Our Solar/Inverter system install

[mikakuja]

Finally got around to starting our solar system install today. Was going to spend the time to video everything but only took pictures, so that will have to do..

This is the first stage of the install.

Our system currently consists of a single 200w Carmanah (Go Power) mono panel with a 30A Go Power PWM controller. We will be installing 2 more 100w panels at a later date, just haven't purchased them yet.

[mikakuja]

more install pics.

[mikakuja]

And yet some more pics.....

[mikakuja]

And the last of the pics for today's part of the install.
Solar is up and running finally.....
Next step will be the Go Power transfer switch along with all of the associated wiring for the inverter.

[PSU Turf]

Is your output from the charge controller going directly to fuse panel? Looks like you added the wire to the same terminal that receives power from the battery. What gauge wire did you use? Did you upsize the wire from the fuse panel to the battery?

I like your mounting location. I wish I had a place available inside my trailer to mount the controller / battery monitor. My Bogart and Trimetric are in a box adjacent to the batteries. Looking froward to seeing your transfer switch install.

[ScottBrownstein]

Originally Posted by PSU Turf

... Did you upsize the wire from the fuse panel to the battery?

Don't we wish that the charge controller was trying to put too much amperage back into the batteries so that the connection needed to be upsized! Solar charging currents are generally less than 20 amps and the conductor is sized for a lot more to feed the distribution panel. In addition, my Bogart SC2030 ups the voltage until it gets the voltage it wants ON THE BATTERY POSTS via the remote sense from the Trimetric. Usually there is too much voltage in a solar solution anyway, so lower amperage and higher voltage range than a normal converter can muster makes that unnecessary for a good solar controller.

[Skyliner]

Your install efforts are admirable but I disagree with the distance that the power output from the controller has to travel to get to the batteries.

You are throwing away valuable solar power by using stock wire from power panel to battery but you can justify it to yourself all day cuz no body likes to be told that their baby is ugly.

Folks who are looking to this thread for ideas should not follow this install. Solar controller should be located within several feet of batteries. VOltage losses should be less than 3% but less is better.

[mikakuja]

Skyliner, I guess my baby is ugly and I'm ok with that, ugly babies need love too.
At one point in time I would have agreed with you 100% but this is now my fourth system (all of which started out at 200w), and the losses you speak of are so minimal between the controller and the batteries that I honestly couldn't be bothered to wire a dedicated short run.
I have personally wired systems both direct and as short a distance as possible to the batteries and also exactly as I have shown in this install, and have noticed next to no difference in how each system operated. I am not saying that a dedicated short run isn't worth it for some (especially if you are a milliamp hunter), it's just not worth it to me. If you choose to disagree with me, that's fine, to each their own.

As always, to those watching my install, do your own research and make your own decisions based on facts, don't take my word for it. My opinions are based my own personal experience and real world use.

[ScottBrownstein]

Originally Posted by Skyliner

...You are throwing away valuable solar power by using stock wire from power panel to battery but you can justify it to yourself all day cuz nobody likes to be told that their baby is ugly...

I have heard advertisements that "silver is the new oil," but frankly, on this forum when concerning solar, converters and inverters, it clearly should be copper is the new oil!

For a 200 watt or even 400 watt system, his baby isn't ugly! You have to be practical when sizing conductors. Frankly, the best investment that he (or FR for that matter) could make is upsizing the battery to distribution/converter panel wire size. On my unit, the distance from converter to battery bank runs over 22 feet of #8 copper. Dropping that to #4 (or #6?) and using the chassis as the ground would have been a much better solution for everything.

But...pulling #6 wires through a completed unit is not really practical.

His solar charge currents will never exceed 18 amps or so and that is a lot less than his poor converter (which is also in the panel) is trying to push down that wire! As I have already said ad nauseum, I like Bogart SC2030/TM2030 solutions since they let you totally ignore the feed run length since the solar charge converter knows the voltage AT THE BATTERY, and automatically adjusts for voltage drop in the feed circuit. We are talking about how much energy ends up in the batteries here and voltage is the variable. Remember, we are talking about PWM systems, so the charge converter is almost always throwing away voltage anyway and has plenty at its disposal to compensate for the voltage drop between it and the battery bank. Wish that my 60 amp PD converter would listen to the Trimetric's remote sense for determining it's output voltage because at 60 amps, 22 feet of copper is costing me generator time to charge when there isn't enough sun.

But that aside. Nice installation. Pretty baby, smart father!

BTW, where did you get that square, 6x6 solar panel? I can't find any like it and certainly not at 200 watts, even in Canada!

[Rich.M]

Clever idea wiring into the 12 volt fuse box. Definitely saves a lot of install effort and wiring. The wiring to the fuse block is large gauge and should work well.

Very clean install. I know the Bogart sc2030/tm2030 are electrical engineering perfection but asthetically they look like they belong on a 1970 Apollo capsule. I like your choice, better on the RV wall. Besides with your plan of 200 more watts there will be plenty of power for small wiring losses and you don't have to micromanage power use due to a residential fridge constantly bleeding your system.

