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Old 06-05-2013, 11:00 AM   #1
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50 Amp in 240V welder outlet

I have a friend who just picked up his new Silver Back yesterday. He took it home and plugged it into a 50amp 240v welder outlet and is having some issues. He has removed it from the 240v and plugged it into a 110 so mored damage will not happen.

What can he expect to find for damage? What kind of appliances, electrical components is he likely to have to repair/replace?

As you can imagine he is pretty sick about this. The side of the rig says 110/240 so he "assumed" this was all the same. Unfortunately this little bit of information was not broached during the PDI and maybe it shouldn't need to be. Unfortunatley for him it might have helped.

Thanks for the information.
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Old 06-05-2013, 11:12 AM   #2
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Some or all appliances may have been ruined.

All you can do is start turning things on and see what werks and what doesn't.


Happens more often than you think.


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Old 06-05-2013, 11:12 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by jeepman71 View Post
I have a friend who just picked up his new Silver Back yesterday. He took it home and plugged it into a 50amp 240v welder outlet and is having some issues. He has removed it from the 240v and plugged it into a 110 so mored damage will not happen.

What can he expect to find for damage? What kind of appliances, electrical components is he likely to have to repair/replace?

As you can imagine he is pretty sick about this. The side of the rig says 110/240 so he "assumed" this was all the same. Unfortunately this little bit of information was not broached during the PDI and maybe it shouldn't need to be. Unfortunatley for him it might have helped.

Thanks for the information.
Not being familiar with his model trailer, does he have a 50 amp (4 prong) or 30 amp (3 prongs) service on his trailer.

If it is a 30 amp (120 volt) and he plugged into a 220/240 volt service.......he could have fried the television, the microwave, possibly the 120 to 12 volt converter. He probably didn't have the air-conditioner running, so he may be OK there.

If BombDoc reads this, he can let you know what all needs to be replaced.
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Old 06-05-2013, 11:13 AM   #4
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Oops. Not sure what may have fried, but a fuse or breaker should of blown or tripped to protect the overvoltage. Just guessing here.
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Old 06-05-2013, 11:15 AM   #5
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Oops. Not sure what may have fried, but a fuse or breaker should of blown or tripped to protect the overvoltage. Just guessing here.
Not likely.

The spike kills before protection.

No if he'd had a surge or high voltage protection he'd have been fine.
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Old 06-05-2013, 11:31 AM   #6
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Oh, I thought the 110v went thru the protection board before going to outlets.
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Old 06-05-2013, 11:33 AM   #7
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It is the four prong plug. It amazes me that as Tubs says it happens too often why is there not some form of protection for this situation?

I am curious what might be a problem in the electrical system itself.
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Old 06-05-2013, 11:40 AM   #8
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It is the four prong plug. It amazes me that as Tubs says it happens too often why is there not some form of protection for this situation?

I am curious what might be a problem in the electrical system itself.
It's surprising that campers don't come with surge protection. But, let's be honest - which ever maker/model they choose, 50% or more people won't be happy with which one they choose.

This does sadly happen more often than you'd think. I know it's the 3rd or so here on the forum that I've seen.
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Old 06-05-2013, 11:40 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by jeepman71 View Post
I have a friend who just picked up his new Silver Back yesterday. He took it home and plugged it into a 50amp 240v welder outlet and is having some issues. He has removed it from the 240v and plugged it into a 110 so mored damage will not happen.

What can he expect to find for damage? What kind of appliances, electrical components is he likely to have to repair/replace?

As you can imagine he is pretty sick about this. The side of the rig says 110/240 so he "assumed" this was all the same. Unfortunately this little bit of information was not broached during the PDI and maybe it shouldn't need to be. Unfortunatley for him it might have helped.

Thanks for the information.
Been there and done that! And, I was just as sick about it as he is. Tell him it will be ok. I know that doesn't sound like good advice, but it will. Thanks to several people on this forum, I didn't beat myself up too bad. As much as it pains me to say, I just chalked it up to the "learning curve". An expensive learning curve I might add.

