Toilet leaks into basement

[asr524]

I recently purchased a Wolfpack 315PACK12 and noticed the front basement compartment had water in it. I have figured out the water is running down the outside of the pipe from the toilet.
What I dont understand is how to go about fixing it. Do I need to remove the toilet and floor flange? No water seems to be inside the bathroom at all. I just find it in the compartment where the pipe goes through. Its hard to see in the pictures but the water runs down the pipe then drips off the elbow.

[nomad297]

It’s most likely just a bad seal at the flange. It could be other things, though.

First, see if you can tighten the closet bolts a little and see if this stops the leak. If this doesn’t work, pull the toilet, look for water on the floor under the toilet first. If you see water, get a new seal and replace it. If you don’t see any signs of water on the floor, close to the edge of the flange, look for splits on the flange or a bad glue joint at the flange. Even if you don’t find anything obvious, replace the seal, reset the toilet and see how it goes.

Bruce

[SeaDog]

Welcome to the forum its a great place to get your questions answered. Are you sure its from the toilet? RV toilets have a foam seal not a wax ring so if the toilet is not wiggling around now tightening the bolts will have no effect. I think what I would do is run water in the sink and shower and check the pipe for water if none then pull the toilet and replace the foam seal. Seal replacement is an easy DIY project.

[asr524]

Originally Posted by SeaDog

Welcome to the forum its a great place to get your questions answered. Are you sure its from the toilet? RV toilets have a foam seal not a wax ring so if the toilet is not wiggling around now tightening the bolts will have no effect. I think what I would do is run water in the sink and shower and check the pipe for water if none then pull the toilet and replace the foam seal. Seal replacement is an easy DIY project.

I know its definitely not from the shower. That's another pipe that I fixed when tracking this leak down.

Its hard to tell from that picture but the pipe goes straight up to the toilet. While winterizing I flushed the toilet only and went into this compartment and could see some antifreeze running down this pipe until it dripped from the elbow joint.

[Flybob]

Can you tell if the liquid is coming from inside the toilet or elsewhere (clean or black water)? It is possible you have a leak in the fresh water side of the plumbing.

[asr524]

Originally Posted by Flybob

Can you tell if the liquid is coming from inside the toilet or elsewhere (clean or black water)? It is possible you have a leak in the fresh water side of the plumbing.

Unfortunately I cant exactly since the hole that was cut into the floor is offset from the pipe. so where the water is running down the pipe is hidden by the floor but the floor has a slight air gap that allows the water to run down the pipe unobstructed.
My initial thought is that it is coming from the flush of the toilet. The last flush I did was with the water pump off to empty to bowl of antifreeze. Once I got back into the basement compartment I could see a light drip down the exterior of the pipe.

[Larry-NC]

Are you absolutely certain that the water is not coming from the flush valve, where the fresh water line connects to the toilet? These delicate little plastic valves are notorious for developing hairline cracks. When they do, water flows invisibly along the feed pipe and does its damage beneath the floor.

Do the "white glove" test on the valve and line and let us know what you find.

Most RV supplies will charge you $35-40 for that little plastic valve. It will take less than 10 minutes to replace it.

[asr524]

Originally Posted by Larry-NC

Are you absolutely certain that the water is not coming from the flush valve, where the fresh water line connects to the toilet? These delicate little plastic valves are notorious for developing hairline cracks. When they do, water flows invisibly along the feed pipe and does its damage beneath the floor.

Do the "white glove" test on the valve and line and let us know what you find.

Most RV supplies will charge you $35-40 for that little plastic valve. It will take less than 10 minutes to replace it.

Tomorrow I am going over to where its stored and going to check the toilet bolts as mentioned before and fill the bowl with antifreeze and flush it to see if the leak is still occurring.
The unit is brand new and I noticed this on our first trip before we had to put it away for winter. If the flush valve was leaking would I see water on the bathroom floor?
The leak I am seeing from the bottom side almost seems like joint leak in the pipe from the toilet to the black tank. I am hoping to confirm this theory with filling the toilet from a jug then flushing it removing the water feed line from the equation.

[Larry-NC]

Originally Posted by asr524

If the flush valve was leaking would I see water on the bathroom floor?

Not necessarily. If the hole in the floor for the pipe has sufficient clearance, the water will continue down, not spreading across the floor.

In the unfortunate case I saw, the dripping water flowed as a sheet (skin?) along the surface of the white feed line. It was invisible. The owner, a friend at an adjacent site, didn't find it until the new floor he had installed buckled for several feet. Subsequent inspection showed that the subfloor was complete mush. He figured out that an incomplete winterization the year before had caused the leak that persisted for many months on the permanently-sited trailer before discovery.

Originally Posted by asr524

The leak I am seeing from the bottom side almost seems like joint leak in the pipe from the toilet to the black tank. I am hoping to confirm this theory with filling the toilet from a jug then flushing it removing the water feed line from the equation.

That would be a good test. Let us know what you find.

