff.

Leaks certainly will get fixed under warranty. It comes with stipulations however. They fix the leaks, not the impending leaks from the shoddy choice of materials. You also have to wait for their timeline.

I'm part of the problem I'm afraid. I just fixed my own mess. I can't be bothered to tow my rig back and forth over and over. I also have precious little free time and the screwed up trips costs me even more. But that is just me. I've now made it so FR is seeing zero impact financially.

I tried screw clamps as a hack fix on my failed trip. Making a hose 1/8 inch too big fit on a fitting by smashing it with an automotive clamp is a hack at best. No blame from me, I'd do the same thing in a pinch ... in fact I did. It leaked again in less than 3 hours. Granted my attempt was pretty half hearted.

The industry is so entrenched in this mess now they almost can't help. If they issue a recall or admit the failure they would be in for millions and millions. On the Grand Design forum a company rep even posted a weak sounding rebuttal claiming the hose manufacturer claims compatibility with PEX A fittings and it was all "in spec". Of course the much requested evidence of the compatibility in writing was ignored and the thread was locked soon after.

I hold out a small hope that some manufacturers will start to transition to PEX A and sell it as a marketing ploy. If enough people pick those products maybe the industry will abandon this silly braided hose nonsense..I must be getting sleepy, because it seems I'm dreaming again

[FirstFiver]

It would be nice if customers had the knowledge to look at a rig in the dealers parking lot and see the cheap hose and say:
I'll take it. Let me know when you have changed all the piping and I'll be back with payment then.

or maybe something like:

This rig has braided tubing, not PEX. You will have to knock off an additional $10,000 to cover me having to replace the water lines.

[ebemis]

ok, on our first ROO, all the plastic PEX connections were black, on our second they are all white/ivory in color. Our first ROO had many of the same Flex Poly Tube with PEX clamps and NONE OF THEM ever leaked....

On our latest ROO, no leaks were present until i camped where temps (and water temp) were cold... real cold.... 40's-50's (I'm a Floridian, that's almost unbearable!) AND BINGO leaks galore at EVERY SINGLE Flex Poly to PEX connector point.... interesting thing was NO OTHER PEX connections leaked!

I replaced everything with PEX (took some interesting curves) and posted pictures and story on the ROO boards some time ago. I was not able to reach the Flex connections behind/under our shower and am hoping they aren't an issue moving forward (I try to watch them) because I don't really want to pull the shower enclosure just to replace those... another board poster DID that and had a good story but I can't remember the title of the thread.

One "hack" i found... on our ROO 235 all the water connections are in the rear left corner about as far away and isolated (by interior walls and bus doors) from any reasonable "warm air" from inside the rig so..... i found a small low power fan driven heater at ACE. It has a tip over and overheat protection built in and I just plugged that in placing it inside the rear storage compartment.... overnight temps in the 30's kept that entire compartment a toast 70-74 degrees believe it or not and what do you know.. none of the PEX to FLEX connections leaked...... hmmm!

Best of luck and just like everyone else offered, if you can fix it yourself my experience tells me you will be much better off!

This is the Shower Thread;
https://www.forestriverforums.com/fo...al-221010.html

and I couldn't find my post with story about all the water leaks.. it was Thanksgiving time frame 2020 and here is the link to some of the pictures I put up in the story;
https://www.forestriverforums.com/fo...lbums3669.html

[Devildog1982]

Originally Posted by FirstFiver

It would be nice if customers had the knowledge to look at a rig in the dealers parking lot and see the cheap hose and say:
I'll take it. Let me know when you have changed all the piping and I'll be back with payment then.

or maybe something like:

This rig has braided tubing, not PEX. You will have to knock off an additional $10,000 to cover me having to replace the water lines.

Agreed, now that I know what to look for it will be easier to get them to fix things before I buy a new TT.

[retiredcamper47]

I use the “worm gear” clamps on all my water line repairs. I’ve added shutoff valves to all my sinks and toilet lines. I use my 1/4” inch ratchet with 1/4” socket to tighten them, not a screwdriver. Haven’t had a leak yet using this method.

[KyDan]

Originally Posted by NJKris

Amazing that a business that was started in 1996 (Forest River), still hasn't figured this out yet. They've had 25 years to get it right.

My first rig was not FR. It blew off a screw clamp at the water pump mid way thru the first summer of camping trips. Luckily we were in the trailer at the time.
It's an industry wide issue.
Unless they are hidden and hard to access it's a routine maintenance issue.
Tighten them when new and every year after. The problem is many folks do
not know it needs to be done.

[Pyroslinger]

These sucky water lines and connections cause so much damage and headaches! We should sue FR! I just replaced every cheap plastic fitting and valves with all brass, added the round copper rings/crimp clamps and proper flexible lines. BEWARE OF PLASTIC CHECK VALVES ON HOT WATER TANKS!!(near the bottom on the tank) Buy Brass on Amazon and replace them! Trust me on this!! If this cheap part cracks...Buy case of Jameson Whiskey!! FR and ALL RVs in this class are PURE JUNK! Cruel World Indeed.

[clifhngr]

I have enjoyed reading the different fixes to a serious problem. I think the main culprit is the ID of the braided hose is too big to allow a good clamp and seal. I have used PVC successfully in my sugarhouse with no leaks. I use both types of clamps, but prefer the
cinch type. One thing I have read about PEX is type B does not have a "memory" and kinks more easily than type A. Of course you need an expensive expander tool for type A.
Of all the listed fixes, I like making a header from PVC fittings and using threaded insert fittings for the braided tubing. I think this could be a good permanent fix. certainly nothing wrong with braided hose it the correct and proper size fittings are used. Too bad the manufacturer couldn't do this from manufacture and we would all be happier campers

[gw1800]

Originally Posted by clifhngr

I have enjoyed reading the different fixes to a serious problem. I think the main culprit is the ID of the braided hose is too big to allow a good clamp and seal. I have used PVC successfully in my sugarhouse with no leaks. I use both types of clamps, but prefer the
cinch type. One thing I have read about PEX is type B does not have a "memory" and kinks more easily than type A. Of course you need an expensive expander tool for type A.
Of all the listed fixes, I like making a header from PVC fittings and using threaded insert fittings for the braided tubing. I think this could be a good permanent fix. certainly nothing wrong with braided hose it the correct and proper size fittings are used. Too bad the manufacturer couldn't do this from manufacture and we would all be happier campers

The flex PVC us cheap!! And none of them us the same sizes. I did find brass barb fittings that work. You just have to search for them at a good hardware store. Those and a hose clamp work very well.