Replacing 12 volt battery

[NMWildcat]

Originally Posted by carlson

With all this discussion on batteries, is it worth installing some type of battery monitoring system; Victron, etc., and / or multi-stage convertor? I'm not sure what type of convertor was original to my 2013 Rockwood, I'll have to do some research.

Your 2013 will have a three stage charger. Most likely a WFCO. If you don't rely on your battery for boondocking often, no need for a monitor. A multimeter will suffice if you really need more precise info than your four light battery indicator.
But if you plan to start boondocking, you can spend as much or as little on equipment as you find necessary
Mostly of us start out with standard OEM equipment and upgrade as we learn what we actually need or want.

[camaraderie]

Originally Posted by carlson

With all this discussion on batteries, is it worth installing some type of battery monitoring system; Victron, etc., and / or multi-stage convertor? I'm not sure what type of convertor was original to my 2013 Rockwood, I'll have to do some research.

You only need a battery MONITOR with Shunt like the Victron or Trimetric if you boondock without electricity for more than an occasional overnite at Walmart!
A simple $10 voltmeter will suffice to let you know your converter is working and what stage of charging you are in (Bulk, absorb or float).
As to a multistage charger...IF you boondock...it is also a must for charging FAST and properly maintaining your battery when plugged in. If you always stay plugged in and are using cheap batteries...then I'd say...just get a multistage when the non-multistage dies.

[5picker]

Originally Posted by NMWildcat

Your 2013 will have a three stage charger. Most likely a WFCO. If you don't rely on your battery for boondocking often, no need for a monitor. A multimeter will suffice if you really need more precise info than your four light battery indicator.
But if you plan to start boondocking, you can spend as much or as little on equipment as you find necessary
Mostly of us start out with standard OEM equipment and upgrade as we learn what we actually need or want.

Originally Posted by camaraderie

You only need a battery MONITOR with Shunt like the Victron or Trimetric if you boondock without electricity for more than an occasional overnite at Walmart!
A simple $10 voltmeter will suffice to let you know your converter is working and what stage of charging you are in (Bulk, absorb or float).
As to a multistage charger...IF you boondock...it is also a must for charging FAST and properly maintaining your battery when plugged in. If you always stay plugged in and are using cheap batteries...then I'd say...just get a multistage when the non-multistage dies.

Even though neither of the above posts are very long... there is an abundance of VERY GOOD information in them.

Read them if you haven't... read them again if you have!

[babock]

The problem with saying a battery lasts 7 years is that the OP's 7 year old battery had 0% capacity at that 7 year point. If you bought a 90AH battery new and you use 50% of its capacity, you have 45 AH usable when its new. Assuming that 7 year old battery loses its capacity linearly, that means at the 3 1/2 year point that 90AH battery is really a 45AH battery. Personally, I couldn't camp with a 45AH capacity battery(50% would be 22.5AH) so that battery would have been replaced long before 3 1/2 years.



You have to take with a grain of salt when someone says they get 7 years out of batteries. Not sure saying that a battery that can barely get you through the night running your heater blower is still a good battery. That's why, it's often worth the money to get a true deep discharge battery to begin with..for example a Trojan or other TRUE deep discharge battery.

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by babock

The problem with saying a battery lasts 7 years is that the OP's 7 year old battery had 0% capacity at that 7 year point. If you bought a 90AH battery new and you use 50% of its capacity, you have 45 AH usable when its new. Assuming that 7 year old battery loses its capacity linearly, that means at the 3 1/2 year point that 90AH battery is really a 45AH battery. Personally, I couldn't camp with a 45AH capacity battery(50% would be 22.5AH) so that battery would have been replaced long before 3 1/2 years.



You have to take with a grain of salt when someone says they get 7 years out of batteries. Not sure saying that a battery that can barely get you through the night running your heater blower is still a good battery. That's why, it's often worth the money to get a true deep discharge battery to begin with..for example a Trojan or other TRUE deep discharge battery.

If people take this analysis to heart, that they really should be replacing batteries more often, the comparison between FLA batteries and "Lithium" is a lot closer cost wise.

[NMWildcat]

Originally Posted by TitanMike

If people take this analysis to heart, that they really should be replacing batteries more often, the comparison between FLA batteries and "Lithium" is a lot closer cost wise.

Well, I have to admit you are passionate on this subject
My Interstate series 27 marine deep cells do what I need them to do for about five years. They cost me around $100. So even if they were $125, that's $25 a year.

Lithiums are about $1000. Most are guaranteed for 10 years, so that's $100 a year. Some suggest (highly unlikely) they will last 20 years, that's still $50 a year.

