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Old 09-08-2021, 07:29 PM   #1
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Finished LiFePO4 install

I had 2 FLA 80Ah batteries in the front storage. Also have a residential fridge with 1200W inverter. Got a SOK 206Ah LiFePO4 that came in today, so I decided to clean things up.

This is what the left side of my front storage looked like (the right side just had a battery and a 10 ft / 6 ga wire running to the battery cutoff switch):



I found a great spot in the basement under the steps for the new LiFePO4 and all the accessories. I also moved the inverter from the front basement wall to the wall of the steps opposite the LiFePO4 storage. Here's the new install:



All wires are 2ga. except the inverter chassis ground (6ga. x 1 ft) and the accessory line running to front storage (8ga. x 5 ft, 30A).

Here's where the inverter is:



The main power wires are 1 foot. I also installed a remote panel for the inverter inside the closet where the all the slide switches and tank monitors are.

Installed a Progressive Dynamics LiFePO4 converter / charger where the WFCO was:



I just left it where the original was right behind the power panel. I did run 2ga. wire (4 ft) to the battery area instead of the 6ga. they had running all the way to the front storage where the FLA batteries used to be.

I still need to apply heat to the heat shrink tubing. And put some wire loom around wires that go through holes.

The nice thing is the 2ga wire will handle 200A easy. No wire is longer than 12" except the one running up to the converter/charger (4').

Overall, I am very pleased. The front storage area is now free of batteries and very tidy. The basement storage area doesn't have a giant inverter sticking out into it. And I am all set for more upgrades. Slide in a second SOK 206Ah LiFePO4, swap out the 100A CB for a 200A CB, install a 3000W inverter and 400W of solar and I am all set!
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Old 09-09-2021, 06:21 AM   #2
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Looks good, but then, again, Tesla I ain't.
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Old 09-09-2021, 12:24 PM   #3
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This is a picture of my roof. Seems like an ideal place for lots of solar panels.
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Old 09-09-2021, 02:10 PM   #4
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This is what I took out of the trailer. That is an amazing amount of wire. I used a grand total of 4 ft of black 2ga and 6 ft of red 2ga. There must be 50' of wire sitting there. How much voltage drop is that?
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Old 09-09-2021, 02:49 PM   #5
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Looks Great! Plus you should have dropped a good amount of weight by replacing the two lead acids with one LiFePO4.

I am interested how well that battery works. The SOK 206Ah cost close to the same as some 100Ah. Sounds to good to be true so wondering if it is?

Thanks for sharing!
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Old 09-09-2021, 02:59 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by SK ON THE ROAD View Post
Looks Great! Plus you should have dropped a good amount of weight by replacing the two lead acids with one LiFePO4.

I am interested how well that battery works. The SOK 206Ah cost close to the same as some 100Ah. Sounds to good to be true so wondering if it is?

Thanks for sharing!
I went with SOK because of the reviews by Will Prowse. I read his book and watched his videos and he recommends this battery on his web site. So far, it provides power.

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Old 09-10-2021, 03:47 PM   #7
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You're close to me, I might have to pick your brain some day! I once did an AGM, battery monitor, inverter, solar controller and panel install on a popup, but everything was sooo much closer together and easier to get at.

I'm dealing with a new to me big fifth wheel that has one tiny battery and an inverter that doesn't seem to work to power the fridge.

I'm looking into LiFePO4 batteries, but I'm a bit overwhelmed with the need to change my coach converter, worry about temperatures for charging, deal with alternator protection for the TV, etc. Glad to see somebody make it look easy!
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Old 09-10-2021, 07:52 PM   #8
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Nice work! You said 2 ga wire and "200 amps." I'm guessing you meant 2/0 gauge wire? Though I'm concerned because the photos don't suggest 2/0.
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Old 09-11-2021, 05:51 PM   #9
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Nice work! You said 2 ga wire and "200 amps." I'm guessing you meant 2/0 gauge wire? Though I'm concerned because the photos don't suggest 2/0.
OP mentioned only 4' run (one direction) with 2 ga wire. According to wirebarn wire size calculator #2 awg wire is good for just over 8 ft which would most likely be his round trip wire length. 200 amp would yield only 2% voltage drop.