I lost the TV, Microwave, and fireplace as well as the converter instantly!!
Ended up with a better TV than the rig came with (1080 vice 720).
Microwave had to be replaced and special ordered (It was already discontinued from Magic Chef and I had purchased the RV brand new 3 weeks prior to my incident).
Fireplace needed the entire circuit board replaced.
Converter.....I didn't notice this was bad until 3-4 weeks after the initial incident. Ended up have to replace that too.

Will go with the Progessive Industries protection as so many recommend on this forum soon.

It sucks, I know, but I learned an awful lot.
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Old 06-05-2013, 11:42 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by rotorhead1250 View Post
Oh, I thought the 110v went thru the protection board before going to outlets.
Nope.
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Old 06-05-2013, 11:46 AM   #11
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He might be OK as it looks like the Silver Back fifth wheel has 50 amp plug. When he hooked up in the welder receptacle and if the hot legs matched the 240 hot leg of the trailer plug, then he might not have damaged the equipment. He would have been missing the neutral though and having issues. He needs to check each appliances one by one hooked up to 120 volts and see if all OK.


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Old 06-05-2013, 12:01 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by jeepman71 View Post
It is the four prong plug. It amazes me that as Tubs says it happens too often why is there not some form of protection for this situation?

I am curious what might be a problem in the electrical system itself.
If it does have four prongs then it is 50 amp (which is a 120/240 volt service incoming). I am assuming he plugged his 50 amp four prong trailers cord into a four prong welder outlet......and didn't use any kind of adapters?

This may help explain it better. Click on the 50 amp and then the 30 amp tabs on the left of the page to understand the differences.

RV Electric

Was this outlet he plugged into miswired?

Exactly what kind of problems is he experiencing? If everything was wired correct on his 50 amp trailer and the 240 volt outlet, I'm failing to understand what is wrong.....but am just speculating.

The thing that happens commonly, is people plugging a 30 amp (3 prong) 120 volt trailer into a 220/240 volt outlet, which some older style welding plugs have three prongs, but are 220/240 volts.
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Old 06-05-2013, 12:29 PM   #13
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He needs to check each appliances one by one hooked up to 120 volts and see if all OK.
As fonzie stated, he can test most stuff one at a time....but be cautious. You said he was plugged into 120 volts now.

How/what is he plugged into for the 120 volts?

If he is using an adapter, is he plugged into a 30 amp receptacle...or is he using an adaptor(s) for a 20 or 15 amp regular household plug?

In either case, he is now limited to either 30 amps total electricity, or maybe 20, or even 15.

When using the adapter(s) and plugged in this way, you have that much power going across both buses (learned that recently) total...... (normally he would have 50 amps per bus or 100 amps total)......so you can only usually turn on anything that uses less amps than your are plugged into. If you are on a 15 amp household plug, do not try and turn on either air-conditioner (if it has 1 or 2 AC units). They can require over 15 amps per unit to start.
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Old 06-05-2013, 12:51 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by jeepman71 View Post
It is the four prong plug. It amazes me that as Tubs says it happens too often why is there not some form of protection for this situation?

I am curious what might be a problem in the electrical system itself.
Such pessimists here!

As WmTire said, most likely nothing was damaged unless the welder outlet was miswired. Everything should be fine.
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Old 06-05-2013, 01:49 PM   #15
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Thanks for all the replys.

I do believe he has the four prong and plugged into a four prong.

He is now plugged into 110 using the 50 to 30 and then the 30 to 20 that was given to him at the dealership when he picked his rig up. I did let him know that he would have to watch the load he tried to run on the system using the adapters.

He does have some issues with some stuff at this point.

The refrigerator is on "Auto" but is the gas light is showing so I am guessing he is not getting power to the frig or....... Maybe someone with more knowledge can guide me in this issue.

The microwave seems to be possessed as he puts it. There is no digital reading where the time should be but when he opens the door the light inside comes on somewhat dim and the turntable starts turning. Sounds bad.

The batteries do not appear to be charging. Bad converter I would think, maybe lucky and blown fuse or reset popped.

One air was on and does seem to be working ok at this point, TVs were all off, fire place was off, ceiling fan was on but does seem to be ok, and furnace is working ok.