[rsdata]

I don't boondock and my camper is plugged in nearly 100% of the time. The only time it is not plugged into 120 VAC is when it is being towed, or being hooked to the TV or unhooked to the TV, and then the electric jack is used. My 2014 camper purchased in May of 2014 was brought home with the original group 24 battery. That battery went into a tractor that needed a battery and a Group 27 Interstate Marine/RV from Costco went in. So my trailer battery is to be 6 years old this month.

In the eastern half of the country there are not that many opportunities to boondock, and actually I do not even care to look for that type of camping spots. This 6 year old battery does the job that is asked of it ( as recently as mid- February) and I'm not sure when I will have to replace it at this point. I'm sure it will fail within the next few years and I will replace it with the same battery at nearly twice what I paid in 2014.

Telling everyone with a battery question that they need two 6 volt golf cart, or a TRUE deep cycle is like telling everyone that tows a trailer they need a diesel dually to be adequate when towing.

Forty posts ago the OP said

Pretty much straight campground camping and almost always plugged in to 30 amp service so no boondocking for me at present.

so I'm not sure that all this posting about battery options, etc. the OP should be considering is really helping much.

IMO...
I understand posters wanting to debate their points of view, but sometimes it seems threads get hi-jacked just so someone can post a point of view un-related to the original question in the thread.

[slomotion]

[QUOTE=carlson;2318320]I am due to replace the 12 volt battery that came with my 2013 Rockwood. The dealer installed battery was an Interstate HD24-DP RV/Marine but I don't believe the new battery need have cranking capacity and I am looking for a deep cycle 12 volt in either the 24 or 27 group as I have the room in the battery holder. Any suggestions? The interstate has served me well but it is now 7 years old and charging it only gets it to low no matter how long I charge it. Thank you.

Ever thought of buying a solar charger? I have one & it makes boo so long possible. I have 2 batteries but even then it’s not always enough, which is why a solar charger makes sense.

[slomotion]

Even tho I’ve 2 batteries I use a solar charger when boondocking. With the coronavirus impacting activities all summer, boondocking on BLM & other Fed land may be the way to go. If you stay at one place for 3+ days two batteries may not be enough unless they can be recharged routinely.

[boatnut]

I just replaced two deep cycle/starting lead acid batteries by exide with Duracell AGM marine/rv deep cycle batteries from Sam's. For two with tax they were approx. A$250.

I'm a big fan of AGM as no worries about checking water levels.

[sunnyinfla]

I use walmart batterys,mine 7 yrs old now and still are good,these battery's are made by johnson controls...an american co..

[wabakami]

Originally Posted by jvalich

Single Battleborn battery, 12 v, 100 AH No maintenance required. 3000 - 5000 cycles, can use ALL 100 AH if needed, 10 yr warranty. Plus weigh in at ~ 30 lbs compared to ~130 lbs of 2 gc2 batteries.

2 Trojan T105 gc2 batteries at $400 each together in series get you your 12 v and all the deficiencies of a flooded battery.

Put 2 in my coach this last week. One came with a small crack in the case, called battleborn Customer Service and they had a new battery to replace it overnighted to me in Fla, 12 hrs Turn around. Just amazing customer service

https://battlebornbatteries.com/

Curious as to where you get/buy your 6volt T105 golf cart batteries. Two of our nine golf carts are older 36v models, we get 5 to 6 years out of each set of batteries, last September, here in Canada, I paid $125cdn per 6v battery (6 in total, $750cdn), I replaced a set of 8v at the same time, they were $140cdn each.

Generally things are a little cheaper in the US than Canada. If they are gouging you that much then anyone looking for batteries should shop around or visit Canada to buy them if they're that much more stateside!



Geoff
.

[rsdata]

Geoff,
you might want to start importing some of those batteries down from up north. It seems as if lead-acid battery prices has been on a steady price increase for the last 6-8 years. I know that a number of our domestic lead mines were closed down due to environmental concerns over the last 10 years or so and I believe that the cost of the raw materials is getting ridiculous for a common raw material.

Retail T105 prices I just searched were at a low of $129 to a high of $190 of course plus shipping and core charge. It seemed many were in the $150-160 range.

[wabakami]

Originally Posted by rsdata

If you are referring to using 2 6 volt batteries in series, you need to add a short cable to tie the two batteries together...

Just a side note on this drawing, this is aimed at newbies or anyone else not too familiar with batteries.