2/0 would certainly be better but not necessary. Especially considering how the most common load on an inverter, a microwave, only causes ~125-130 amp draw.

The key to OP's install is short wire lengths. Good thing considering the cost of heavier gauge wire.
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Old 09-12-2021, 01:21 AM   #10
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OP mentioned only 4' run (one direction) with 2 ga wire. According to wirebarn wire size calculator #2 awg wire is good for just over 8 ft which would most likely be his round trip wire length. 200 amp would yield only 2% voltage drop.

2/0 would certainly be better but not necessary. Especially considering how the most common load on an inverter, a microwave, only causes ~125-130 amp draw.

The key to OP's install is short wire lengths. Good thing considering the cost of heavier gauge wire.
You are talking about voltage drop. I should have been clearer. I had in mind the "200 amps" relative to the ampacity of 90C 2 gauge wire. It's 130 amps.
90C 1/0 is only 170 amps and 90C 2/0 is 195 amps. I'm assuming he's talking 90C wire here. If not, the current rating is even lower.
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Old 09-12-2021, 05:29 AM   #11
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It is 2ga wire. I will want to upgrade to 2/0 wire if I go to a 200A system. All the 200A paths are very short so I won't need a lot of wire.

I ordered a 400W solar system, so that will go in next. We'll use this setup for the rest of this season and decide if we want to go bigger on the inverter side.

Speaking of inverters, I am thinking about just adding another inverter for the additional loads. Just leave the 1200W for the fridge and add another 2000W for the rest of the systems I want to run, the microwave being the big driver. I think I like having a dedicated inverter for the residential fridge vs running that through a transfer panel.
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Old 09-12-2021, 08:23 AM   #12
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Speaking of inverters, I am thinking about just adding another inverter for the additional loads. Just leave the 1200W for the fridge and add another 2000W for the rest of the systems I want to run, the microwave being the big driver. I think I like having a dedicated inverter for the residential fridge vs running that through a transfer panel.

In my TT I have three Inverters.

I have a 300 w TSW inverter that is dedicated to the TV, DVD player, and Sound bar.

A 1 kw TSW inverter dedicated to a freezer in my Outside Kitchen

and a 2 KW Inverter that I fire up to run Microwave and any other kitchen appliance I choose.

The 300 W and 1 KW inverters have overheads of <1 amp. The 2 Kw inverter is ~ 2 amp.

The freezer only runs when I choose to fill it for long off grid trips. The TV runs for hours vs microwave/kitchen appliances only minutes so no need for wasting the extra power to run items that in total consume less than 100w when running.
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Old 09-12-2021, 08:28 AM   #13
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In my TT I have three Inverters.

I have a 300 w TSW inverter that is dedicated to the TV, DVD player, and Sound bar.

A 1 kw TSW inverter dedicated to a freezer in my Outside Kitchen

and a 2 KW Inverter that I fire up to run Microwave and any other kitchen appliance I choose.

The 300 W and 1 KW inverters have overheads of <1 amp. The 2 Kw inverter is ~ 2 amp.

The freezer only runs when I choose to fill it for long off grid trips. The TV runs for hours vs microwave/kitchen appliances only minutes so no need for wasting the extra power to run items that in total consume less than 100w when running.
I like that plan. A lot.
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Old 09-12-2021, 08:29 AM   #14
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You are talking about voltage drop. I should have been clearer. I had in mind the "200 amps" relative to the ampacity of 90C 2 gauge wire. It's 130 amps.
90C 1/0 is only 170 amps and 90C 2/0 is 195 amps. I'm assuming he's talking 90C wire here. If not, the current rating is even lower.
Most 12 volt Inverter installations use welding cable.

