Are Lithium Batteries a Direct Drop In?

[Witness_Protection]

I am very new to this forum after purchasing a 2019 Mini-Lite 2109s last year. I have not changed anything with my 2109s since purchasing it. It has the standard configuration of a single FL battery with an "on the side" solar plug of which I would like to use a solar notebook. I would like to either (1) add a second FL battery or (2) check into a BattleBorn lithium.

Question: To go the lithium route, is this a simple drop in or what would I need to change in my 2109s to upgrade to the BB lithium?

Thanks!

[Justice12t]

Your cheapest route would be a second FL battery. Still not as good as one lithium battery however.

Lithium batteries are great but will most likely require a converter change or the addition of a new charger just for the battery. Lithium batteries have a different charging algorithm than other batteries. I doubt your current converter is equipped to handle. You can look up your model on the brands website and double check however just to make sure.

Just my input. Good luck!

[ependydad]

I dropped my lithium batteries into my new rig after trading in my bunkhouse. For over a year, I only had 1 wired up and didn't change anything about the rig.

Then a surprise night of boondocking (forgot my cord at the prior campground 200 miles away), I wired up all 4 batteries. Still didn't change my converter.

The converter *will* charge them. You just don't get to 100% state of charge, which lithium is perfectly happy with.

Then I was facing 2 weeks of boondocking at the Albuquerque with the family of 4 plus my in-laws (who aren't RVers), I knew I wanted everything done up to snuff. For that, I did change the converter our to a lithium aware charger. I ran a new 20amp outlet into the battery bay of my fifth wheel and installed the converter within 3' of the batteries. The benefit here is much faster charging times because of low voltage loss. I also re-installed my Victron BMV for bettery battery monitoring.

If you get the make/model of your converter, you can contact BattleBorn and ask if it's compatible with their batteries. Also talk to them about what happens if you don't upgrade it.

[SeaDog]

welcome to the forum its a great place to get your questions answered. the lithium batteries are a great upgrade if you are truly boondocking for any length of time with that said two sealed deep cycle batteries are much less expensive and I think lighter. Each situation is different good luck.

[NMWildcat]

Even the battleborn website says you can use your oem converter to charge them. Of course a new converter that is lithium aware would be better, but not necessary.

Lithium batteries are supposed to last at least 10 years and have many advantages over lead acid. Disadvantages are the enormous upfront costs and you have to be careful when charging/using them in freezing temps.
My lead acid batteries last me an average of 5 years, and I abuse them regularly when boondocking.
When the ridiculous cost of lithium approaches the cost of lead acid over its life expectancy, I'll definitely switch.

[Justice12t]

Ah yes...I stand corrected. I thought I read you needed a different charger. That is only needed if you want to charge faster. Reading is key

[TitanMike]

One LiFePo battery is half the weight of a similar sized Lead/acid battery and has twice the usable stored power (if you follow the 50% rule with lead/acid). Also able to recharge it fully in a fraction of the time required to fully charge lead acid. Rather than day long generator runs to recharge deeply discharged lead/acid it's more like 2-3 hours and the LiFePo's will suck up all the juice your converter can put out.

Even if just dropped in without changing converter to "Lithium" still far better than lead/acid. The amount of stored energy between max voltage of original converter and higher voltage lithium typi is fairly small. Looking at a voltage/capacity (amp hour) curve, the battery is close to 95% charged as the converter switches from bulk to absorb.

That's why Battleborn says a regular converter is adequate.

As for cost? That's up to each person to decide for themselves. More usable power, less weight, no real maintenance, flexibility in where they can be installed, life expectancy, all are benefits. To me they make more sense than some accessories people buy for their pickup trucks.

If buying a new RV just have them installed at time of purchase. If financing it will add less than $10 per month for a deluxe system. I've met a lot of people lately that have done exactly that.

Originally Posted by SeaDog

welcome to the forum its a great place to get your questions answered. the lithium batteries are a great upgrade if you are truly boondocking for any length of time with that said two sealed deep cycle batteries are much less expensive and I think lighter. Each situation is different good luck.

[LegacyFB38]

Originally Posted by NMWildcat

When the ridiculous cost of lithium approaches the cost of lead acid over its life expectancy, I'll definitely switch.

The purchase price of LiFePO4 batteries is unquestionably a major objection. As is the possibility of upgrading the RV's charger and/or the possible need for insulating/heating the battery for cold weather use.

At current prices for LiFePO4 batteries, IF only half the number of batteries are needed and IF they last twice as long as lead-acid, then MAYBE the cost of ownership of LiFePO4 batteries is still high, but not totally out of the question.