[ScottBrownstein]

Right, don't know what's up with that funky install using a white, PVC surface box. I installed mine by the entry steps. Just the panel itself, flush into the plywood bulkhead, like the other panels and switches. So all I am left with is the esoterics of the panel itself. Maybe should have onge for the white version.

[mdstudey]

Did you run wires through the refer vent of under it? Or did you pull a cap of the refer vent went through refer vent and reinstall cap. I am a real newbie at this solar thing and I am trying to learn as much as possible. I am sure my first install is going to be a real ugly baby. Thanks

[mikakuja]

ScottBrownstein, The 200w panel is a bit of an oddball. I had the system negotiated into the sale when I bought the trailer and assumed it was going to be 2 100w panels, was a bit surprised to find a single 200w when I opened up the box. I called GoPower looking to purchase a 2nd panel and apparently they do not sell them to the general public, it is a dealer item only. The closest I could find were 12v 195w panels on Ebay. Not sure if I will go with one of those or 2 100w panels.

Speaking of the converter, the WFCO included is a bit of a clinker and I am already not happy with it. I will probably replace it with a Progressive Dynamics PD4560CSV Inteli-Power 4500 Series 60 Amp Converter, any opinions on that?

[mikakuja]

Originally Posted by mdstudey

Did you run wires through the refer vent of under it? Or did you pull a cap of the refer vent went through refer vent and reinstall cap. I am a real newbie at this solar thing and I am trying to learn as much as possible. I am sure my first install is going to be a real ugly baby. Thanks

I pulled the cap off the refer vent, drilled two holes to pull the 10ga wire through, then re-installed the cap and re-sealed the mounting screws with Proflex.

[ScottBrownstein]

Originally Posted by mikakuja

...the WFCO included is a bit of a clinker and I am already not happy with it. I will probably replace it with a Progressive Dynamics PD4560CSV Inteli-Power 4500 Series 60 Amp Converter, any opinions on that?

Have had PD Converters for years and they are made in the US and sort of the industry standard. You don't need to replace the whole panel since PD sells a 4600 that will replace only the converter section and is compatible with your WFCO panel. Biggest they have is 55 amps, but you have a 30 amp panel so that should do it. Frankly, my 70 amp PD isn't worth it either since I never see anything close to 70 amps.

[KMP44]

Originally Posted by mikakuja

Speaking of the converter, the WFCO included is a bit of a clinker and I am already not happy with it. I will probably replace it with a Progressive Dynamics PD4560CSV Inteli-Power 4500 Series 60 Amp Converter, any opinions on that?

I replaced mine last fall with a PD. Super easy upgrade and well worth it in my opinion. Just bought 2 new Trojan batteries and wanted to protect that investment. With the WFCO I never saw the voltage change from 13.8 volts when plugged in - ever. Now, with the PD converter, it goes into bulk mode at a little over 14 volts when first plugging in, then drops to 13.7, and when just in storage it drops to 13.3. Plus the PD has a desulifantion mode. $199 at BestConverter.com with free shipping and no sales tax. Not sure if that would be the case for you folks north of the border though.

And nice system by the way - nothing ugly about that. Neat, clean looking install. Bigger, shorter wires are nice in theory, as are higher end controllers - but in practicality, you can get good results without going to extremes, especially if all you need is to charge your batteries for a couple days of dry camping. Adding more battery capacity and/or another panel can make up for an awful lot of less than text book perfect wiring. Every rv is different and everybody's needs are different - there are lots of ways to get a functional solution.

[mikakuja]

Some progress pic's on the inverter and transfer switch install. Sorry, I got a little involved when wiring the transfer switch and completely forgot to take pics of that.
Basically what I did there was as follows.
I disconnected the shore power and the converter charger from the main fuse panel and re-directed both to the main power input on the transfer switch. I then ran a new length of 30A cord from the power output on the transfer switch back to the main fuse in the control panel. Next was the Generator input (in my case inverter input) on the transfer switch.
Not shown in these pics is a stand alone 15A breaker between the transfer switch and the converter charger. I will get to that at a later date.
I was able to tuck the transfer switch neatly between the furnace and the power distribution center without much issue at all.... Just had to be a bit of a contortionist to get my drill in there to screw it to the floor.

First pics are of the inverter wiring from the front pass through along the frame rail to the underside of the refrigerator where the control center is.

[mikakuja]

Next is the transfer switch mounted in between the distribution center and furnace. Sorry about the lack of pics......

[mikakuja]

Everything back together on the inside.
Inverter mounted in the pass through. The panel in the pass through was removed to install backing for the inverter.
I will be installing some sort of cover in front of the inverter to prevent things from sitting against it, but that will be for another day off project.

[mikakuja]

last two for now. Just have to connect the inverter to the batteries and install the remote power switch, then seal all of the holes.