LiFePO4 battery weight and quality?

[larry2c]

Our TT's GC batteries are getting fairly old so I am looking at moving to LiFePO4 batteries (two 100AH batteries) when I replace them. I see fairly wide ranging prices and I am also seeing a good amount of variation in the weight that the different companies have listed for their batteries. Does heavier equal better? If so, how so? I understand that lead acid batteries do weigh more when they have bigger plates but my knowledge of LiFePO4 batteries leaves me wondering what would be bigger (full disclosure, limited knowledge of the LiFePO4 batteries other than they are made up of a bunch of smaller batteries).

TIA for the enlightenment!

[rk06382]

Originally Posted by larry2c

Our TT's GC batteries are getting fairly old so I am looking at moving to LiFePO4 batteries (two 100AH batteries) when I replace them. I see fairly wide ranging prices and I am also seeing a good amount of variation in the weight that the different companies have listed for their batteries. Does heavier equal better? If so, how so? I understand that lead acid batteries do weigh more when they have bigger plates but my knowledge of LiFePO4 batteries leaves me wondering what would be bigger (full disclosure, limited knowledge of the LiFePO4 batteries other than they are made up of a bunch of smaller batteries).

TIA for the enlightenment!

My Battle Born LiFePO4 batteries have been doing great since 2018.

You can call to ask pre-sales questions. Toll Free: 855-292-2831

[nvs4602]

Yes weight does matter. But unless you know what cells are inside the battery it's hard to say. The only real way for most pre-built batteries is to measure their actual capacity. Most people don't have the knowledge to do this, nor the meters.

A good shunt meter can help you determine the capacity by applying a known load on the battery and seeing how long the battery will run that load.

Example a 100ah battery should run a 10amp load for 10 hours.

Everyone who buys a lifepo4 battery should run this type of capacity test when they get their batteries. Unfortunately there are a lot of bad sellers out there that are selling poor quality products that don't provide the capacity listed. So be careful about who and where you buy from.

[Bertha17]

Instead of 2- 100 Ah batteries, I just installed a 270 Ah Battleborn Gamechanger 3 (GC3), as part of my solar/lithium upgrade and it weighs 80.4 lbs. It is a lot of Ah/lb compared to lead acid for sure. But, it is bulky to manhandle and mount due to its large footprint 22.82"x 7.09"x 13.15". There is so much information to be consumed on LiFePO4 batteries. I received some of my best guidance and support right here in this forum. With it, I was comfortable paying more to go with Battleborn. I am excited to begin the experience. Good luck with your journey!

[PhilFromMaine]

Lifepo4 is lifepo4. Capacities of two 100 AH batteries should be basically the same. What you want to focus on is capacity. Larger capacity batteries weigh more and can be back breakers. I would go with two 100 AH batteries or one 200 AH batteries.

BB gets raves about company support, but you can basically buy two batteries of good quality from other brands for the same price. If money isn't an object, go BB. If it is of importance, go with a lesser recognized brand.

[Boomerweps]

I went from 65# lead acid Marine/RV 100 AH to 23# LiFePO4 100AH with my first battery change. I added a second LiFePO4 in series for a wash on weight savings but quadrupled the useable power (LA can only use 50% capacity to avoid long term damage). They are moved inside, further back off the tongue, protecting them from theft and moving more weight towards the axle (not safe with a gas venting LA battery).
There should not be a huge weight difference between similar capacity LiFePO4 batteries. Heavier case, added BMS components.
You do pay more for better BMS. Low temp charging cutoff in battery, Bluetooth monitoring, ect. My first battery has that. The second is a bottom line Chin WalMart special at a price I couldn’t pass up ($266) that I’ll have to remove or disconnect in winter.

[BehindBars]

Like PhilFromMaine suggested, you can pay a lot less than BattleBorn for the same capacity. For my trailer I bought a lesser known but still popular brand 100 AH off eBay for less than half the BB price. The battery is working well. I simply could not justify the BB pricing. When I need to replace my motorhome batteries, I’ll need to go with a single 200 AH rather than 2 separate 100 AH units due to overall battery box sizing constraints.

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by PhilFromMaine

Lifepo4 is lifepo4. Capacities of two 100 AH batteries should be basically the same. What you want to focus on is capacity. Larger capacity batteries weigh more and can be back breakers. I would go with two 100 AH batteries or one 200 AH batteries.

