Inverter on or off when on shore power

[Bama Rambler]

I don't like on and off nor engage/disengage, nor many of the other terms I've seen used. The proper terms are Open and Closed. When the switch is open no connection is made and when it's closed the connection is made across it.

Having said that, almost all the single pole battery switches I've seen have On and Off on them, so I guess we'll all have to conform!

[bubbles]

Originally Posted by Bama Rambler

I don't like on and off nor engage/disengage, nor many of the other terms I've seen used. The proper terms are Open and Closed. When the switch is open no connection is made and when it's closed the connection is made across it.

Having said that, almost all the single pole battery switches I've seen have On and Off on them, so I guess we'll all have to conform!

And therein lies the rub because the switch is labeled "BATTERY DISCONNECT".

[CarolynT]

Thank you all for the responses. I feel I now have a much better understanding of how the system works. We'll leave the batteries and inverter on while hooked up to shore power and disconnect only when going in storage.

[NJKris]

You mean leave the CONveter on. Two separate things. Converter takes shore power and makes DC to charge your battery, Inverter takes your battery's 12v and makes AC power.

The converter is on automatically when connected to shore power.

[bubbles]

Originally Posted by NJKris

You mean leave the CONveter on. Two separate things. Converter takes shore power and makes DC to charge your battery, Inverter takes your battery's 12v and makes AC power.

The converter is on automatically when connected to shore power.

No, the OP has it correct.

[formerFR]

...this discussion reveals why 'advice' on subjects like this can get a little confusing for the new'er' owner...as so many RVs are different in their systems and how they 'handle' power.

For a fifth wheel with an Inverter, you can't simply make the assumption about whether it should be 'off' or whether it should be 'on' when on Shore Power. Why? because many RVs are built with a different purpose for the Inverter, meaning that it might be wired simply to provide power to the Residential 120v Fridge ONLY, needing to be on ALL the time to power the fridge, REGARDLESS of whether you are on shore power, or not. Other RVs might be wired where the Fridge is powered either way, meaning that you can turn the Inverter OFF, if you wish, when on Shore Power. Wiring schemes can be very different, even sometimes between model years of the same unit, or within the different models within the same manufacturer.


If your 120v Residential Fridge is still receiving power when you are plugged into Shore Power, and you have turned OFF the inverter, then you have shore power flowing directly to the fridge.
If not, then your Fridge requires the Inverter to always be ON in order for the batteries to provide it power, while the Converter's CHARGER charges those batteries at the same time.

For those of us with 'whole house' Inverters, meaning that all outlets in the coach work when not plugged into Shore Power and the Inverter is ON, leaving the Inverter ON while on Shore POwer is simply a way to provide a 'back up' power in the event the shore power is lost, whether due to an outage, or a problem at the power pedestal, or just in the event the main breaker at the pedestal trips.
It may seem silly, but loosing power and having your Satellite Receiver having to reset and go thru it's acquisition for 15minutes afterwards is sometimes aggravating, but if you leave you Inverter ON, and ready to provide power, a loss of power from the campground is simply then a slight inconvenience, and not an aggravation, since you can continue doing most everything thru the Inverter.


Some Inverters, like the larger ones, also have an integrated Charger, so those RVs will not have a typical Converter, like most others. Since the Inverter and Charger perform the same overall function, and the 12v items run from the batteries anyway, no Converter is then needed.

[NJKris]

Learn something new every time. I was referencing my own little baby camper!

[formerFR]

...when it comes to 'leaving the batteries connected and charging', yes, there is no reason NOT to keep the batteries charging - they LIKE that!

Some folks have 'heard' things over the years, but the reality is that batteries like to be under charge...there is no 'downside' or issues with it. Your RV is perfectly designed to charge the batteries when and while they need it, and to maintain that charge. Your house batteries are really ALWAYS being used, even if only slightly, even with a Converter doing most of the work while on shore power. There are some devices, like C02 and Smoke detectors that are wired directly to the batteries, and not thru the Converter, so being on shore power has nothing to do with their usage, and why you'll always need the house batteries to be charged and/or maintained with at least a trickle charge.


