Batteries need constant charging, what am I missing?

[bcrush]

A lot to respond to, but I have a couple busy days coming up and probably won’t be able to give detailed responses until after I’m settled again in a new campground. Thanks everyone for the responses so far.

I managed to pick up two GC2 batteries from NAPA (this took a lot of driving around to find these). They’re model 8144s from their website. I hope these are suitable for what I’m doing. Would these be AGM or Flooded as far as my Solar Controller settings go? Their website says Glass Mat but I found other resources online saying flooded.

Will see how these do over the next few days (and yes, hooked them up in series).

For my own education, what are the benefits of the GC batteries? It sounds like they’re able to be run much lower without damaging the battery, and last longer per charge. Do they charge faster?

I tried picking up some 200w solar panels but it was a large premium to have them delivered while I was at camp. I feel like I need to do more research on these before spending that much money. The Trailer promotes Go Power so I was looking at their portable 200w unit. No idea if the hookups are proprietary or if I could use a cheaper competitors.

[Too Tall]

Originally Posted by bcrush

A lot to respond to, but I have a couple busy days coming up and probably won’t be able to give detailed responses until after I’m settled again in a new campground. Thanks everyone for the responses so far.

I managed to pick up two GC2 batteries from NAPA (this took a lot of driving around to find these). They’re model 8144s from their website. I hope these are suitable for what I’m doing. Would these be AGM or Flooded as far as my Solar Controller settings go? Their website says Glass Mat but I found other resources online saying flooded.

Will see how these do over the next few days (and yes, hooked them up in series).

For my own education, what are the benefits of the GC batteries? It sounds like they’re able to be run much lower without damaging the battery, and last longer per charge. Do they charge faster?

I tried picking up some 200w solar panels but it was a large premium to have them delivered while I was at camp. I feel like I need to do more research on these before spending that much money. The Trailer promotes Go Power so I was looking at their portable 200w unit. No idea if the hookups are proprietary or if I could use a cheaper competitors.

Yes, those are flooded lead acid. You'll need to add distilled water periodically. That's the same battery as Duracell from Sams or Battery Plus. That 230 amp/hr each so as 12 volts 230 amp/hrs. That's more than two 12 volts and the foot print is smaller (but taller). It's a true deep cycle so you can pull it down to 50% without damage. https://youtu.be/foLGtyt9Rsg

[Tom48]

To answer your question. Golf cart batteries are going to be a better grade of true deep cycle battery. That means they will take a deeper discharge hold on to their charge tighter and all and all two of them have the same footprint as two group 24 batteries but will present you with 230 amps where a typical pair of group 24 batteries at best will provide about 150 amps.

The depot that you discharge any battery the more of its life you're going to be taking the golf cart battery will tolerate discharge to 50% or about 11.99 volts in stride. They're more likely to recover from discharge down to 11 volts then a non deep cycle battery. Still not recommended to go below 12.0 but they are sturdier stuff

[NJKris]

Originally Posted by bcrush

A lot to respond to, but I have a couple busy days coming up and probably won’t be able to give detailed responses until after I’m settled again in a new campground. Thanks everyone for the responses so far.

I managed to pick up two GC2 batteries from NAPA (this took a lot of driving around to find these). They’re model 8144s from their website. I hope these are suitable for what I’m doing. Would these be AGM or Flooded as far as my Solar Controller settings go? Their website says Glass Mat but I found other resources online saying flooded.

Will see how these do over the next few days (and yes, hooked them up in series).

For my own education, what are the benefits of the GC batteries? It sounds like they’re able to be run much lower without damaging the battery, and last longer per charge. Do they charge faster?

I tried picking up some 200w solar panels but it was a large premium to have them delivered while I was at camp. I feel like I need to do more research on these before spending that much money. The Trailer promotes Go Power so I was looking at their portable 200w unit. No idea if the hookups are proprietary or if I could use a cheaper competitors.

Do not get sucked into the "I have GoPower controller (or whatever brand) therefore I should get same brand panels, or I have a Furrion mount for back up cam, so I need to get Furrion". This is exactly what those companies want you to believe, so you buy their overpriced (and in case of Furrion, inferior) products.

[tomkatb]

https://www.doityourselfrv.com/stop-...le-rv-battery/

Something on batteries.

[U.S.ArmyVeteran]

Don't have any solid numbers to share. And we don't boondock a lot. But last time our El cheapo dealer battery kept our 12 VDC 10 CUBIC FOOT FRIDGE going all nite. With the usual water pump, lites and typical minor draw.