BB gets raves about company support, but you can basically buy two batteries of good quality from other brands for the same price. If money isn't an object, go BB. If it is of importance, go with a lesser recognized brand.

Another reason to consider two lifepo4 batteries vs one is the ability to deliver high current levels without the BMS shutting things down. Each BMS in single 100 ah batteries will deliver 100 amps times number of batteries.

Larger capacity single batteries can have a BMS that is capable of delivering current rate only a fraction of it's size.

Two 100 ah batteries can usually deliver 200 amps while often 200ah batteries only deliver less, ranging from only 100 amps to around 150 amps.

Not an issue if only powering lights, water pump, furnace, etc. Could be a problem if trying to feed a 3000w inverter.

When selecting a lifepo4 battery first forget all you learned about Lead/Acid batteries. Heavier does not mean better. Pay more attention to company offering the batteries, number of cycles they claim, and performance specs which often indicate the quality of the BMS. Things like temp protection with high and low temp cutoff, high and low voltage cutoff, high current shutoff and "short protection".

As for prices? Just remember that Quality costs.

[Aussieguy]

if you are handy person

look at the DIY build your own battery from 3.2 cells
can save you about 1/3 the price plus you will understand and be able to replace components or cells


not hard to do if you are able to follow instructions
lots of youtube videos


google DIY lifepo4 battery https://www.google.com/search?client...battery+for+RV



plus watch this guy
https://www.youtube.com/@OffGridGarageAustralia

[Chuck_S]

LiPo is indisputably a better technology but so what?

If your current battery configuration is meeting your needs why go to the expense and hassle of changing battery technology. A pair of GC2 6v batteries will just drop into your battery boxes in a few minutes.

-- Chuck

[larry2c]

Thanks all, I appreciate the insight!

Regarding the "why switch from LA batteries" - I would like to gain the added usable capacity without added weight. And as some have mentioned, I can move the LiFePO4 batteries into my pass through area which gets them out of sight out of mind.

[GravelRider]

Originally Posted by PhilFromMaine

Lifepo4 is lifepo4. Capacities of two 100 AH batteries should be basically the same. What you want to focus on is capacity. Larger capacity batteries weigh more and can be back breakers. I would go with two 100 AH batteries or one 200 AH batteries.

BB gets raves about company support, but you can basically buy two batteries of good quality from other brands for the same price. If money isn't an object, go BB. If it is of importance, go with a lesser recognized brand.

What are reputable battery brands that go for half the price of BB?

I just bought a 100 Ah lithium battery on Amazon for $300 https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...e?ie=UTF8&th=1

Complete garbage. Actual capacity is just under 10 Ah in my real world usage. I'm returning it, and am looking for an alternative. I may actually just stick with LA. It's for my off-grid apiary electric fence, not RV-related.

[IPcamper]

Last year I bought a pair of ADCBatt 100Ah LiFePO4 batteries from Amazon. The price was $700 for the 2 batteries. LithiumSolar YouTube channel did a review and tear down of these batteries.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpz0F3DTuww

The reviewer concluded that they were fine. Not the best he had reviewed, but Ok. So far for me they have worked just fine.

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by Aussieguy

if you are handy person

look at the DIY build your own battery from 3.2 cells
can save you about 1/3 the price plus you will understand and be able to replace components or cells


not hard to do if you are able to follow instructions
lots of youtube videos


google DIY lifepo4 battery https://www.google.com/search?client...battery+for+RV



plus watch this guy
https://www.youtube.com/@OffGridGarageAustralia

Did the cells you said you ordered ever show up. If so, how did your DIY battery turn out?

[PhilFromMaine]

Originally Posted by GravelRider

What are reputable battery brands that go for half the price of BB?

I just bought a 100 Ah lithium battery on Amazon for $300 https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...e?ie=UTF8&th=1

Complete garbage. Actual capacity is just under 10 Ah in my real world usage. I'm returning it, and am looking for an alternative. I may actually just stick with LA. It's for my off-grid apiary electric fence, not RV-related.

At face value, you obviously got a bad battery. 300 dollars is closer to 1/3 the cost of a BB. I doubt it really has low temp protection like they claim. Did you contact the seller and what did they say?

I agree with you about what you said about staying with LA. There is certainly a lot less care needed with LA and they can be replaced easily. To use lifepo4 as a plug and play as you would a LA is a mistake if you are looking for longevity in a lifepo4 battery.