Thanks for the help and replies, I think he is getting over the shock and starting to think of repairs. The rig was in front of his house less than 30 minutes after picking it up when he fried it.
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Old 06-05-2013, 01:59 PM   #16
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Just because the socket was a 4 prong, it may not have been wired with a neutral.

Without a neutral, the welder would have worked fine, while the trailer would have been damaged. The neutral buss in the camper would not have been tied to the ground to provide 110 on each leg.
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Old 06-06-2013, 08:26 AM   #17
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I talked to him last night and found the extent of the damage. While dissapointing to say the least it could have been worse. It seems as Bombdoc stated he lost the converter and the microwave for sure. He has not checked the TVs and the fridge will not go to electric so maybe a board there. It is going into the dealer today for a repair. I will let you know what the final tally is.

I need to appologize to Turbs as you should and are not referred to a "Tubs". Of course if you drink the favorite adult beverages as I seem to see like myself maybe Tubs will fit.
I posted this on another forum and like here I got a pretty wide degree of responses. There seems to be a big difference in oppinion on this matter. I am surprised at how many people assume this is ok. This person is a mechanically inclined person, he has used various kinds of RVs for camping over the years but he had no idea this could be a problem. He talked with a public utility service person and they said "240 is 240". He has dug through his owners manual and has found nothing mentioned about this potential problem. It will be a lesson he will not soon forget and I am sure he will pass the word along to help educate others.

Thanks for your replys.
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Old 06-06-2013, 08:29 AM   #18
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Lol I've been called worse on here!
Its all good!

Turbs, turns, tubs etc etc
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Old 06-06-2013, 08:33 AM   #19
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I talked to him last night and found the extent of the damage. While dissapointing to say the least it could have been worse. It seems as Bombdoc stated he lost the converter and the microwave for sure. He has not checked the TVs and the fridge will not go to electric so maybe a board there. It is going into the dealer today for a repair. I will let you know what the final tally is.

I need to appologize to Turbs as you should and are not referred to a "Tubs". Of course if you drink the favorite adult beverages as I seem to see like myself maybe Tubs will fit.
I posted this on another forum and like here I got a pretty wide degree of responses. There seems to be a big difference in oppinion on this matter. I am surprised at how many people assume this is ok. This person is a mechanically inclined person, he has used various kinds of RVs for camping over the years but he had no idea this could be a problem. He talked with a public utility service person and they said "240 is 240". He has dug through his owners manual and has found nothing mentioned about this potential problem. It will be a lesson he will not soon forget and I am sure he will pass the word along to help educate others.

Thanks for your replys.
So what EXACTLY did he do wrong or was wrong with the outlet? It might help others in the future who read this.
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Old 06-06-2013, 08:46 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by jeepman71 View Post
I talked to him last night and found the extent of the damage. While dissapointing to say the least it could have been worse. It seems as Bombdoc stated he lost the converter and the microwave for sure. He has not checked the TVs and the fridge will not go to electric so maybe a board there. It is going into the dealer today for a repair. I will let you know what the final tally is.

I need to appologize to Turbs as you should and are not referred to a "Tubs". Of course if you drink the favorite adult beverages as I seem to see like myself maybe Tubs will fit.
I posted this on another forum and like here I got a pretty wide degree of responses. There seems to be a big difference in oppinion on this matter. I am surprised at how many people assume this is ok. This person is a mechanically inclined person, he has used various kinds of RVs for camping over the years but he had no idea this could be a problem. He talked with a public utility service person and they said "240 is 240". He has dug through his owners manual and has found nothing mentioned about this potential problem. It will be a lesson he will not soon forget and I am sure he will pass the word along to help educate others.

Thanks for your replys.
Jeepman,
When I had my incident, it was totally my fault. Nothing wrong with the plug or the plug being wired wrong. I was visiting family and hadn't seen my Dad in several years. I simply plugged the 50Amp cord into the 30Amp adapter and right into the outlet it went. POP! Tripped the main breaker in the camper. My TV wasn't on, neither was the fireplace. Both were destroyed. Microwave went instantly too. I didn't notice the converter until later. You are right, he won't soon forget and neither will I!
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