This was 12 hours. From generator off to generator on.

YMMV

[bbells]

Fyi, flat on the roof your 190w panels probably only put out about 100watts of power, if they are in direct sunlight. In a day that means they will only output/ refill the battery about 500wh. If in any shade it would be significantly less. Your fridge uses, 45watts. That would mean in 9 hours it would use up all the power you created during the day. If you are using marine or hybrid batteries you would run dry in about 2 days with fridge and lights running.

[boondocking]

Originally Posted by bbells

Fyi, flat on the roof your 190w panels probably only put out about 100watts of power, if they are in direct sunlight. In a day that means they will only output/ refill the battery about 500wh. If in any shade it would be significantly less. Your fridge uses, 45watts. That would mean in 9 hours it would use up all the power you created during the day. If you are using marine or hybrid batteries you would run dry in about 2 days with fridge and lights running.

If they are shaded a bit then maybe 100 watts. Full direct sun, full wattage produced.

[nic7320]

Is this a 12V compressor driven refrigerator or a combo propane/120VAC/12VDC absorption fridge? Running the later on a battery will kill your battery quick. Even running it on 120VAC at home can double your electric bill. Absorption refrigerators are horribly inefficient on electric power, AC or DC. I measured mine on a normal day with temperatures around 75F and it was 300 - 350 watts... all day long. That's 7200 watt hours minimum, much more than lead acid batteries can handle.

[bbells]

Originally Posted by boondocking

If they are shaded a bit then maybe 100 watts. Full direct sun, full wattage produced.

Sorry, do some research. Panels only put out full wattage when pointed directly at the sun. That means angled 38 degrees in my area, more or less of an angle in others. Even partial shade can cut the output by 80% to 90%. Flat panels on the roof rarely put out any more than 60% of the rated power, and that is mainly when the sun is directly overhead for an hour or so. The rest of the day much less.

[boondocking]

Originally Posted by bbells

Sorry, do some research. Panels only put out full wattage when pointed directly at the sun. That means angled 38 degrees in my area, more or less of an angle in others. Even partial shade can cut the output by 80% to 90%. Flat panels on the roof rarely put out any more than 60% of the rated power, and that is mainly when the sun is directly overhead for an hour or so. The rest of the day much less.

Those must be really inefficient panels at 60% or less.

No need to research!
I have 200 watts on the roof and according to my monitor I get on average 190 watts in full sun. And they are not angled as you says they should be.

I must have some pretty special panels.

[viasolis]

Pretty clear the 12V frig is your big drain – why they would install a 12V ONLY frig in a rig designed for boondocking is another thread that should be on this forum. Be sure to step back and reassess your true needs for refrigeration. Can you function with a cooler instead? Are there 12V coolers that use a lot less power (or run off a Jackery) that could suffice? I know it’s insult to injury to suggest these alternatives, but the cost of more solar and it’s attendant hook-ups, the 3X to 5X cost for LiFePo’s AND the need to change out your charger to get past the 80% barrier are big bucks.


Sometimes, we are so focused on solving a problem that we don’t even consider if the problem is worthy of the solution developed.

[bbells]

Originally Posted by boondocking

Those must be really inefficient panels at 60% or less.

No need to research!
I have 200 watts on the roof and according to my monitor I get on average 190 watts in full sun. And they are not angled as you says they should be.

I must have some pretty special panels.

Yep. What you are saying is impossible. You can't get 100% production from any panel, especially if it is flat on a roof. Your meter is defective, or you are only checking it at one point in the day.

[BRC]

Couple things I'm thinking. 1 is the solar defeated from charging when the generator is running because the GP controller thinks the Voltage is at a fully charged level? Also the OP should use Boost feature on GP controller at least once, maybe 2 times per day in good sunlight to push batteries to full charge. Full charge takes a long time without using Boost which is a great feature. We have no problems noondocking in NV wintertime but have propane gridge

[boondocking]

Here my friend do some research.

You have been mis-informed.

[{Tpc}]

I just skipped to the end so forgive me. The 12v fridge is killing the batteries. One regular 12v deep cycle is going to net you about 6 hours. Two should put you at 12 hours, so dying overnight is exactly what I would expect, because the solar can’t keep up for one and two it doesn’t work so well in the dark, right?

Unfortunately for a lot of boondocking, a fridge that would run off propane would be best. Of course that option is gone for you now.

Suggestion would be to switch to the golf cart style batteries with more capacity, and maybe beef up the solar, or run the gennys longer.

