An Electrical Challenge

[RCCS]

Original breaker could have heated up that bad if the wire going to it was not screwed down tightly enough therefor causing it to get hot from the loose connection. The 30 amp half of the tandem breaker it the line coming into the converter. The 15 amp half of the tandem breaker is a circuit going out to a circuit in the camper. If the screw for the 30 amp input to the converter was loose and a load was also on the 15 amp half it would possibly heat up to cause the damage you describe. Probably not a bad idea to replace that breaker as suggested.

[Scrapper]

Originally Posted by RCCS

Original breaker could have heated up that bad if the wire going to it was not screwed down tightly enough therefor causing it to get hot from the loose connection. The 30 amp half of the tandem breaker it the line coming into the converter. The 15 amp half of the tandem breaker is a circuit going out to a circuit in the camper. If the screw for the 30 amp input to the converter was loose and a load was also on the 15 amp half it would possibly heat up to cause the damage you describe. Probably not a bad idea to replace that breaker as suggested.

The WFCO Model WF-8955PEC converter doesn't use tandem breakers.

I have the same in my TT.

[RCCS]

I was just going by post #13 where he stated that it was a 30 and 15 amp breaker tied together on the same buss stab. Is that not a tandem circuit breaker? That is what I have called it for over 40 years working as an electrician.

[cavie]

Originally Posted by RCCS

I was just going by post #13 where he stated that it was a 30 and 15 amp breaker tied together on the same buss stab. Is that not a tandem circuit breaker? That is what I have called it for over 40 years working as an electrician.

Yep, a tandem breaker is 2 breakers side by side in a single pole slot. the handles are not tied together. A 2pole breaker takes up 2 full sized slots and the handles are tied together. The only 2 pole will be a 50 amp main.

[cavie]

OK lets try this one question at a time. If you plug your trailer in using just the converter, does everything in your trailer work?

[Blaster 84]

Maybe I need to start from the beginning.
Everything worked fine until damage to a converter I installed a new one. I also replaced the damaged breaker, although at the moment this is out of the equation.
I am hooked up to a building using an extension cord, to a dog bone, to 30 Amp RV power cord.
When I installed my EMS several years ago I it wired in behind my converter with in line plugs on short cords. (I wish I knew how to post pictures)

With electricity going to the RV, with just electricity going just
to the EMS, the breaker in the shore power panel does not trip.

With electricity going to the RV with electricity going to just the converter, with all the circuit breakers in converter disconnected, the breaker in the shore power panel does not trip.

However, if the EMS is connected and also the converter, with all the circuit breakers in the converter still disconnected, in a few moments the circuit breaker in the shore power panel will trip.

I have tried different circuits in the shore power with the same results.
I have looked for shorts in my cords using a continuity tester, none found.

I will return to the RV is week on try some of the test suggested. Thanks for everyone's input.

[Mr. Dan]

To post pictures, follow the instructions in post #7 of this standard how-to thread ==> http://www.forestriverforums.com/for...sics-6778.html.

[fonzie]

From your description above, I would take the female plug apart from the EMS to the converter and check if damaged internally, might be causing an internal fault when it is plug into the male plug of the converter and twisted to lock (if it is a twist lock plug).

[CHICKDOE]

from your last explanation I would suspect the output cable from the ems. here's why. you either have a portable version that has cables and connectors built into it or a hardwired version that you added short cables and connectors to. you also added connectors to the shore power cabled coming in and to the short cable going into the distribution panel.


with ems only connected no problem - I assume in this configuration there is nothing connected to the output side of the ems. there is no current flowing. nothing should trip


with ems not installed (ie the shore power cable connected directly to the distribution panel) no problem - but all the breakers are out of the distribution panel so I would assume that again there is no current flowing (not able to get to a branch circuit). nothing should trip.


now put the ems in and connect the output side to the distribution panel. any you still have all the breakers in the panel removed. so again there should be no current flowing as it cannot get through the distribution panel and out to a branch circuit. but you say the breaker trips. some current is flowing for the breaker to trip! the only piece of this configuration that has not been used in the previous two configurations is the cable / connector on the output side of the ems.


again, if I understand your configurations you have all breakers removed from the distribution panel so there is no place to current to flow once it gets to the panel. yet some current has to be flowing if you are tripping breakers. the only way that can be is something wrong with the cables / connecters. i'd check them all very very carefully. that original overheating problem may also have done damage to the shore power cable / connectors.

[cavie]

I agree with Fonzie. the problem is with the connection between the converter and the EMS. I'm gonna go out on a limb here, I'm good at doing that, and think the plug on the input side of the converter is wired backward assuming you didn't change the EMS side since before the problems started and you changed the Converter side while replacing the converter. How am I doing here? Does your EMS show proper wiring when plugged in by itself? If you have the EMS plugged in and have no problem, then add the converter with no load because you have the breakers disconnected, Then there is a direct short or a reversed polarity plug between the EMS and the Converter.

Also, check your cord to trailer connection for signs of heat and lose connections. Be very sure you are twisting the cord in place to the right and be sure you are installing the lock ring. this is most important.

[Blaster 84]

Originally Posted by Mr. Dan

To post pictures, follow the instructions in post #7 of this standard how-to thread ==> http://www.forestriverforums.com/for...sics-6778.html.

Thank you.
I'll take pictures this next week when I get to the RV.

[Blaster 84]

Thanks for all the input. I'll keep you posted as to what I find.

[Blaster 84]

Well thanks to everyone's input I discovered what the problem was. It was my STINKIN THNKIN.
When I wired the plug side of the cord between the EMS and the converter I had switched the black and white wires. I don't know when I did this, if was my initial wiring or when I changed converters. I also don't know if this could have caused my overheated breaker or not.
In my setup the power comes into the converter through the 30 AMP breaker and supplies electricity to the buss bar from which the other breakers pickup the juice for the AC appliances.
In any case problem is solved, all is well, and thank again for the responses.

[cavie]

Originally Posted by Blaster 84

Well thanks to everyone's input I discovered what the problem was. It was my STINKIN THNKIN.
When I wired the plug side of the cord between the EMS and the converter I had switched the black and white wires. I don't know when I did this, if was my initial wiring or when I changed converters. I also don't know if this could have caused my overheated breaker or not.
In my setup the power comes into the converter through the 30 AMP breaker and supplies electricity to the buss bar from which the other breakers pickup the juice for the AC appliances.
In any case problem is solved, all is well, and thank again for the responses.

I believe you did it when you changed out the converter because you stated that it worked prior to that. I have replaced 100's of those style breakers in my 45 years as an electrician. It is a poor design in two ways. First is the loose slide on the buss connection and second is the heat generated by a 30 amp load and a 15 amp load in such a confined space. When some cheapass electrician loads them up in a house panel you can hear them buzzing in the panel. We call them cheater breakers. When a panel is full and no room for a breaker you install one of those waffer breakers.

[Blaster 84]

Thank you Cavie.
I believe I have room for another breaker. If so, I'll install another 15 Amp and reduce some of the heat.