Our coach has never had the house batteries 'disconnected'... and we've been traveling for over 100,000 miles over 5 years, with many 'stops' along the way where we were parked for MONTHS, while on shore power. The Inverter's integrated Battery Charger continues providing a charge constantly.

[5picker]

Originally Posted by formerFR

...this discussion reveals why 'advice' on subjects like this can get a little confusing for the new'er' owner...as so many RVs are different in their systems and how they 'handle' power.

For a fifth wheel with an Inverter, you can't simply make the assumption about whether it should be 'off' or whether it should be 'on' when on Shore Power. Why? because many RVs are built with a different purpose for the Inverter, meaning that it might be wired simply to provide power to the Residential 120v Fridge ONLY, needing to be on ALL the time to power the fridge, REGARDLESS of whether you are on shore power, or not. Other RVs might be wired where the Fridge is powered either way, meaning that you can turn the Inverter OFF, if you wish, when on Shore Power. Wiring schemes can be very different, even sometimes between model years of the same unit, or within the different models within the same manufacturer.


If your 120v Residential Fridge is still receiving power when you are plugged into Shore Power, and you have turned OFF the inverter, then you have shore power flowing directly to the fridge.
If not, then your Fridge requires the Inverter to always be ON in order for the batteries to provide it power, while the Converter's CHARGER charges those batteries at the same time.

For those of us with 'whole house' Inverters, meaning that all outlets in the coach work when not plugged into Shore Power and the Inverter is ON, leaving the Inverter ON while on Shore POwer is simply a way to provide a 'back up' power in the event the shore power is lost, whether due to an outage, or a problem at the power pedestal, or just in the event the main breaker at the pedestal trips.
It may seem silly, but loosing power and having your Satellite Receiver having to reset and go thru it's acquisition for 15minutes afterwards is sometimes aggravating, but if you leave you Inverter ON, and ready to provide power, a loss of power from the campground is simply then a slight inconvenience, and not an aggravation, since you can continue doing most everything thru the Inverter.


Some Inverters, like the larger ones, also have an integrated Charger, so those RVs will not have a typical Converter, like most others. Since the Inverter and Charger perform the same overall function, and the 12v items run from the batteries anyway, no Converter is then needed.

To reiterate and add to the confusion see the emboldened in blue above.
Mike has it right.

Many 5th wheel INverters ALSO charge the battery (no CONverter charging section) so turning the INverter off when connected to shore power would STOP battery charging.

One cannot assume all R/Vs and their components operate the same.

Some INverters simply supply 120v power when no shore power is available and others also charge the battery. The owner needs to know what THEIRS does.

[formerFR]

Originally Posted by 5picker

...so turning the INverter off when connected to shore power would STOP battery charging...

actually, that's ALSO an assumption, since many INVERTERS, like my Magnum, has two separate functions: Inverting, and Charging... so, therefore, turning OFF the Inverter does NOT turn off the Charger - you can continue charging even if you don't want the Inverter on.


See? It's all different, and yes, the owner has to get to know 'their' systems.
Most of the rest of us are just 'guesstimating', otherwise.

[NJKris]

BTW Carolyn, go into User CP and add your unit to your signature line, so in future posts we know what you have and some maniac like me doesn't give you information that doesn't apply to your unit. I know you told us what you have in the first post, but it will make it easier to not have to keep repeating yourself in other posts

[dusty3]

Wow. I thought I knew what I needed to know about my RV power distribution system but I don't. As soon as I have made a list of what I have and all of the options available to me in my tiny travel trailer I'll come back and read this thread again. Until then I'll leave the 7 wire cable to the tow vehicle disconnected along with the on board battery. Shore power only and no battery charging.

[dalford]

Originally Posted by formerFR

...this discussion reveals why 'advice' on subjects like this can get a little confusing for the new'er' owner...as so many RVs are different in their systems and how they 'handle' power.

For a fifth wheel with an Inverter, you can't simply make the assumption about whether it should be 'off' or whether it should be 'on' when on Shore Power. Why? because many RVs are built with a different purpose for the Inverter, meaning that it might be wired simply to provide power to the Residential 120v Fridge ONLY, needing to be on ALL the time to power the fridge, REGARDLESS of whether you are on shore power, or not. Other RVs might be wired where the Fridge is powered either way, meaning that you can turn the Inverter OFF, if you wish, when on Shore Power. Wiring schemes can be very different, even sometimes between model years of the same unit, or within the different models within the same manufacturer.