I have a 12v fridge. Dealer told me to expect 6 hours. I turned it on, 6 hours later and the battery was near dead. I have 2 batteries now so twice the amount of time, but I don’t boondock. I just can’t plug mine in when I am home getting ready for a trip.

[nic7320]

The specified wattage on solar panels occurs when the panels are brand new, illuminated at 1000 watts per square meter, and the panels are kept at 25C.

That rarely happens outside of a test lab, except on very bright, very cold days (in Denver, maybe). On cold days with a little breeze you might see even more than the specified wattage if the panels are colder than 25C. Higher temperatures reduce solar panel output and lower temperatures tend to increase it.

As panels age, a little extra power is also lost every year due to age and sunlight induced degredation. This is an unfortunate reality of semiconductor physics and one they are trying to solve.

So getting less solar than the label is normal, especially on a hot day.

[Mikec557]

Originally Posted by boondocking

Those must be really inefficient panels at 60% or less.

No need to research!
I have 200 watts on the roof and according to my monitor I get on average 190 watts in full sun. And they are not angled as you says they should be.

I must have some pretty special panels.

I must have bought my panels from the same Special Store. (I guess we just know how to shop ;-) In my case Renogy by way of Amazon. 160 watt panels (2x) at 7.9 amp optimal... By Victron BMV-712 reports 16.5A between 11:30am and 1:30pm... and 12.5A at 10:00am. And they're worse than flat on the roof. The curved arch roof of my Keystone Cougar has them staring off into space like Monty Python!

Edit, my data was recorded daily for 21 days camping in Cortez Colorado from June 30-July 20th, 2021. I turned off the breaker for the charger/converter, and never turned it on. I consumed between 35Ah and 48Ah each night (various weather and needs). Night is defined as sun was low enough to NOT provide more amps than I was consuming; and ending in the morning when the sun rose enough that the panels produced at least 2-3Ah MORE than I was consuming.

[Mikec557]

To the OP

If you have room for another 190 watt panel, that would cure a lot of your issues. Especially since you've already upgraded to two golf cart batteries.

Alternatively, A portable 200 watt suitcase would likewise help, but then you have to stay in camp to keep them from walking away.

[frankhaas]

Originally Posted by bcrush

Hey everyone,

I've had my 2021 ePro 19FD about 9 months now and have just started boondocking for the first time over the past month. I've never had a problem with the power system before, but it seems like something isn't working right when not on shore power.

I have the 190w solar panels on the trailer, two Champion 2500w propane generators, and two Interstate SRM-24 Batteries (Dealer installed).

My first experience boondocking, the batteries completely died overnight. I'd been plugged into shore power the week before and towed straight to the new location, so the batteries should have had a full charge. After the batteries died that night, I ran the generators for several hours to run the AC and charge back up. They only got up to about 60-75% (I wasn't closely monitoring numbers at this point) and didn't make it through the night again.

After that weekend, I was back on shore power for a couple weeks. I thought the batteries must be shot to not hold a charge, so I went to Interstate and swapped them out for two brand new ones. At this point, I'm closely monitoring their behavior. These new ones work better, but still don't seem to last as long as I would have expected them to.

My next experience boondocking, the batteries started out around 80% when I arrived that evening and slowly creeped down overnight until they were around 20% when I woke up. Even being in full sun the next day with the 190w panels, they still only got up to around 50-60% before it got dark. Overnight, they slowly crept down again and were at 0% when I woke up. This pattern has been pretty consistent over the past couple weeks. I run one of the generators about 4-5 hours a day, the batteries get up to around 70-80%, then slowly trickle down overnight until they're around 10-20% in the morning.

I don't feel like I'm being excessive in my power usage....pretty much the only thing I use overnight are interior lights and the water pump as needed. I think I've eliminated all the ancillary power draws (TV Antenna), and the only things still pulling would be the CO Detector, 12V Fridge, etc.

Would the 12V Fridge require that much power to constantly draw down like that?

Am I not understanding the Go Power Charge Controller (Why would I still be able to turn the lights on when it reads 0%)?

I know you're not supposed to let these batteries get under ~50% but this seems impossible when they go through 60% of charge overnight.

I'm still relatively new to this, but thought I had a good handle on these systems from all the research I did. All I'm really trying to do each day is have some lights on when it's dark outside, use some kitchen appliances to prep meals, and watch an hour or two of TV a day, and occasionally charge phones/laptop. I really thought the 190w panels would handle this with ease and only got the generators to run AC on hot days or to provide a boost on cloudy days. Now I'm that guy running a generator all day at the campground.

Distilled water is very important..Have to fill mine every few months.