Inverter

Orlando bull · 02-19-2018, 09:09 PM

Hi all, our new TH came with a residential fridge and xantrex freedom x1200 inverter. I was looking at the inverter today and it doesn't have any display, leds, etc. I tinkered with it a bit and got the screen to flicker a few times, but, that was it.

I am plugged in to 15A power right now, but, tried it with and without. Is the inverter what should be charging my battery?

I searched a couple threads and saw a suggestion to remove the negative battery terminal to reset it, I'll try that tomorrow or Wednesday, just wanted to see if there are other thoughts out there. Is there a fuse or breaker for this thing? It's in my forward basement area, so, at least easy to get to.

Thanks!

richp · 02-20-2018, 02:27 PM

Hi,

Presuming your battery or batteries are well charged, I would start with checking the wiring. Go through every connection down the line to the inverter and back, to be sure you are solid electrically. Occasional flickering sound suspicious...

Hope this helps.

Rich Phillips

Orlando bull · 02-20-2018, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by richp

Hi,

Presuming your battery or batteries are well charged, I would start with checking the wiring. Go through every connection down the line to the inverter and back, to be sure you are solid electrically. Occasional flickering sound suspicious...

Hope this helps.

Rich Phillips

Thanks Rich, that's what I'll do this coming weekend if I can't figure it out in quick trips before then. The battery charge is certainly a possibility, however, isn't the battery supposed to be charging when connected to shore power? I picked up the TT 10 days ago and it's been plugged in for all except maybe 2 days since then, so, I would think that it should be sufficiently charged. This is the "x" inverter, so, it doesn't have the charging built in, I assume the charging happens through the stock converter then?

I am an engineer by trade, but, electrical kicked my tail in school. I can connect wires and test things, but, the deeper understanding of how it actually works doesn't come naturally to me.

richp · 02-20-2018, 03:31 PM

Hi,

Well if any of the battery connections weren't tight (or those from or at the converter either -- as separate from the inverter), you might not have been getting the charge you thought you were from shore power. I suppose checking fluid level in the battery would come in here somewhere as well, but that's a bit further down the list.

The battery is just a starting point, of course. A loose nut anywhere in the circuit could deprive the inverter of the juice it needs for continuous operation.

Or it could be dead or dying...

FWIW, and good luck.

Rich

**Bama Rambler** · 02-20-2018, 04:55 PM

You say there's no indicators or display working on the inverter, but you got it to flicker and few times.

When you unplug shore power is the inverter powering the fridge?

At any rate, it sounds like a warranty issue.

Orlando bull · 02-20-2018, 06:54 PM

Well, I'd like to think that I would have found it on my own, but, Rich was dead on. The numbnuts at the dealership connected the positive wire to the battery completely wrapped in electrical tape. There was a small connection through the tape, but, not solid, so, over the course of bringing it home, it must have loosened up just enough to not make connection. The flickers may have been from wiggling the wires and it temporarily making connection.

Anyway, problem solved, I didn't have much time to check function, it had errors when it fired up, I turned off for a bit and when I turned it back on, all seemed ok. The outdoor kitchen mini fridge was working off of the inverter though, so, I think all should be well at this point. I'll do more checks next weekend. TT is parked at my parents house and conveniently my toddler spends her afternoons at Grandma's, so, I get 10-15 min in the afternoons when I pick her up to do short projects.

Thanks for the help, probably would have seen it, but, the advice to check all connections had it fresh in my mind when I opened up the battery box.

CHICKDOE · 02-21-2018, 08:02 AM

are the batteries charged? you said you had it hooked up to shore power for 10 days. however, if you have the battery disconnect boff (ie batteries disconnected) the converter will not charge the batteries. on many models the inverter that is up front is directly connected to the batteries and is not connected or disconnected by the battery disconnect switch. thus you can have a situation where the inverter may draw down the batteries and they are not getting recharged from the converter.