If your 120v Residential Fridge is still receiving power when you are plugged into Shore Power, and you have turned OFF the inverter, then you have shore power flowing directly to the fridge.
If not, then your Fridge requires the Inverter to always be ON in order for the batteries to provide it power, while the Converter's CHARGER charges those batteries at the same time.

For those of us with 'whole house' Inverters, meaning that all outlets in the coach work when not plugged into Shore Power and the Inverter is ON, leaving the Inverter ON while on Shore POwer is simply a way to provide a 'back up' power in the event the shore power is lost, whether due to an outage, or a problem at the power pedestal, or just in the event the main breaker at the pedestal trips.
It may seem silly, but loosing power and having your Satellite Receiver having to reset and go thru it's acquisition for 15minutes afterwards is sometimes aggravating, but if you leave you Inverter ON, and ready to provide power, a loss of power from the campground is simply then a slight inconvenience, and not an aggravation, since you can continue doing most everything thru the Inverter.


Some Inverters, like the larger ones, also have an integrated Charger, so those RVs will not have a typical Converter, like most others. Since the Inverter and Charger perform the same overall function, and the 12v items run from the batteries anyway, no Converter is then needed.

Actually, at least on my 5th wheel the shore power is routed into and thru the inverter via a breaker in the panel labels fridge/inverter. The inverter has an automatic transfer switch that determined what 120 vac is fed to the fridge. If there is shore power and the inverter is on or off the ac from shore power is routed to fridge. If shore power goes away and inverter is off, no ac to fridge. If shore power goes away and inverter is on then the inverter senses that shore power has gone away and the automatic transfer switch switches to the inverter generated ac produced from the batteries.

There is no direct connection to the fridge as this would cause a conflict if inverter was on and shore power was on.

I did this little sketch awhile back to show the difference inverter scenarios.

[dalford]

Originally Posted by dusty3

Wow. I thought I knew what I needed to know about my RV power distribution system but I don't. As soon as I have made a list of what I have and all of the options available to me in my tiny travel trailer I'll come back and read this thread again. Until then I'll leave the 7 wire cable to the tow vehicle disconnected along with the on board battery. Shore power only and no battery charging.

You missed the whole point of this thread... you must keep your battery charged or you will ruin it. Your RV uses the battery for everything except a/c, microwave, wall outlets, etc. All your lights, igniters for water heater (if on propane), slide motors, vent fans, outside lights and more operate from your battery. So, on shore power make sure your converter is turned on to keep your batteries charged and maintained.

You did not say if you have a residential fridge, if no, then all the inverter discussion does not pertain to you.

Welcome to the forum from Central Florida...

[NXR]

Originally Posted by bubbles

And therein lies the rub because the switch is labeled "BATTERY DISCONNECT".

As usual, "it depends".

Ray

[herkyfe]

Converter charges battery only if it needs it to be charged just like the alternator in a car
If it overcharges the battery then the issue is the converter.

[Rdgillilan]

I think the converter charges the battery not the inverter, I always turn my inverter off when hooked to shore power because the shore power will pass through the inverter to power my fridge automatically. I don’t like the inverter fan running all the time when it’s not needed

[Wishart]

The time I use of battery off switch is when I put the camper away not plugged in. Otherwise when I hook up to go out again the battery is dead. The radio light stays on as does the CO2 monitor. Over time that kills the battery. Otherwise, the switch stays on. When I put the unit away for the winter, the switch is off, and I connect a battery tender.

[NHHorseman]

Turn off the Inverter. It should not be charging your battery(s). The Converter keeps your battery up and simply maintains a charge if the battery doesn't need charging. Keep the converter on all the time.

[dusty3]

NO. alford, I did not miss the point. I now understand completely what I need to know about my "simple system". Right now my batteries get charged only when connected to a running tow vehicle. I have no converter or inverter or even a simple battery charger. Before the next trip out I will resolve the issue with the installation of a "converter charger" from IOTA. With that done the batteries will be under charge whether I am towing or when parked with shore power. This thread has been very informative and an eye opener as to why I have heard so many different explanations.