Did you do any testing of the output in terms of amperage? I know nothing about the bee fence. How much current does it draw and is there any possibility that there is an issue with the fence being "grounded out" and draining the battery?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30Ha...withWillProwse

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by GravelRider

What are reputable battery brands that go for half the price of BB?



I just bought a 100 Ah lithium battery on Amazon for $300 https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...e?ie=UTF8&th=1



Complete garbage. Actual capacity is just under 10 Ah in my real world usage. I'm returning it, and am looking for an alternative. I may actually just stick with LA. It's for my off-grid apiary electric fence, not RV-related.

What are the spec's for your fence charger. Most, although they put out a very high voltage (pulse) their actual consumed wattage is down in the 30-50 watts per day.

That's around 4 amp hours per day or roughly 3 weeks per charge.

Are you sure the battery was fully charged to 14.2-14.6 volts before put in service. Takes over 14v to effectively balance cells. Many conventional battery chargers top out in thev13.5-13.8v range. May charge but with LiFePo4 batteries any unbalance in cells limits battery capacity to that of the lowest cell.

FWIW I see a lot of solar powered fence chargers in use on my travels by the various orchards in WA, OR, and CA. Seams practical to me.

[GravelRider]

Originally Posted by PhilFromMaine

At face value, you obviously got a bad battery. 300 dollars is closer to 1/3 the cost of a BB. I doubt it really has low temp protection like they claim. Did you contact the seller and what did they say?

I agree with you about what you said about staying with LA. There is certainly a lot less care needed with LA and they can be replaced easily. To use lifepo4 as a plug and play as you would a LA is a mistake if you are looking for longevity in a lifepo4 battery.

Did you do any testing of the output in terms of amperage? I know nothing about the bee fence. How much current does it draw and is there any possibility that there is an issue with the fence being "grounded out" and draining the battery?

I based my estimates on expected amperage of the fence charger, which should last between 2-4 weeks, depending on conditions (weeds, etc. that could ground it out). Mine was lasting about 36-48 hours. A LA garden tractor battery outlasted the 100 Ah lithium. Something clearly was off.

[GravelRider]

Originally Posted by TitanMike

What are the spec's for your fence charger. Most, although they put out a very high voltage (pulse) their actual consumed wattage is down in the 30-50 watts per day.

That's around 4 amp hours per day or roughly 3 weeks per charge.

Are you sure the battery was fully charged to 14.2-14.6 volts before put in service. Takes over 14v to effectively balance cells. Many conventional battery chargers top out in thev13.5-13.8v range. May charge but with LiFePo4 batteries any unbalance in cells limits battery capacity to that of the lowest cell.

FWIW I see a lot of solar powered fence chargers in use on my travels by the various orchards in WA, OR, and CA. Seams practical to me.

Here is the link to the charger I have. https://cyclopsfence.com/collections...ered-energizer

It's WAY overpowered, as a 5 joule charger can power up to 100 miles of fence line (in ideal conditions, less in actual use). With my five strands, it's about 500 linear feet. However, bees are an expensive investment that can get destroyed in one night by a hungry black bear.

The battery was fully charged, and charged by lithium-specific battery charger. Unfortunately, pinching pennies just didn't pay off this time. I do think I'll go with LA, as I don't have any weight concerns, and I would like to keep it charged year round (not that I have to worry about bears in the winter).

[PhilFromMaine]

Originally Posted by GravelRider

Here is the link to the charger I have. https://cyclopsfence.com/collections...ered-energizer

It's WAY overpowered, as a 5 joule charger can power up to 100 miles of fence line (in ideal conditions, less in actual use). With my five strands, it's about 500 linear feet. However, bees are an expensive investment that can get destroyed in one night by a hungry black bear.

The battery was fully charged, and charged by lithium-specific battery charger. Unfortunately, pinching pennies just didn't pay off this time. I do think I'll go with LA, as I don't have any weight concerns, and I would like to keep it charged year round (not that I have to worry about bears in the winter).

Thanks for the reply. You don't by chance have a clamp meter do you? It would be interesting to see just how much current was being pulled by the fence charger.

[chriscowles]

Originally Posted by GravelRider

What are reputable battery brands that go for half the price of BB?
...

I and others are very satisfied with SOK batteries. You can find information here: https://www.us.sokbattery.com/
and here: https://m.facebook.com/groups/sokbattery/

They're made in China with a shipping facility in the US and, I believe, a US distributor. I got excellent customer service from them before they got their US operations running. I would not hesitate to buy from them again.