In many trailers the toilet is located directly over the black tank. Some do have elbows which could leak.

That's a lot of antifreeze for regular winterization. You usually don't need any in the toilet since there's no trap. You just have to make sure the tanks are emptied so there's no fluid right behind the drain valves.

[CedarCreekWoody]

Wrap some tissue around the white water line and see if it gets wet.

[Larry-NC]

Originally Posted by CedarCreekWoody

Wrap some tissue around the white water line and see if it gets wet.

Really, all you have to do is grasp it. Tissue for a really slow leak, but leaks from a cracked valve aren't that slow.

[asr524]

Originally Posted by Larry-NC

Really, all you have to do is grasp it. Tissue for a really slow leak, but leaks from a cracked valve aren't that slow.

Another question....if the valve is cracked would the line not stay primed? When we used it last the pump wasn't running or cycling like a leaking faucet would do.

This is a 5th wheel so the pipe from the toilet comes down into the pass through compartment and heads off in a 45 degree angle toward the tanks. If my pictures were rotated 90deg to the right then it might make more sense. They were straight on my phone but uploaded sideways. Makes it easy to crawl in on my back and look straight up at the pipes. Sucks there isn't quite enough clearance to actually get a good visual.

[grouchmore]

I would take a yard stick/ruler and tape a tissue paper on the end making a "feather duster" out of it. Then touch it against the pipe closest to the floor cutout first, if it is wet there then it might be the toilet flange or it should be a problem above the floor if not then keep testing joints below the floor with the "feather duster" until it is wet. Good Luck

[Larry-NC]

Originally Posted by asr524

Another question....if the valve is cracked would the line not stay primed? When we used it last the pump wasn't running or cycling like a leaking faucet would do.

Right. The pump would run periodically. That rules out the valve, unless it is somehow leaking only during a flush.

Originally Posted by asr524

This is a 5th wheel so the pipe from the toilet comes down into the pass through compartment and heads off in a 45 degree angle toward the tanks. If my pictures were rotated 90deg to the right then it might make more sense. They were straight on my phone but uploaded sideways. Makes it easy to crawl in on my back and look straight up at the pipes. Sucks there isn't quite enough clearance to actually get a good visual.

A lot of folks have successfully used their phones, simply holding it at the point-of-view they wish to capture and shooting several photos blindly. There are pictures like that fairly often in these forums.

An old-fashioned option is to borrow your wife's compact and make good use of the small mirror.

[asr524]

I think the leak has been found. The father in law and me decided to investigate further than I expected. From what we could see after pulling the toilet was that the flange wasnt completely glued or sealed to the down pipe. I circled it in my picture. Pouring antifreeze straight on that spot leaked antifreeze down the exterior of the pipe.
Not the proper way to fix it but we decided to silicone the entire pipe connection and see what happens. Worst case we will have to cut it out and fix it properly anyway but id rather not have to cut all of the pipes out if this works.

[DRogers]

Originally Posted by asr524

The unit is brand new and I noticed this on our first trip before we had to put it away for winter.

If the unit is brand new let the dealership pull out all the piping and replace it.

[Larry-NC]

Originally Posted by asr524

I think the leak has been found. The father in law and me decided to investigate further than I expected. From what we could see after pulling the toilet was that the flange wasnt completely glued or sealed to the down pipe. I circled it in my picture. Pouring antifreeze straight on that spot leaked antifreeze down the exterior of the pipe.
Not the proper way to fix it but we decided to silicone the entire pipe connection and see what happens. Worst case we will have to cut it out and fix it properly anyway but id rather not have to cut all of the pipes out if this works.

If that doesn't work, pull the toilet again. Put plenty of alcohol (70% Isopropyl from the drugstore) on it to flush away the antifreeze. Give the alcohol some time to dry. Maybe use compressed air or your heat gun. Then get some REAL ABS cement, not the Universal or ABS+PVC cement.

The real cement is a solvent. It will melt the black plastic on both sides and reflow them together. Don't use the alternatives.

ABS pipe and cement used to be real popular. Now none of the small stores carry it.

Doing this repair will be easy. The hardest part is removing the antifreeze really well.

[asr524]

Originally Posted by Larry-NC

If that doesn't work, pull the toilet again. Put plenty of alcohol (70% Isopropyl from the drugstore) on it to flush away the antifreeze. Give the alcohol some time to dry. Maybe use compressed air or your heat gun. Then get some REAL ABS cement, not the Universal or ABS+PVC cement.

The real cement is a solvent. It will melt the black plastic on both sides and reflow them together. Don't use the alternatives.

ABS pipe and cement used to be real popular. Now none of the small stores carry it.

Doing this repair will be easy. The hardest part is removing the antifreeze really well.

I did try to wipe out all the antfreeze with a few different towels to dry it out real good. We used a lot of silicone all the way around. As long as it stays stuck it should be good to go.

To me doing this fix is way easier than dealing with any of our local dealers. Their service department reviews are not the best.