This drawing actually shows 12 volt batteries, not 6 volt regardless of what is written on them. Any battery with 6 filler caps is a 12 volt model, if you use 2 six volt batteries then they will have 3 (three) filler caps each on them.

Again this is just being mentioned for all the newer RVers and anyone else who may not be aware of the difference; it is not aimed at all the rest of the longtime knowledgeable boys and girls out there who would know the difference.

Anyone accidentally wiring two 12 volt batteries together in series would at the least blow some fuses, we won't even think about the worst case scenario!

In case you do wish to use 12v units, then they are wired in parallel, neg (-) to neg (-), positive (+) to positive (+).



Stay safe,

Geoff (an anal master electrician who worries too much)
.

[wabakami]

Originally Posted by rsdata

Geoff,
you might want to start importing some of those batteries down from up north. It seems as if lead-acid battery prices has been on a steady price increase for the last 6-8 years. I know that a number of our domestic lead mines were closed down due to environmental concerns over the last 10 years or so and I believe that the cost of the raw materials is getting ridiculous for a common raw material.

Retail T105 prices I just searched were at a low of $129 to a high of $190 of course plus shipping and core charge. It seemed many were in the $150-160 range.

Hi,

Yeah, it would be a money maker except for the costs of hauling the weight down to you!

Our core charges currently are $25 per unit which would be on top of our prices.

I've just put in an order for a new Club Car Carryall 300, we use them for bellman carts, and ordered 6 new 8 volters for a 5 yr old cart but didn't see the price of the batteries yet.



I commented on your drawing showing 6 volts, just a little worried new people will look at the picture and match the battery to the wrong voltage.

Good drawing, just wrong number of caps!



Geoff
.

[camaraderie]

Originally Posted by sunnyinfla

I use walmart batterys,mine 7 yrs old now and still are good,these battery's are made by johnson controls...an american co..

Johnson Controls SOLD it's battery business to an investment group and the new name of the battery company is

Clarios.
Not clear to me yet what direction the company will take and if they will continue with all of their private label customers into the future...but Johnson no longer makes ANY batteries. Clarios has 3 plants in China so it is no longer an all american battery, though there are plants here too. Check your labels!

[rsdata]

I doubt people purchase batteries based on the number of caps on the top... most only have one single cap per 3 cells anyway.
But very observant on your part.

I about fell over when replacing my '14 RAM battery two years ago... $179 retail... nothing special, about the battery but the cost amazed me. And I am not talking dealership price...

Group 27 RV/Marine dual purpose were $89 at Costco last week. Best deal I have seen on a general purpose battery. I have one in the trailer and two in my boat.

[rsdata]

I follow and subscribe to this youtube channel... Project Farm

This guy does some serious testing of things that we all use. It is typically enlightening his results of the tests.

Here is a video he did of car starting battery tests...

https://youtu.be/h7rTcBanpMk

[camaraderie]

Geoff...your price of $400 ea for a Trojan wet cell T105 is not realistic.
I can get a PAIR for 270 today... and I prolly could do better if I shopped around.

You made the point that you can get 3000 cycles or more for that 1000 bucks and that is true. Now lets say you use 50% capacity of your 100 amp battery EVERY time you camp out...so you'll be able to count on your batteries for 3000 nites of camping...10 years or so of FULL TIME LIVING for $1000.
Now lets say we can get 1000 cycles to 50% out of a pair of Trojan T105's.
That translates to 3.5 years of full time living for $270...so it will take about $800 bucks to live 10 years with T105's...but then you don't have all the advantages of lithium...as you point out with weight and charge acceptance.
SO...if the claims are true AND you plan to live aboard full time for the next 10 years...a Battleborn makes sense in many ways. That's a BIG IF in my opinion based on the failure rates I'm hearing about drop in LifePos (not brand specific). But setting that aside....



Using the same numbers...lets suppose you have a house and a life and you are a very active camper going out for 100 nites of BOONDOCK camping a year.
Well than than T105 pair for $270 bucks will get you 10 years of camping under the stars. Battleborns will get ya 30. What makes more sense?

[rsdata]

Geoff...your price of $400 ea for a Trojan wet cell T105 is not realistic.

Don't call out Geoff...

this is the original post... post #20 I believe

Originally Posted by jvalich View Post
Single Battleborn battery, 12 v, 100 AH No maintenance required. 3000 - 5000 cycles, can use ALL 100 AH if needed, 10 yr warranty. Plus weigh in at ~ 30 lbs compared to ~130 lbs of 2 gc2 batteries.

2 Trojan T105 gc2 batteries at $400 each together in series get you your 12 v and all the deficiencies of a flooded battery.