Orlando bull · 02-21-2018, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CHICKDOE

are the batteries charged? you said you had it hooked up to shore power for 10 days. however, if you have the battery disconnect boff (ie batteries disconnected) the converter will not charge the batteries. on many models the inverter that is up front is directly connected to the batteries and is not connected or disconnected by the battery disconnect switch. thus you can have a situation where the inverter may draw down the batteries and they are not getting recharged from the converter.

I think everything is good. There are two wires connecting to the battery, I suspect that one goes to the inverter and one to the converter, but, I didn't have time to trace the wires. Certainly, one set goes to the inverter (it's right through the front wall) and I didn't see anything coming out of there that would indicate that the rest of the RV is wired through the inverter, so, I think that is the case... In any event, one set of wires was making full connection, so, lights, electric jacks, slide, etc. were working through the battery. I believe that system should have also been charging the battery and the inverter seemed to show full charge on the battery when I cycled through the screens.

I turned the inverter off when I left, so, it shouldn't be drawing (much anyway) from the battery at this point.

Let me know if none of that makes any sense and I am way off base on the whole system. I read somewhere that you shouldn't stay plugged in full time to keep the battery charged, if that's the case, I'll probably disconnect the battery this weekend and reconnect maybe a week before our next outing to have everything ready to go.

CedarCreekWoody · 02-21-2018, 08:53 AM

Just to clarify, the inverter does not charge your battery. It is charged by the converter, which is a separate device.

Orlando bull · 02-21-2018, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CedarCreekWoody

Just to clarify, the inverter does not charge your battery. It is charged by the converter, which is a separate device.

Thanks! As I found more info on the inverter, I realized this wasn't the inverter/charger model, so, I figured that out. I think that is why my battery is charged, because the connection to the converter was good.

Thanks everyone for all of the help. Even though I am under warranty, I don't like to take things in that I am capable of fixing myself. One, I have to trust the dealer to do a good job, and two, I need to learn all I can before I am out of warranty so I can continue to maintain things. I am sure I'll have more questions as we spend more time in our camper.

Orlando bull · 02-23-2018, 09:34 PM

Ok... Still weirdness happening.

Plugged in to shore power with inverter off works
Battery with inverter on works (no shore power)
Battery only with inverter off i don't have anything
Plugged in to shore with inverter on kicks the breaker on the house panel

I'm going to try to disconnect the inverter from the battery and see if that works, but, it's weird. I'm confident battery is charged, it will run everything through the inverter. I'm wondering if either the inverter or converter is wired in reverse?

I checked the fuses in the converter, nothing seems to be blown. Haven't had a chance to check for any fuses near the battery. We booked our next trip for 3/22. I'd like to fix it, but, I can make it through that trip and then take it in for service if necessary.

Is it weird for both the inverter and the rest of the system to be wired direct to the battery (two sets of wires)? Should the 12v just pass through the inverter, then on to the fuse panel?

**Bama Rambler** · 02-24-2018, 07:58 AM

When you say "Battery only with inverter off i don't have anything" does that mean that you don't have 12 volt or 120 volt power? With the inverter off you should still have 12 volt power.

Quote:

Plugged in to shore with inverter on kicks the breaker on the house panel

If you are on shore power and have the inverter on, you're trying to supply power from two different sources with two different phase angles, so tripping a breaker is the result.

Having said that, there should be a transfer switch either internal or external to the inverter that takes the inverter out of the circuit when shore power is on.

Orlando bull · 02-24-2018, 08:10 AM

Thanks. With no inverter, I don't even get 12v, with it on, it seems like it's energizing the converter and the 12v works.

This inverter is supposed to have an automatic transfer. I get an error when I plug in to shore power and then it trips the breaker. I'm going to try disconnecting the inverter to see if that gets the 12v back online, then deal with the inverter. I feel like it's 2 separate issues right now.