[Witness_Protection]

Thanks everyone for the good info! I really appreciate it!

Currently, I have been using the battery that came with the TT; an Interstate Marine RV Group 24. When charging it a couple of weeks ago, my charger gave me two lights.....one green and one red light. According to the instructions, I had the battery tested at Advance Auto and they could not find anything wrong with the battery.

Based upon the cost of lithium (and that there doesn't appear to be anything wrong with my Interstate), I will probably just add another IN Group 24 and wire them together to give me more AH. I would like to add a Victron monitor as well.

Question: The Victron videos that I have seen stress to make sure that all loads are running through the shunt. Other than the current battery cables are there any other loads that I would have to connect?

Thanks again!

[markb422]

not good to pair a new battery with a used one.

[Witness_Protection]

Thanks, Mark! Even if my current battery is only 10 months old?

[PSU Turf]

You should be fine if the original battery is in really good shape. If you know you have discharged it below 50% several times I would say get 2 new batteries.

[markb422]

I guess someone with more experience with batteries might be able to give you a good answer. You could ask if you pair it will they warranty the new battery.

[camaraderie]

Originally Posted by Witness_Protection

Question: The Victron videos that I have seen stress to make sure that all loads are running through the shunt. Other than the current battery cables are there any other loads that I would have to connect?

The wiring is simple. ONE negative wire from your batteries goes to the shunt. All other negative wires go to the other side of the shunt. A small power wire included goes to the battery + terminal. Then there is what appears to be a telephone wire with standard plug ends. One end goes to the shunt receptacle and the other gets plugged in to the back side of your monitor display. That's it.
Good luck!

[IchLiebeBier]

I've been researching a lot the last week because I made the leap and got BB batteries and a Victron. I haven't gotten them yet; just trying to learn as much as possible.

If you look at the Victron installation guide, it shows that the Victron (depending on model) can monitor 2 batteries independently. What it isn't clear about is that the monitor will read ONLY the current voltage of the second battery, if hooked up separately.

So in my case, I will parallel the 2 batteries together and monitor them both at the same time to get the full Victron monitoring information, such as charge rate, SOC, etc, etc. You do this by grounding the parallel set onto the one side of the shunt.

I wish the manual were clearer about that. I had to stumble upon it after researching it for a while.

Here's a good diagram on how they recommend doing it.

https://amsolar.com/rv-lithium-batte...40-lilbbmv1502

[SlowrideHD]

Originally Posted by TitanMike

One LiFePo battery is half the weight of a similar sized Lead/acid battery and has twice the usable stored power (if you follow the 50% rule with lead/acid).

I wish I could have put the upfront cost for my remote solar setup into the Lifepro (BB) batteries but one drawback was the unattended freezing possibilities while I was away.

This is what I have and costs for my battery bank. Sixteen T-105 in a 8S/2P 48 volt config. This gives me about 51 volts/ 225 amps useable (50% discharge) for ~11,475 watts at a cost of $1,840 for batteries. (16@ $115 ea)

To get equiv watts I would have had to use five of the 12v BB in a 5P setup for 13v at 900 amp (80% discharge) for 11,700 watts. Sound about right? But the batts would have cost me close to $5k. On top of the 3200 watts of solar that I put up....whew! And unfortunately, I had to factor in the ease of some thief being able to carry off a light BB battery as opposed to a half ton of flooded acids!

[IchLiebeBier]

16 batteries?!?
Is that why your handle is Slowride?

[SlowrideHD]

Originally Posted by IchLiebeBier

16 batteries?!?
Is that why your handle is Slowride?

Haha! Not on my camper....at an offgrid cabin.

I used to ride my Harley a LOT harder than I do now in my old age. Back in the day we had a pretty large group that rode together on all day rides. I was often a "road captain" guiding the rides. I would always describe an upcoming weekend ride as just a "nice slow ride". Everyone knew that it would be a white knuckle balls out adventure no matter who was leading! (everyone was VERY experienced) so the nickname stuck. Slowride

[Witness_Protection]

Thanks, PSU! Most of our camping trips over the past 10 months, we were hooked up to shore power. I kept a check on the voltage during our only boondocking trip with a multi meter making sure to not draw the original battery down any lower than 12.1. Your thoughts?

[PSU Turf]

If it were me I would do it. It's about $120. Start saving for lithium. Over a few years you might find you are doing more boon docking and want to get more solar panels. The lithiums will make even more sense and will probably be a lot cheaper.