This chart shows that #2 awg welding cable, rated for 75C is more than adequate for the system under discussion.

https://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-z...les-sizes5.jpg

Note the footnote on the chart. Expected operating temps of 104 F which are representative of operating temps one might encounter in an RV installation.
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Old 09-12-2021, 01:10 PM   #15
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This is the spec sheet for the 2 awg cable I have. Seems to indicate max amps is 205.

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Old 09-12-2021, 02:09 PM   #16
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Most 12 volt Inverter installations use welding cable.

This chart shows that #2 awg welding cable, rated for 75C is more than adequate for the system under discussion.
I beg to differ. Significantly. Welding is a very different application and duty cycle and current pattern than, say, baking a potato in a microwave. The table you referenced is fine for free-air and highly intermittent use. It is not applicable to typical RV use.
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Old 09-12-2021, 02:12 PM   #17
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I beg to differ. Significantly. Welding is a very different application and duty cycle and current pattern than, say, baking a potato in a microwave. The table you referenced is fine for free-air and highly intermittent use. It is not applicable to typical RV use.
SO when I add a second inverter I should upgrade my main feeds to 2/0? That's pretty easy to do.
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Old 09-12-2021, 02:14 PM   #18
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This is the spec sheet for the 2 awg cable I have. Seems to indicate max amps is 205.

That table is for arc welding. That's a very different application. Note especially "maximum amperage" which in welding occurs only momentarily when the arc is struck or sticks causing a short-circuit. RV use is much more like home or general shop usage. Other than flexibility, welding cable is just insulated copper wire, with a given temperature rating, and should be treated as such in home or RV use. A table as linked below is applicable.

And, as an aside, our RVs are supposed to meet the National Electrical Code including some sections specific to mobile situations. The NEC is the basis for this and similar tables. I.e., wire ratings are based on standards that we should be meeting.

https://www.usawire-cable.com/pdfs/nec%20ampacities.pdf
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Old 09-12-2021, 02:27 PM   #19
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It is 2ga wire. I will want to upgrade to 2/0 wire if I go to a 200A system. All the 200A paths are very short so I won't need a lot of wire.

I ordered a 400W solar system, so that will go in next. We'll use this setup for the rest of this season and decide if we want to go bigger on the inverter side.

Speaking of inverters, I am thinking about just adding another inverter for the additional loads. Just leave the 1200W for the fridge and add another 2000W for the rest of the systems I want to run, the microwave being the big driver. I think I like having a dedicated inverter for the residential fridge vs running that through a transfer panel.
Like Mike, I have multiple inverters. For 7 years a 900W inverter powered everything including an inverter microwave, espresso machine, toaster, vacuum cleaner, etc. Just one at a time.

I've since relegated the 900W unit to running a mini split A/C and installed an 1800W unit for all other loads. Interestingly, the 900W unit idles at 600 ma while the 1800W unit idles at 400 ma (both well below their specs). Both are unusually efficient at idle, but it's nice that the one I'd like to leave on virtually 24 hours idles at just 400 ma. So less than 10 Ah in 24 hours.

BTW, with some inverter makers, the inverter model number does not reflect a continuous rating. In my own case the model numbers suggest 1000 and 2000 Watts but in reality the continuous ratings are 900 and 1800. The model numbers reflect a five minute rating.
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Old 09-12-2021, 03:28 PM   #20
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I beg to differ. Significantly. Welding is a very different application and duty cycle and current pattern than, say, baking a potato in a microwave. The table you referenced is fine for free-air and highly intermittent use. It is not applicable to typical RV use.
Marine wiring charts show the same numbers.

The big disconnect is that electricians working with high a/c voltages in residential and commercial as application look at 12-24 volt automotive, marine, and RV wire sizing through the same lens.

Those applications rarely involve wires in conduits where heating is an issue or in "free air" as you stated.

Voltage drop alone is the main consideration. Low voltage drop, minimal heating.

Back to the OP's installation, one may DESIRE larger wire but #2 wire is more than adequate for his application.

BTW "baking a potato in a microwave" is a very similar duty cycle to that of welding. 6 to 8 minutes of cook or same time between "stick changes" on welding cable.
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