**Bama Rambler** · 02-24-2018, 08:12 PM

It looks like you may have two different problems.

**Flybob** · 02-24-2018, 08:43 PM

Plugged in to shore power with inverter off works
Battery with inverter on works (no shore power)
Battery only with inverter off i don't have anything
Plugged in to shore with inverter on kicks the breaker on the house panel

A little confusing. When you say battery only with inverter off nothing are you saying Fridge doesn't work or 12V lights don't work, Fridge will not work unless inverter on or plugged into shore power. If the battery connection was bad as you said, you may not have been charging for two weeks and battery could be weak. Disconnect shore power and measure battery voltage.

rockfordroo · 02-24-2018, 09:00 PM

From your posts, I'm not sure you are understanding the flow path of power from your shore power connection to the fridge.

Shore power (120VAC) goes through your main circuit breaker, which feeds all the other circuit breakers. One of those circuit breaker is the one that supplies 120VAC to your converter. Your converter changes the 120VAC to 12 VDC and feeds it through fuses to power all your 12volt loads AND to charge the battery. (The 12 volt loads and battery basically are on the same wire or "bus," although there may be some fuses involved; also note that the battery can be both a "load" and a "source of power" depending on which way the power if flowing - it's a load when being charged and a power source when providing 12 volts).

When you are NOT on shore power, the battery is supplying power to the 12volt loads.
One of those loads is your inverter, which takes 12VDC from the 12 volt bus and converts it back to 120VAC for your residential fridge. As I understand it, shore power is also supplied to the inverter. If you have shore power available, the inverter will simply pass the 120VAC through it to supply the fridge, without using 12volt power. But when the shore power goes away, the inverter switches over to the 12 volt bus, being supplied by the battery, to power the fridge.

You should read wmtire's newbie info on electricity in RV's. I've shamelessly posted his information in Post #11 here:

http://www.forestriverforums.com/for...-149985-2.html

Orlando bull · 02-24-2018, 09:01 PM

Battery is good, I checked it. I wired up a 30amp shore outlet today and that solved the breaker issue, so, I can leave the inverter on full time and all is well. I'm wondering if that's the intended set up.

When I said nothing previously, it was literally nothing except tounge Jack and stabilizers. No lights, slide, etc. Certainly no ac with inverter off.

I have a few little warranty things to get taken care of after our next trip, so, I'll have the dealer check it out then to confirm. Voltage test confirms nothing to the converter when inverter is off, but, I get 12v when the inverter is on (tested unplugged from shore). There's also only 1 set of wires to the converter, so, it has to go through the inverter. The second set of wires at the battery ppear to be direct connections to the jack/stabilizers. Kind of makes sense.

The fridge also does not work on the inverter. Not even the light in there. That outlet must be isolated somehow. The mini fridge in the outdoor kitchen works fine off of the inverter.

Long story short, there may not be anything wrong at all, or, there is some hidden fuse blocking direct DC power from the converter, but, allowing AC power to get there. I don't see how though, one set of wires off battery appear to go direct to inverter, the other set only looks like it stays outside of the trailer and directly energizes the tongue Jack and stabs.

Thanks for all the replies and thoughts, definitely gave me some things to check and I'm getting familiar with my trailer, so, it's a good experience.

Cabinfever97 · 02-24-2018, 09:02 PM

Possible if batteries were not charging correctly during sub freezing temps the batteries could have been damaged. Like others have said, have batteries checked to be sure they are good then go forward from there.

rockfordroo · 02-24-2018, 09:26 PM

I'd be surprised if your outdoor fridge runs of the inverter, but I could be wrong.

Is you battery disconnect turned on?

Orlando bull · 02-24-2018, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockfordroo

I'd be surprised if your outdoor fridge runs of the inverter, but I could be wrong.

Is you battery disconnect turned on?

No disconnect installed yet, on my to do list.

Outdoor fridge definitely works, I had it off and turned on for the sole purpose of checking.

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